New PT cruiser

On Mon, 19 Oct 2009 01:21:05 -0400, Brian Priebe I sit in the driver's seat gets 21MPG (US) on the highway in real

I agree with you. It's offset by the low price, they almost give them away. My Crown Vic gets 25 mpg on highway trips. My Mustang GT often gets 20 for my commute if I baby it, otherwise 18. The saving grace of the PT is that in town it looks like I can count on between 18 and

21 depending on how heavy traffic is. I got 21 tonight on a 15 mile in town trip with light traffic.

That car really needs the CVT transmission! Wonder why they didn't do it two years ago!

Hey Ashton - you're just a piker compared to these guys - golf carts legally qualifying as "electric vehicles" if they are shown to be "road worthy":

"...Golf Cart Man is referring to his offer in which you can buy the cart for $8,000, get a $5,300 tax credit off your 2009 income tax, lease it back for $100 a month for 27 months, at which point Golf Cart Man will buy back the cart for $2,000. "This means you own a free Golf Cart or made $2,000 cash doing absolutely nothing!!!..."

It's been living on borrowed time for the last several years. I think the Caliber (which I believe has CVT) was supposed to replace it but people kept buying the PT. I'm pretty sure 2010 will be it's last year but who knows. If they can keep making money on them and people keep buying them due to the low price and they don't need the factory for something else maybe it will go longer. Originally I think 08 was supposed to be the last year.

You're too late. I did that here in AZ over a decade ago with a NEV (Neighborhood Electric Vehicle).

Seriously?

>>

Yup. Paid 8,000 for the NEV, got 10,000 tax credit, sold the NEV for $2000. It was the political scam of the day. Followed a decade later by the Alt-fuel scam where you could get about half the cost of your F-150 paid by the state if you bought one that could run on propane as well as gas. Most of them had 8 gallon propane tanks.. about enough to make a trip to the grocery store. It was pushed by a Mormon who apparently though no one but other Mormon's was going to hear about it. It put a huge hole in the state budget once word got out. They had to repeal it pronto before the state went bankrupt buying everyone half of a truck.

In 2006 the sales droids at one dealer were pushing me to buy the Caliber instead of a PT Cruiser. Their reasoning was a college kid wouldn't be caught dead in an stodgy PT Cruiser, and look at all the extra cup holders, the built in AC inverter, the drop down rear tailgate speakers, the glove box that doubled as a cooler!

I stuck with the Cruiser because it seemed to be better able to handle the load of "stuff" my daughter stuffed into her college dorm, and she liked the slightly higher seating position.

I've had occasion to rent both the PT and the Caliber over the years as the PAC was in the shop. The early Caliber CVT you couldn't pay me to own. Floor it and it took eons to rev the engine. I've heard it's improved a lot since. But the PT was peppy even without the turbo, comfortable, as as you note has relatively cavernous cargo area. But gas mileage has always sucked.

Now what they really need is that Nissan 2.5L with their CVT that I drove in an Altima over the weekend. Miserly on gas (32MPG EPA on the highway) and when "required" embarrasses just about anything else on

4 wheels that isn't a sports sedan. Nissan could learn a great deal from Chrysler about how to set up suspensions though. (And the tires were garbage.)

On Tue, 20 Oct 2009 19:44:01 -0400, Brian Priebe as the PAC was in the shop. The early Caliber CVT you couldn't pay me

I read a lot of complaints about the CVT like you mentioned. I was originally going to buy a Patriot instead of the PT but there were none left. Anyway, I rented a Patriot to see how I liked them and the

2009 models seemed to have had the CVT problems ironed out IMHO. It worked very well and I would love to have the Patriot engine/transmission setup in the PT. But the transmission in the PT shifts very nicely. For FWD the PT feels pretty good, I generally hate FWD vehicles because of how they "feel".

I think the insurance company will total our 2006 PT Cruiser after it was rear ended last week. I'm wondering if I should replace it with a 2010 PT Cruiser or the Dodge Journey. The Journey doesn't have the same personality of the Cruiser but may do a better job carrying "stuff" and pulling out on the interstates with a V6 engine. AWD might be a better choice for coping with winter in New York. Negatives I've read about the Journey are mushy handling and feeling like it will roll over.

Any one here know more about the Dodge Journey or can compare one to the PT Cruiser?

Steve

My wife and I had a 2003 base sedan and a 2005 Turbo Convertible. Both got lousy mileage! I wish that the CVT transmission would have been available. We now have a 2007 Caliber and get around 27-30 around town, and 31-35 on the highway. Never saw anymore than 26 with my two PTs.

Our 2007 Caliber sits as high as our 2003 and 2005 PT Cruisers. I agree, I like the body style of the PT, it is like my 1941 Windsor!

My wife says that her 2007 Caliber with the CVT has a lot of pickup, more than the base 2003 sedan and as much as her former 2005 Turbo PT Convertible. You are right about the lousy mileage. The Nissan Murano has the CVT as well as the Caliber. Chryslers have always handled better, going back to the torsion bar days. Hell, my 1941 Windsor as a front and a rear anti-roll bar, all standard from the factory, it is all original, 23K miles! The Fluid Drive does move off slowly, but who cares, gives me more time to smell the old car interior!

The Journey is nice, we were thinking about trading in our Caliber for the new one. However, after looking at the payments, we decided to stick with the Caliber for a while longer. The Journey rode very smoothly and had good pickup.

The Journey is a very good value vehicle. I'm 5'-11" and I found it a bit high for easy entry. IMO the Journey is actually a small van. Not surprising Chrysler dropped their short Van when the Journey came out.

The urban/city mileage is reasonable. That 25 mpg highway mileage is poor. My 300M (3.5LV6, 250HP) gets a consistent 28 mpg (US gal) on the highway at 60 to 70 mph on regular fuel. I'm quoting actual measured fuel & distance for a long trip, although the digital mpg read out shows about the same.

It's likely the the poor body side streamlining that causes the low highway fuel mileage. The VW New Beetle has the same problem.

We've owned my wife's 05 for about a year now (bought used with 35k miles). Love everything about it except, as you said, the gas mileage. Power isn't bad for a 4-holer, actually, but you'd expect 30+ MPG instead of 25.

If they'd put the World Engine with varible valve timing and the continuously-variable transmission from the Caliber/Patriot in it, that's what they'd have. But I imagine they'll keep costs to a bare minimum and build it for one more year with the 2.4/41TE combo that's already certified (smog, crash, etc.) and proven.

The World Engine is already as good or better than the Nissan 2.5, and the CVT in the Caliber/Patriot is the same one (JATCO) as Nissan uses. All they need to do is put Iit in the PT Cruiser in place of the 1995 tech (and very good for 1995) 2.4/41TE.

I haven't had an Altima rental yet, but I've had a Sentra and was very impressed with the Jatco CVT. The engine (a 1.6 or 1.8 IIRC) was only decent- not amazing- but it did have VVT and combined with the CVT it always managed to be pretty much able to deliver optimum torque. The only time it suckered me was when I used about 60% of the accelerator pedal merging onto an interstate, and then went for the remaining 40% to keep a safe distance ahead of an approaching truck.... and it had NOTHING left to give. That's part of how the drivetrain controllers in VVT/CVT cars work- the percentage of the total available power they're giving doesn't always correspond to your right-foot position, which makes them seem peppier than they should in casual driving and you only discover what's going on when you ask for the rest of the power that isn't really there.