Your beef isn't with Subaru, it's with the Federal Government. Specifically, with the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, which sets and administers the Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards. One of the FMVSS requirements is that power windows not operate with the key in the "off" position *OR* with the key in the "off" position once the driver's door has been opened. Most manufacturers choose simply to require that the key be "on" for the power windows to work.
This requirement does not exist in Europe or Japan.
Originally (1960s) power windows were always on. Apparently some kids were killed playing around in parked cars, and they started turning off the windows with the ignition. I think they also put in load sensors, like garage doors.
VW cut the headlights with the ignition. The marker lights would still drain the battery, but not for many hours.
I had a VW Passat that would close the windows if you held the door key in the locked position for a few seconds. It was nice if you noticed a window down as you were leaving the car.
My wife's Prius lets you operate the windows until a door is opened, very nice.
Within a week of buying our '97 OBW I had modified the wiring so the power windows work without the key. Could also make them work requiring key but in either run or accessory position. Just took one wire with a push-on connector at each end, connected across leads formerly going to relay. As to whether other cars let you run the windows without the keys, some do, some require run position, some either run or accessories. I remember specifically a rented Buick that did not require the keys at all. Of course if they work without the keys and that is known (e.g. the Buick, where presumably all of them did that, but not our Suby since others do not) then a thief knows an easy way to break in: Just snake a coat-hanger wire in and actuate the window switch. In recent decades manufacturers have redesigned the lock buttons just so you can't actuate them by pulling with a wire. Bob Wilson
Don't want to brag but I'm the proud owner of a 96 Brighton with luxurious manualy operated windows and environmentally friendly AC (just roll down the windows). It also has an automatic muscle conditionner system (just bend forward or bacward and roll the passenger side or back seat windows up or down).
A compromise would be to allow power window operation with key in ACC position just like the radio. When someone is left in the car I leave the keys in the ACC position so they can listen to radio. They could then also operate the windows. Yet the car would be secure with the keys out.
As someone else mentioned, I also didn't want to just jumper a wire because the window relay will always be ON. The other thing is that the Forester's window switches are lit when on and not controlled by the headlight switch. This promotes even more power consumption.
I thought about these options above, but I went through the route of wiring it so that I wouldn't need a key in the ignition because there were a lot of days that I didn't want to squirm in to switch it to ACC.
Right now anytime I unlock or lock the doors, the windows would be enabled for 15 seconds. I guess I could've added a switch, but I wanted it fully automatic for disabling.
You sound like an "automotive electrician", something I've never been. ;-) Any ideas on wiring changes to make the Cruise Control ON all the time? That's way Porsche and BMW are, it's nice not to have to look down to turn the blasted thing ON every time you shut off the ignition, only have to press the lever to SET.
I tried with no success, seems it needs a time delay after the ignition is turned on.
I really can't help you unless I have a schematic or your car is a 03-04 Forester. Looking at the Forester, it looks like you only need to jumper some pins for the 12V. Since, I've never tried it I can't verify the time delay you spoke of. Sorry.
It's an 04 OB, but it should be the same as the Forester. I tried that on the dash switch and it didn't work unless I first turned on the ignition and then applied a jumper to the 12V. ???
(I tried sending this as an emailed response, it did not seem to go through...) I agree that a time delay is needed. I have thought about this but not worked actively on it. Here is what I would do, but it sounds as if you may not have the equipment I would use to do it: I would use an oscilloscope to see what it is the dash switch sends. I think it sends a pulse to one of the computers, and in turn that computer "does" the cruise control in its spare time. If I found, for example, that it sends a pulse 5 volts high and half a second wide (totally made up, have not made the measurement!) then I would design a circuit using something like a 556 linear IC that would note power up, wait a moment, then send that pulse, every time power came on. The circuit is really trivial, but I would not want to connect anything to that lead until I knew exactly what to send. I think it could fry one of the computers. I say "one of the computers". I have not even looked closely to see what there is in by way of computing equipment onboard. On our old '91 Voyager there were several processors, one for the engine and one for the transmission and one called the "body" computer that ran things like the speedometer, and optionally one for the overhead console, etc., that were linked by a serial current loop network. It might be that all of that is combined into one in the Subys, cheap processors are now more powerful! Bob Wilson
I looked at the Forester schematic and from what I can gather it's similar to what you had described, but I believe the delay that's needed is caused by the internal cruise control circuitry. The cruise switch is just a momentary switch.
If you need a delay, try using a series resistor/capacitor circuit. This should give you the delay needed. For example:
1000uF & 10k or
100uF & 100k or
10uF & 1M will all give you around a 10s delay. You should use a capacitor rated at around 25V.
Place the resistor across the pins that you jumpered. Place one end (if polarized, the + end) of the cap to the pin that triggers the cruise (the other pin should be constant 12V). The other end of the cap needs to go to ground.
When you start the vehicle, 12V activates the cruise box, but the trigger pin of the cruise box doesn't receive it's 12V until 10s (depending on the res/cap combo) later.
Caveat: The cap fully charges to 12V in 10s. The problem is that I'm hoping that when you turn off your vehicle, that 12V charge can discharge. The cruise box, when off, can go into Hi-Z and probably keep the cap fully charged.
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