Weak Brakes - 00' Dodge Intrepid

There was a post a few weeks ago on the 300M ezBoard that was complaining of ineffective brakes. After getting some advice from the forum participants, he checked the front rotors and found that they were in fact heavily glazed. He replaced them, and the problem went away. Not saying this is necessarily your problem, but that was one case of alleged glazing.

For what turning them costs, you might just get new rotors (I recommend NAPA P/N 86777, which are Raybestos PHP/R/T rotors re-boxed as NAPA's in-house United Brake brand). At 67,000 miles on your rotors, you won't be losing much if the rotors aren't the problem.

Don't forget to properly bed the pads in.

One more comment: You may not be aware, but, the Chrysler dealers sell 2 levels of brake pads - one called the Value Line, and the others are the factory original pads. Unless you insist on the factory original type, they will sell you the Value Line and let you assume they are the original type. IOW, what you got are likely the Value Line unless you specifically know otherwise. Not saying there's anything wrong with them - actualy some people prefer them - I've seen claims of good performance and much less dust than the factory originals.

Bill Putney (to reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my address with "x")

Great information Bill and thanks for posting it!!!

FWIW I have found the brakes in my 2000 Caravan (non ABS) to be way underpowered and I just replaced the pads at 27k with Bendix "lifetime" versions. Stopping power still stinks however.

One thing I don't like about the Bendix pads is that they smell and get real hot for the first couple of days. Normally I would have thought of a stuck caliper, but I have had the same results with 3 different cars I have used them on. After a week or so they don't stink and don't get hot anymore.

One good thing is you just bring them in when worn and you get new ones for free.

rubber hoses in the brake line. There are rubber hoses (aprox 1 foot) at each wheel. These can get soft and expand reducing the force getting to the wheel.

? ABS isin't standard these days?

Heck, even my 2001 2WD ram had ABS standard on the rear wheels. Chrysler hasn't made ABS standard on their ubiquitous minivans yet?

Underpowered in what sense? I just read the latest minivan test in CR and the Chrysler vans were among the best in stopping distance. I don't know if they check fade resistance, but I assume you mean stopping distance when you talk about the "power" of the brakes. A minivan will never stop with a BMW 5 series if that is what you are expecting...

Most pad makers specify a break-in regimen that says not to make hard stops the first few hundred miles. If you are getting them hot enough to stink early on, then you are likely glazing the pads and no wonder you don't have good braking after that.

Quite possibly because they've been glazed so heavily that they can't develop enough friction to get hot anymore. I think your brake problem is visible in the mirror.

Matt

The typical bedding-in process specified by the pad manufacturers intentionally heats the pads up pretty good and IIRC ends with making a relatively hard stop from 50 mph or so.

Bill Putney (to reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my address with "x")

I've seen a variety of recommendations depending on type of pad material. Some recommend light usage for a few hundred miles with gradually increasingly hard stops. This is the case with the pads I just installed on my motorcycle. Some recommend you go out and make several stops in succession with each stop harder than the last until you are making near threshold stops after 10-20 stops. Some recommend cooling between each stop, some don't.

However, I don't know of any pads that recommend that the first few stops be hard stops, which is what many people do when they get new pads and/or rotors. People who brake hard and abuse their brakes tend to do it ALL the time. Doing this with new pads will often ruin them for life. That was my point.

Matt

You are comparing apples and oranges Sherlock.

You are comparing a 2003 or maybe 2004 Caravan to a 2000 Caravan and quite possibly one of the 4 wheel disc brake models (Consumers tends to test the top of the line models) to mine which is front disc rear drum.

The vans got a redesign in 2001 and the brakes were improved.

"Driving Improvements for the 2001 Chrysler mini vans Head lamps provide an 80 percent improvement in lighting Brake rotors and calipers are larger and improved Engine and accessory changes increase the power and torque of the 3.3- and

The brakes just don't bring the van to a stop as quickly as I feel they should.

These people seem to agree:

Nothing is wrong with the system BTW.

Wrong.... Read Bill's response. FWIW they smell just driving around normally, for a week or so. Pads are not glazed at all and it's a little difficult to over drive a mini van :)

Wrong again Sherlock.

I think you need to read the instructions that come with your pads. Or if you are the type that doesn't need to read instructions (and I suspect you are), you can start here:

"Bendix products continue to be among the top contenders in the brake industry. AlliedSignal recently introduced three significant Bendix products to the aftermarket. The patented Bendix® TitaniuMetallic(TM) disc brake pads provide superior out-of-the-box braking without the traditional break-in period. They were voted among the Top Ten Products of 1999 by Undercar Digest. Also an award-winning product, Bendix® Import Quiet (IQ) disc brake pads have virtually eliminated the squeaks associated with some brakes. Finally, fleet, sport-utility vehicle, and minivan drivers can now enjoy smooth stopping both on- and off-road, and in even the most grueling temperatures, as a result of Bendix® MetLok(TM) brake pads developed exclusively to meet the needs of these vehicles."

Next time do your homework properly before you post.

psycho

I agree with what you are saying Matt, but in my case it's just normal braking and the Bendix don't require any break in so it's a moot point anyway.

Again it depends upon the type of pad.

Here is a good site that backs everybody's opinion up, depending upon the type of pad:

That's true possibly, but my 1996 GV has the same brakes as yours and mine stops just fine.

What is your stopping distance from 60 MPH? What do you think it should be? Is your ABS working properly?

I'm not familiar with the Caprice, but having a Jetta outstop a minivan isn't a surprise at all. Talk about comparing apples to oranges.

Then why are you complaining?

Sure it is. Just always start braking 100' before the stoplight when you are traveling 55 MPH. I see lots of people who drive like this routinely. Don't ask me why. They are usually the ones that floor it when the light turns green, stomp on the brakes when the next light turns red, and are sitting there impatiently waiting as I gradually slow down beside them before the light turns green. Funny how we both make the same progress, but I do it with much less gas and brake dust on the front wheels.

I did. I found several links to break-in procedures and the one you found is the only one I've seen that doesn't require a break in. So are you using these exact pads?

Matt

OK, pretty hard to troubleshoot a "feeling" problem.

Matt

They're just underpowered, what can I say.

Nothing you can say, because you don't have any data to back up anything.

Matt

I suggest you actually drive a 2003 and compare for yourself instead of reading about it in Consumer Reports. Manufacturers don't upgrade braking systems (ie:make them larger) because their is nothing wrong with the current versions. The idea is to make things cheaper so there is more profit. I have driven a 2003 and it is significantly better at braking than my 2000 or my companies van, maintained by Dodge, which is a 1999.