Toyota quality

Yeah, but you're probably comparing Alfas and BMW's. Jap cars certainly don't command the snob appeal that the europeons do. Only nuts like me drool over 1971 Datsun Pickups and pass our noses at a '74 2002! (wish I had ny college roomate's '74...had to get rid of it...he couldn't afford to reapir it, and it was only 3 years old!)

What did the '71 Celica have? It was basically a Corona with a sporty body. The Mark II was a cool car if you liked them.

The exceptions are the FJ40's and 60's. Decent examples are selling for $3500 and up (well up!)

But hey, I go gaga over geeky looking girls, too....

I drool over old Japanese gear - and it's still around down here! You poor bastards didn't get much of it, but we've had Japanese cars for a few aeons now... mostly because it's a tad easier to import a RHD car into a RHD country than into an LHD country like the US.

Looking at a BMW doesn't do it for me, but things like RX-3s, TA22s... it all does it for me. Especially AE86s... mmmm.

And Japanese car shows are getting more common. :-P

Nick.

Is this your first diesel?

I retired from line haul driving back in 1998. OTR life can really F-up your health as it did mine. The Cummins 315's and later M-11's we had held 8 gallons of oil. Oil service intervals were 25,000 miles. After an oil service, the oil would stay -clean- for the first 7k miles or thereabouts. From that point to about 15-17k miles, the oil would take on a brown appearances. But from about 18k to 25k miles, the engines would start using some oil and the oil would would become black by 25k miles. The company used Delo400 for the most part.

Several things contriubute to oil contamination in diesels:

The amount of idling. Diesels produce very little heat until they are under load. This is why all "real diesels" have a heat exchanger to ensure the engine oil temperature stays close to that of the coolant.

The oil sump capacity.

The crankcase ventilation design. In the case of the SD22, there is no positive crankcase ventilation. All blowby exits via an old fashioned road draft tube to the ground.

Presence of an EGR system.

Amount of blowby past the compression rings.

Sulfur content of the fuel used. More sulfur = more soot in the oil. This is an area where biodiesel (including the B20 blend) really help reduce soot emissions.

Engine oil composition. Synthetics really shine in diesel use.

Presence of a turbo charger. Diesels LIKE - LOVE all the air they can get. Reduces dirty combustion.

Type of combustion chamber. Those having a combustion chamber with a pre-chamber tend to have dirtier exhaust and more oil contamination. The SD22 dates back to about 1963 and is still used in forklifts, small marine applications, and stationary applications.

Electronic fuel management has reduced soot producing conditions.

That hits the high points.

You mean those high quality luxury cars collectibles like a Hillman Minx, Morris Minor, Fiats, English Ford, MG, Triumphs, Renaults 2CV, Cosmopolitans, and Alpine etc. I see at show? You did hit upon the reason there are not many old Jap cars around in the US, rust and the availability and price of parts. ;)

mike hunt

HachiRoku wrote:

(top posting corrected)

It's not always "exact". Can you tell a cheap bicycle from a quality one? Describe how, please. See, it's not easy to describe, is it.

Certainly, fully-independant designs are preferred, and are easily visually differentiated from lesser designs.

After that, I note the quality/cost of the individual components. Cast pieces are better then stamped-from-sheetmetal pieces. Cast aluminum is better than cast steel.

The overall design is important. Full double-A arm is better than struts (although the engineers at BMW will disagree).

How strong does everything look? Strength costs money. Rigidity (see cast components statement above) costs money.

Dude, I haven't seen a Hillman since I was a kid! Minors are around, but getting scarce, MG's are plenty, Triumphs can be had, (did you *mean* Renault 2CV, or Citroen?) We had a *BIG*, worldwide meeting of Citroens here at Umass 2 years ago, and there were so many Traction Avant's I thought I'd gone to heaven! (did you know one of the large sedans had

Cosmopolitans, I've seen 1, and Alpines are fairly available for $1500-12,000, dependine on if it's a Tiger or not (*real* nice one for $7500 near here)

I think the thing was, after WWII, more people were interested in importing *allies* cars then they dirty riens that attacked Pearl Harbor...

That does it, I'm moving! I just saw an RX-3 a couple weeks ago. Not bad, less than the usual rust...

Morris Minor?! Are you on crack?!

Nick.

The Matrix is a better buy than a Vibe, even if the price is higher. Why? Resale value. You will get more for a Matrix five years from now.

OK let me justify myself.

The Minx and the Minor are by no means high quality cars... in fact nor are the English Fords or the MGs... the old saying goes 'if it's not leaking oil there's no oil in it'.

They are NOT luxury cars... except maybe the GHIA model Fords.

These cars are your typical run-of-the-mill old car that nobody could give a tinkers toss about. Why the HELL would they have a show for em? Maybe for old Jaguars... Aston Martins... but a Morris Minor?! Good lord, I've heard some good ones...

Nick.

Even Citrons, but nary a Jap car. Merely proves the point of the question, where are the Jap cars from that time period? Certainly still not on the road ;)

mike hunt

HachiRoku wrote:

Citroen and Peugeot are my fav memories from then. marvellous cars, just not built for salt on the road in winter.

It doesn't snow in Europe? ;)

mike hunt

Buck Frobisher wrote:

yep, but they don't use salt. Those cars dissolved like Alka Seltzer tablets here in Southern Ontario.

As did the early Jap cars of the late 60's and 70's. For the most part they were econoboxes at that time and gave in to Canadian salt quite easily hence no collector cars to speak of.

They had few redeeming qualities other than a low price but they snared a foothold on that alone and the quality slowly rose to the state of the art we have today.

Ya gotta surrender to win I guess!

Mike

Well built for foriegn cars, easy to drive, easy to maintain (*didn't* leak oil!). Sometimes a pain to get parts for, esp here on the EC, but a blast and cheap to own/drive/run.

Also dissolved like alka-seltzer. And only good for about 160,000 miles / one owner at that time, but in the early 70's what car wasn't?

I work for a used car dealer, and I used to have a part-time job at carquest.

I am still on the original ball joints in my '85 Corolla GTS.

We had 1 set for Corollas on the stock shelf

4 sets for Chevys...

So true! I've never seen anything that old that hasn't had a rebuild of some kind. My brother's 1972 Holden Torana was probably the best, it's 173 hadn't been rebuilt and had 183,000 miles on it... but by that point it was sounding VERY bad, backfiring out the carb...

Turns out the camshaft had lobes that were round! :)

Replaced the 173 with a healthy 202 and the Torana got its second lease on life, with more power! Nice car too... they just didn't rust like the little Corollas etc.

Nick.

Actually few places use salt, except when the temperature is above 25 degrees because the water will re-freeze. They use Calcium Chloride as a deicer below 25 degrees.

mike hunt

Artfulcodger wrote: