Ping Elle, Tegger

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M.A. Stewart wrote:


I'm interested in learning more about the innards of the 3bbl carbs especially the power valve circuit. I have a persistent problem of the power valve draining the carb overnight on all four operating gen II's.
I'm giving serious consideration to changing over to the Webber solution on the daily drivers.

Don't mother-in-laws generally sit in the back seat?
<G>
JT
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Grumpy AuContraire ( snipped-for-privacy@GrumpyvilleNOT.com) writes:

I'm not familiar with that carb. Give more info about this draining. Usually a power valve that is open (vacuum actuated) or closed (mechanically actuated), when the engine is not operating, does nothing. Fuel is in the float bowl, it is drawn UP the pipe (fuel nozzle) to the venturi when the engine is running off idle. The fuel goes through the main jet(s) first, from the bowl. When the power valve opens, it allows additional fuel to be drawn UP the pipe (fuel nozzle). Power valves are usually open (vacuum actuated) when the engine is not running. High manifold vacuum (throttle valve not open much) keeps the power valve closed. Wide-open-throttle, when the engine needs more fuel delivered to the venturi, manifold vacuum drops to about zero, power valve opens.
Is the float bowl empty of gas after sitting overnight?

Good point... I think they're supposed to sit in the back seat... they may have different opinions about that though. Especially the ones that want to 'assist'.

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M.A. Stewart wrote:

snip
In the 3bbl, it comes out the bottom.
If I had my druthers, I'd prefer a design without a power valve. I just don't see an advantage.
The old Stromberg 2bbls and AFBs were great carbs and neither had a power valve. Very trouble free and when it came time for a rebuild, it was a simple task.

Yep
JT
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On 09/02/2010 09:31 PM, Grumpy AuContraire wrote:

then you have a leak. enrichment pump diaphragm or maybe even porosity of the bowl material. as m.a.s. points out, fuel is drawn /up/ out of the bowl by partial vacuums - it is not gravity fed anywhere, and thus cannot drain unless there is a significant problem.

--
nomina rutrum rutrum

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jim beam wrote:

Not according to the shop manual... The power valve sits on the bottom of the carb..
JT
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On 09/03/2010 03:44 PM, Grumpy AuContraire wrote:

time to upgrade to fuel injection dude. unless you're running something like two twin weber dcoe40's, fuel injection is absolutely the way to go.
http://www.bgsoflex.com/megasquirt.html
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jim beam wrote:

No computer will ever see the light of day in any car I (willingly) own.
I do think that the Webber option may be a solution for daily drivers though..
JT
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Grumpy AuContraire ( snipped-for-privacy@GrumpyvilleNOT.com) writes:

What is not according to the shop manual? Is the float bowl completely empty? You wont know that unless you take the top off the carb off. Just because you can't see fuel through the sight glass does not mean its completely drained.
Fuel normally evaporates out of the float bowl (it's supposed to be captured by the evaporative control system), but it would take weeks to evaporate all the fuel out. If the fuel level really goes down a lot overnight, the engine will take many cranks to start up in the morning (the fuel pump has to fill up the float bowl which takes time). Is it doing that?
Maybe the casting has a crack in it. Maybe a drill-way plug is leaking (if it has drill-way plugs). Drill-ways are holes drilled into the casting to intersect other drill-ways if a circuit (a drill-way) has to change directions. The plugs are usually brass or lead or soft steel or aluminium.
The power valve sits on the bottom

Just like almost every other carb. The fuel has to go UP the nozzle to the venturi, which is above the fuel level. Is the evap system pressurizing the float bowl?

But a carburettor is a computer! It's not an electronic computer, its a mechanical/hydraulic/pneumatic computer! Some do have electric inputs (i.e. an electric choke heater). It's programed (calibrated) to deliver the proper fuel mixture (which is dynamic, depending on what the engine has to do).
A diesel engine fuel pump is a computer also, a mechanical computer.
A distributor is a computer (vacuum advance/mechanical advance).
Textile looms from the eighteen-hundreds were mechanical computers, and player pianos. etc.

Fix what ya got. Is a Webber a fix? Maybe... I don't know. Will a Webber pass your state emissions?

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M.A. Stewart wrote:

Yes.
This is a recurring problem with all of my current gen II Civics. I believe the culprit is not the carb but one of the control boxes.

I have no idea... I would just like to disable whatever the offending item is.

I would compare all of the above to ROM, not a processor.

Car is over twenty-five years old... Exempt from emissions..
JT
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On 09/07/2010 07:46 PM, Grumpy AuContraire wrote:

that would be a terrible misconception. a carburetor "calculates" fuel delivery output based on a number of dynamic inputs.

--
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On 09/07/2010 02:31 PM, M.A. Stewart wrote: <snip for clarity>

they are all indeed - well said!
[add automatic transmissions to that list]
--
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jim beam ( snipped-for-privacy@privacy.net) writes:

Thank you.

I forgot about that. The AT valve-bodies look just like a circuit board... with ATF oil molecules running around in them instead of electrons.

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The RAD-mounted sensor is the for cooling fan.
The ENGINE-mounted sensor is for the dashboard gauge.
If the fan runs too often and too long, then the rad sensor is simply faulty and in need of replacement by a new one of the very same rating as the original.
If your thermostat is of the correct rating and is in good working-order, then it will properly control the engine-coolant temperature regardless of what the rad fan wants to do.
Despite the age of your ride, you should be using genuine Honda parts, not aftermarket. If you're using aftermarket parts, that's the most likely explanation for whatever erroneous behavior you're experiencing. Unless you've got a deeper and more fundamental problem, like poor combustion, or low compression, etc.
--
Tegger

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Tegger wrote:

There are two engine mounted sensors. One is similar to the radiator unit while the other is a single lead which feeds the temperature gauge.

That's the question... Is there a way to determine a "rating" by part number?

Not in 100+ Texas temperatures.

Genuine Honda parts are getting scarce for these cars. I am using Honda thermostats though.
JT
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