Modern Tires Ruin the Roads

Hello, Coasty! You wrote on Sat, 26 Nov 2005 05:20:52 -0500:

C> May be they should start building roads out of recycled rubber from C> tires, then the roads could throw the stones back in retaliation.

??>> Earlier tire designs use coarse zig-zag treads that cannot pick up ??>> small rocks. Car manufacturers should specify tire tread designs that ??>> do no degrade the roads. Only rubber compound should contact the ??>> roadways. I seem to recall a project in Ontario a few years ago where some experimental sections of road were laid with mixtures of asphalt with granulated tires and/or sulphur. I guess it was not successful because I have not heard any more about it.

Cheers

Indrek Aavisto.

Please don't feed the trolls. Notice that the "non specific person" has not participated in these lengthy posts other than to kick them off.

There are 3650 posts this month from NN this month alone.

A proper observation: "I believe that our recent experience with "Nomen Nescio" was an attempt to waste our time with unreasonably argumentative rants that started ..."

S'funny that he isn't zeroing in on lug tires.... the ones that can't hold a pebble to save it's life yet, like a womans high heel shoe, concentrate the load in a very small area (can we say "pounds per square inch boys and girls?").

During spring breakup, most of our roads have "road bans" and trucks can be limited to anywhere up to 50% of their licenced gross vehicle or gross combined weight on some roads.

Even with todays knowledge, road construction remains part magic and part budget. As subterranian conditions change, a previously womderful stretch of road can start to degrade for no apparent reason. In other cases, the powers that be don't have the funding to commit to building a stretch of road properly. In other cases, the powers that be have a brother-in-law that has a construction company ... some folks get rich and roads are built in less than ideal ways.

We never had radial induced pull back in the good old bias ply days.... but we certainly didn't have the benefits brought by the radila tire, either.

The Freeze / Thaw issue is only so when water penetrates the surface. Salt is only an issue where it facilitates the melting of snow into openings in the surface. Smooth, thick concrete will easily last

I don't wonder, I know it becomes particulate matter we all get to breath, free of charge. Excepting of course the rubber that is "burnt" into the streets in front of schools.

Oh yeah? You calling me a liar?

"In my area there was a 750 foot portion of concrete built to interstate standards that lay dormant for 25 years... blocked off, it had no vehicular traffic, and negligible salt on it. It only had rain and freeze/thaw.

By the time the roadway got extended, it was a broken up mess.. they had to tear it all up and lay new concrete."

;)

It is water under the concrete that causes the biggest problem when it freezes. If the subgrade preparation and drainage isn't good, the entire slab will heave causing cracks over time.

Surface damage can and does occur from the very small shrinkage cracks that exist in virtually all concrete and these are susceptible to salt and water damage over time. Yes, good concrete will last 20 years, but I've seen concrete that didn't last 10. And even 20 years is pretty expensive now that concrete costs several million dollars per mile of four-lane highway.

Matt

Perhaps it was due to tire resistance, but I doubt it. IMHO it was due to the poor road constuction back then. Modern roads are much more heavily built than they were in the bias ply days, at least where I live. Nowadays cities near here gut the old road and lay in much more base rock and asphalt than they took out. Compaction and testing methods have also greatly improved, as have materials. So, if you want to take the opinion of a person who deals with road reconstruction on a peripheral basis, the tires may not have had much to do with it. More important than the tires is the amount of traffic, and how heavy the vehicles are, when it comes to roadway wear.

WW (almost a geezer, depending on what the definition of THAT is!)

I'm completely mystified. How obvious a troll does dear Nomen has to post before people will get the message and NOT RESPOND?

The secret is SMOOTH. As in WAY too smooth to provide adequate traction for safe highway driving. A textured concrete surface WILL deteriorate from freeze-thaw, and WILL end up with salt embeded in the concrete. Up here in the "great white north" the vast majority of highway surfaces are asphalt of one type or other. VERY little exposed concrete. The salt used on the roads has severely damaged MANY re-enforced concrete structures- like bridges bu corroding the encapsulated re-bar, and splitting the concrete.

I wouldn't say it wasn't successful - the testing continues. A few more years will start to tell the tale.

No, the geezer is correct in his tire resistance theory. But it has nothing to do with bias ply vs. radial ply. A vehicle moving in a straight line wants to continue in a straight line, even while turning. Thankfully, there is usually enough tire resistance to overcome this tendency. The curves in a gravel road take extra load because of it.

More important than the tires is the

Absolutely.

Dave

The surface of concrete is absorbant, if you have oil drips on the surface of the smoothest concrete they will stain. The places that the oil goes is where the water goes, and freeze thaw will soon etch and destroy the smooth surface.

Ted

Your sig line explains it all.

you can't understand b/c it's rooted in human nature.

Post secondary education is about knowing more and more about less and less.

PS this isn't a flame, just an observation

I don't think his PhD is in English or Eng. Lit.

I work in a machinery field infested with engineering types and I can tell you that knowledge of grammar and spelling is abysmal on both sides of the Atlantic.

Similar applies to scientists, many educated to degree or postgraduate level. It is kwite apawling.

DAS

For direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling

What I found surprising to learn just a few years ago was how little international exchange there was on the question of road surfacing materials. You'd think that companies would take the best practice and experience on a global basis and apply that. But they don't or, at least, didn't. Everybody was ploughing his own little furrow, so to speak.

I happened to sit next to someone on an airport shuttle bus who was on the way to (one of?) the first international conferences in this field. And it was being held in Iceland (hohoho!) to be on 'neutral' territory...

DAS

For direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling