Re: Toyota Throttle Electronics Easily Confused

> The floor mats and sticking pedal accounts for only 30% of the

>> problems. The true cause of sudden acceleration is still not known so >> no real solution is possible. IMO it's the electronics. > > "in your opinion"? are you a software engineer? are you an electrical > engineer? are you /any/ form of engineer?

He can swap a hard drive while blindfolded, and he knows some geologists.

Reply to
JoeSpareBedroom
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Look again. You're talking about the wrong person.

Gee, you've NEVER been wrong before!!!

Reply to
Hachiroku

Oops.

Reply to
JoeSpareBedroom

That's OK. You'll get me next time...

Reply to
Hachiroku

Reply to
Mr Ed

Right. There will be no problem with your gas pedal binding up due to corrosion.

The reported problem is that the area around the spring corrodes, and keeps the spring from returning the pedal to idle position. The shim keeps the spring from binding.

Since your pedal was sourced from Japan, and not CTS in the US, it does not have this problem.

But here's a hint: turn your cruise control OFF when you're not using it. OFF, not just Cancel, or hitting the brakes. OFF.

Reply to
Hachiroku

Steve Wozniak says his prius has problems, he said he thinks it is software. Oh course you heard of Wozniak.

Toyota knows whats wrong, you wouldnt want them to shoot themselves in the foot by telling us, would you.

They wont even let the boxes that record the accidents be independantly taken and analyzed.

And the CEO today said he didnt know what was in the memo about beating NHTSA and saving millions, because it was in english or some other bull shit reason.

Reply to
ransley

Made in Japan only applies to the accelerator fix. If it is a software problem, all bets are off. Could be in cars no matter where made since they do noit know the cause. How can they say which cars are not affected?

Vito

Reply to
Uncle_vito

dude, it it were a software problem, /all/ their vehicles would be exhibiting the exact same problem all the time. that may be a hard concept for a paid congressional "witness" to grasp, but it's a logical test you can apply and understand easily.

Reply to
jim beam

Not really. But if you're desperate to appear correct, you can continue to believe that.

Reply to
JoeSpareBedroom

So you believe that they use exactly the same software build in every vehicle?

ROTFL!!!

Reply to
Steve

As I understand the explanation, the problem with the CTS pedal assemblies is not "corrosion." It is moisture condensing on the plastic components. This changes the frictional characteristics of the assembly (possibly becasue they are using some form of nylon which absorbs moisture and swells). One thing that did catch my eye was the fact that both sides of the assembly used the same plastic material. I was taught this is a no-no when designing bearings (rotational and linear). When you use two identical plastics on opposite sides of the same frictional assembly, there is a tendency for the two plastics to "stick" together with age. I have a chart (a very old chart now) from Machine Design that lists compatible plastics for these type of assemblies. They never recommend using the same plastic on both sides of such an assembly. It seems to me as these pedal assemblies wear, the plastic surfaces become very smooth, and therefore even more likely to stick becasue of the plastic "compatibility." If the parts are nylon, moisture would likely make the problem worse. Adding the metal shims, would fix this, since plastic sliding friction on hard metal surfaces is much more predictable that plastic on plastic.

This is not the explantion I read. The shims actually change the frictional surfaces from plastic on plastic to plastic on steel. The original plastic on plastic rubbing acted as a damper / drag to give good pedal feel. I don't beleive the problem was related to corrosion at all (see above). There are interesting pictures at:

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Are you sure this is true? I haven't been able to find a decent description of the Denso pedal assembly. Are you sure it is that much different? Got a link to pictures?

Since most current cruise controls (and by most I am including manufacturers other than Toyota) use soft switches (i.e., switches that send a signal, they don't actually disconnect the circuit), I doubt if this makes any difference. Both "cancel" and "off" just send a signal to the computer telling the computer to initiate a function. Off is just a different signal than cancel. In the old days "off" actually cut the power to the cruise control. Now for many autos, off only means, "don't pay attention to other cruice control inputs." Ford got tired of people blaming the cruise controls for UA, so they added the stupid brake line switch to physically cut power to the cruise control actuator when the brakes were pressed. And then this screwed up. Fix a bug, add a bug.... I'd be tempted to go back to vaccum operated cruise controls!

Ed

Reply to
C. E. White

In message , Uncle_vito writes

I live in England and I have had a recall for my car which was made in Nottingham England, I understand mot of the parts are locally sourced so that implies that the design is faulty.

Reply to
Clive

I believe the accelerators for Europe were sourced from CTS as well.

Reply to
Hachiroku

I don't get where he said that. A lot of people are pointing to the electronics, but since the affliction spans a lot of models, electronics seems out of the picture.

Reply to
Hachiroku

Interesting post. That's what I get for listening to NBC News.

No, I don't have any pix, but the Denso pedals don't seem to have the problem

They were inefficient, but when you went below ~30MPH, they lost their 'memory' and had to be reset to work .

Reply to
Hachiroku

here are some good technical videos

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Reply to
Toyota

I heard the same sort of thing, and believe they said the Nipponese pedals had metal instead of plastic. Should be able to google it.

Reply to
hls

When it gets warm, I'll have a look at my Scion...

Reply to
Hachiroku

I am not an expert on software, but it seems to me that the basic programing modules would be similar across the product lines. I am sure there are variations in response parameters, but I would guess that the basic processing strategy would be the same across the product lines. I am sure it probably evolves over time, but I would be suprised if all of the vehicles with electronically controlled throttles didn't share the same basic programming. I have a couple of Toyotas repair manuals, and the electronic throttle control sections are virtually indentical (2.4L I4, and 3.0L V6).

Ed

Reply to
C. E. White

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