Done With GM

One intake manifold gasket leak on an 18-year-old truck and you're shit-canning an entire auto manufacturer? Got news for ya bud, the engine in that thing isn't even made by GM, it's an Isuzu engine, he he he. Gunna shit-can Toyotas when your valve cover gasket starts to leak as well?

Doc

Good riddance.

Dude! A vehicle almost 20 years old starts to leak so you decide GM equals junk? Sir, step away from the crackpipe.

You have a 17 year old vehicle and you are bitching? holy shit

I have to agree, if that's all you have a problem with in 18 years, and you wanta go nip, good riddance. , Heck I'll even chip in on a plane ticket so you can move there.

2.8 ltr an Isuzu engine, I think not Doc. While the original S-10 did use the same Isuzu engine that was used in the Chevy Luv trucks, the S-10 went all Chevy in 1984 when the 1.9 was dropped in favor of the 2.0, which was dropped in 85 in favor of the 2.5 ltr Pontiac Tech IV engine. The 2.8 came out in 1980 as a small V-6 for the citation, apollo, aster and similar small cars. It's "family" is the only V-6 that had motor mount bosses on the block for use in both front wheel and rear wheel drive vehicles. The engine had a problem with crankshafts in the beginning that GM fixed when the engine was redesigned in 1986 with larger main and rod bearing journals. Early models also had problems with rear main seals leaking that was remedied at the same time going from a two piece to a one piece seal design. The only annoying problem is the intake gasket failures. I always figured most of that problem was caused by the location of the EGR valve so close to the left rear corner of the manifold causing excessive expansion and contraction of the manifold in that area. Whitelightning

Certainly not the only problem, but I wanted to keep it brief. I had to replace the oil pump 4000 miles ago, which was providing less that adequate pressure, and I could go on with other problems. The point is not my vehicle so much as that it appeared the apparent flaw mentioned remained in the 2.8l and its cousins into the recent age. I have kept all my vehicles for a long time, and none of them ever had this engine-killer issue. I had a Geo Prizm where the wife lost most of the radiator water out of at 80K and I sold it at 147K several years later, still running strong. No head gasket or intake manifold gasket issue appeared with this car, nor a warped head.

I used to pay special attention to finding cars made in the US, and some of the Toyotas are. But the statistics and test driving cars, not just this particular issue with my S-10, turned me some time ago.

Whitelightn>

Certainly not the only problem, but I wanted to keep it brief. I had to replace the oil pump 4000 miles ago, which was providing less that adequate pressure, and I could go on with other problems. The point is not my vehicle so much as that it appeared the apparent flaw mentioned remained in the 2.8l and its cousins into the recent age. I have kept all my vehicles for a long time, and none of them ever had this engine-killer issue. I had a Geo Prizm (Fremont, CA) where the wife lost most of the radiator water out of at 80K and I sold it at 147K several years later, still running strong. No head gasket or intake manifold gasket issue appeared with this car, nor a warped head, and my S-10 never saw that kind of extreme.

I used to pay special attention to finding cars made in the US, and some of the Toyotas are. But the statistics and test driving cars, not just this particular issue with my S-10, turned me some time ago.

Whitelightn>

So why bitch and moan in here when you could be ass-kissing and slobbering over in the toyota group?

Doc

In a related story, my 1972 Chevelle SS has begun to show some rust spots. GM sucks! LMAO What a crackpot!

Being made here isn't near as important as being made here by an American Company. The jap shit maybe assembled here, but the profit doesn't stay in the country. Last time I figured it out buy going over their end of year profit report on the corporate web page, $5,500 per toyota vehicle sold here leaves the country. And while the 2.8 did have a habit of popping the intake gasket, I have not heard of nor seen the problem on the 3.1 nor the 3.4, as the culprit, the EGR valve, was moved away from the left rear corner of the intake manifold, this was facilitated because they didn't run throttle body injection, but multi port, giving the manufacturer the ability to move the valve, and its related heat away from the edge of the manifold. Its the constant expansion and contraction of the manifold that causes the gasket to fail. Not to mention that nether of those two engines where used in the S-10 series.

Whitelighting

After seeing a bunch of "craigs" in the Ford and Chevy newsgroups a few years ago I spent about a week reading the Honda/Toyota groups. What I found was a HUGE number of posts about "how do I fix my blown head gasket" for vehicles with only 60K on them. One friend of mine has had to rebuild his Toyota engine 3 times in 3 years. The only vehicle I"ve ever owned where the automatic tranny could not hold up under my driving style was a Toyota, all my American vehicles, which I drove the same way, had ATs that lasted forever.

-- Elbridge Gerry, of Massachusetts:

"What, sir, is the use of militia? It is to prevent the establishment of a standing army, the bane of liberty. . . Whenever Government means to invade the rights and liberties of the people, they always attempt to destroy the militia, in order to raise a standing army upon its ruins." -- Debate, U.S. House of Representatives, August 17, 1789

I lurk in alt.autos.gm and the 3.1 and 3.4 engines are noted there for blowing the intake gasket, at least up to a few years ago. These engines are still in use in cars and still use the intake manifold for conveying the coolant. At least in the truck V8s GM has done away with using a "wet" intake manifold, thus eliminating the problem. I'd tend to agree that the OP got his money's worth out of his truck over that many years of use. But I also understand his frustration and lack of confidence in GM as I've had to replace my '99 Yukon's intake gasket at 42k miles. You'd think that after almost 50 years of making small block V8s they'd have got them right by 1999.

WW

I have a 87 s-10 4-whl dr 2.8 that I bought as a project -w- the same symptoms, never give it a thought that it might be just an intake manifold gasket... is this pretty much the norm or are they also known to blow headgaskests also?? tia Paul

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On 2 Jan 2005 21:00:33 -0800, snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote something wonderfully witty:

You should keep the paint in better condition.

On Sun, 2 Jan 2005 22:38:15 -0800, "WaterWatcher" wrote something wonderfully witty:

Anecdotal evidence at best. I've owned nothing but GM vehicles for well over thirty years now. From Chevettes to Corvettes, from S-10's to Full-size pickups as well. The only exception is my youngest daughters Mustang drop-top. Some of been could, some have been great, and some have been a royal PIA. Mechanical shit can happen. Anything built by man (including the robots now used) are subject to the flaws of man.

I must have lucked into a gem instead of a lemon. We bought a leftover "demo" 88 Corsica (2.8 V6) in 89 with 6K on the odo. I just sold it to my best friend last year for his daughter's first car. It had well over 160K on it. Over it's life I replaced the fuel pump twice, water pump once, alternator once, struts once, normal brakes, tires and belt wear.

It still runs strong, does not leak at all and does not burn any oil, upper 20's mpg. For the cheap-o little car that it is, I was amazed at how well it held up. It was my wife's car and she isn't particularly easy on vehicles. We passed it on to our teenage son who drove it for

1.5 yrs. It spent it's life in Utah and Idaho, hot summers, cold winters, lots of mountain driving, lots of dirt roads etc...

DJ

True. It is also know that the multinationals keep a lot of their profit overseas to avoid the US tax.

Whitelightn>