Ok, I'm open minded

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Mike Hunter wrote:


The buying public, the ones who determine which companies live or die, has already decided.
--
Civis Romanus Sum

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wrote:

Buiuld quality is VERY close. Toyota tin sardine cans were in the seventies and early eighties, when you could also walk down the street of a quiet town and listen to Fords rust.
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i dont know about that. my 78 F250 2 wheel drive, 79 F350 4 wheel drive, and 88 super duty trucks are still looking very good, with just minor dulling of the paint. but then again, i take care of them.

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wrote:

And I'd venture to bet you don't live in the "salt belt" or the "briney"

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I am sad to tell you that our 03 Focus has had a couple of fairly expensive repairs.
AC problem at 70,000 cost $700, friggin flex plate at 100,000 and cost $1200 or so.
I sure as hell never expected to replace a FLEX PLATE.
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What was the VIN # so we can look that up to see if you are telling the truth?

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2000-2003 Focuses are problematic. The 2004 was the first one that was fairly reliable, after Ford assigned a team of 50 engineers to exterminate all the bugs. The Focus was given a Consumer Report recommendation that year. The newer the Focus you buy, the better the reliability.
Derek
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wrote:

They got better after 2004 - and it DOES happen.
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If you're open-minded, why do want to compare something in recent history with a decade old foreign made car? I make that assessment as your monies could obviously not buy a recent vehicle of any make based on your intended purchase.
I can provide history of my 08 Focus. Purchased with 925 miles on it on August 1st, 2008 from exclusively Ford dealer. Now has 4500 miles, February 23, 2009. No failures or repairs to date. One oil/filter change. Gas mileage to date, based on gas fills by gallons and trip odometer at that time, 33 mpg worst/39 mpg best. 5 speed manual. Driver/passenger and side air bags standard. No optional equipment or gimmicks. Primary complaint: road noise, don't know the source of that noise (tires, suspension, lack of sound insulation). Another complaint is the nagging tire pressure light when the weather gets colder (tire pressure drops when colder, normal). Now that the weather is improving, I don't have to bother with this anymore for another season. I'm sure its saving me some gas keeping the tire pressure at spec though. Complaint number 3 is lack of spare tire or even a donut type spare. They give you an air compressor with an alternate side that has that goop for sealing tires, one unit that fits in the trunk area designated for it.. This is good for all but an all out blowout. Complaint number 4 is the relatively high trunk area. While backing the car, can't see what's behind me at close distance, like children. Difficult to gauge distance while backing in a parking spot is another example. Otherwise, I'm very pleased with my bang for buck.
Just a caution on well used vehicles. Many Japanese, and German vehicles were noted for their reliability as well. However, their replacement parts are extremely expensive relatively speaking.. Along with the additional expense, there's also time inconvenience when your car is in the shop.
--
Dave

CDOs are how we got here.
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Dioclese wrote:

That is old time thinking. Repair costs on hondas and fords are right in the same ballpark as fords and cheaper than some of the stuff GM is turning out... look at the G6's, Grand Prix ... .etc...
Nissan for one is higher than any honda or toyota... but for you to throw out the blanket on high repair costs for jap vehicles is rediculous.
The german stuff I can agree with for sure... it is way out in left field, more than any Nissan would even be worth... but the honda and toyota stuff is as popular, or more popular and costs are very much in line with domestic.
I think Sarah was just trying to start a Calvin Piss On <Insert name here> thread ;)
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My personal cost observations were based on a 1988 VW Fox that I owned for 20 years and a similar year Toyota my son owned. Fuel pumps for either vehicles are in the stratosphere compared to their worth. I'm not sure about subsequent year Toyotas. VWs continue to take the bank based on input from others for replacement parts. I would be interested in approximately what year Toyota replacement parts started to substantially decrease in price.
--
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On Tue, 24 Feb 2009 11:58:19 -0600, "Dioclese" <NONE> wrote:

Somewhere about 1996 - 1998 , about the same time yank-tank parts started getting pricier.
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So, the "old time thinking" you refer to is appropriate sometimes. Just depends on the year and make and model of the vehicle.
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So my buddy brings over his 07 tundra for me to scan, and it needs a O2 sensor. Phone for part where I used to work, and Wham. $273 for a sensor, wtf? My O2's on my car are 65 at the highest. "Dioclese" <NONE> wrote in message

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Welcome to the real world of Toyota parts pricing!
Before I would change any O2 sensor, I would try to find the FAULT, in the process controller loop, that is actually causing it to be fouled. The O2 sensor, is the most commonly replaced GOOD part today ;)

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On Wed, 25 Feb 2009 19:13:34 -0500, "Mike Hunter"

Very true, and I just checked - a 2007 Tundra uses a standard 3 wire O2 sensor - your $68 part will work. Actually the OEM manufacturer being DENSO, you can buy them for about half that (universal fit).

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snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

Better check again.
MOD and NAPA both show it as a wide band air fuel ratio sensor. (list price; $281)
The wiring diagrams on Mitchell show -all- A-F/O2 sensors in all 3 Tundra engine options to be 4 wire sensors.
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On Thu, 26 Feb 2009 07:58:45 -0600, aarcuda69062

Go to: http://www.autopartswarehouse.com/mmp/toyota~tundra~o2_sensor~parts.html
Says standard 4 wire (sorry, my mistake) O2 sensor. Part Number: USOS-4000UNIVERSAL OXYGEN SENSOR, 4-WIRE -- 20 cm long wiring; Without connectors; A high quality, direct fit OE replacement oxygen sensor; With limited lifetime warranty.
Fit Note: Before Catalytic Converter.
$37.50
It is not a LAF, which is a 5 wire.
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On Wed, 25 Feb 2009 23:51:25 -0500, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

My bad - that's just 2000-2005
2007 is LIKELY, as my first guess, a Linear Air Fuel sensor (LAF), not a standard Nerst cell.
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The price for a Bosch replacement has a list price of $281.00
That would make you full of shit, as usual.
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