I was thinking, with GM having all the problems they are, they may soon
be bought out by another company. Say Toyota for example. I'm all for
this. I think Toyota could teach those guys a thing or two about
building reliable cars. I come from a Toyota family so I'm a *bit*
biased. If Toyota does buy GM, I might even consider buying a (new) GM
product for every day transport. I know this will most likely start a
flamewar, but I'm just stating my opinion.
They DO know how to buid a reliable car. Employee salaries and benefits and
stockholders happy have forced the North American car manufacturers to lower
of things, including quality.
Another thing, friend of mine used to be a Ford dealer. At a meeting, Ford
offered to make available
to them a car that could go 20 years trouble free. They said NO!!! Profits
are more important than anything else.
It was repeated by other people and probably became a legend or an urban
myth in some ways many other story. I see your point.
My friend assured me it was true. He told me the story about 15 years ago
and was very serious when telling it.
He was a Ford dealer and went to a Ford dealer meeting. The Ford brass did
indeed proposed to build a car that could last 20 years. They all said NO!
Glen has passed away a couple of years ago so, I can't ask him for the
Let me put a twist on this. With GM selling their majority interest in
GMAC, they will have over 20 BILLION in cash. Now, just applying a
little Economic 101, what does business due when the market is full and
has a lot of cash? Start buying. So, lets just say GM takes those
dollars and buys a controlling interest in Toyota or Hunda.
Now, they have a power house to combine Toyota and GM dealers together
to either up or down sell to Joe off the street. The question then
becomes, does GM need a Pontiac, GMC, Buick or Saturn? Yes, one can
picture all four brands going away (I am a die in the wool converted
Pontiac Trans Am man for over 30 years so it pains me to think about
GM would expand the line of Toyota trucks, SUVs and more smaller line
My two cents.
Highly unlikely scenario. GM doesn't have the capability to even attempt to
buy Toyota, let alone actually do it. GM is rotting from the inside out and
will probably be in bankruptcy by years end and certainly by the contract
talks in '07. I just do not believe that GM has the vision, intelligence
and will to really change their mindset that builds cars that the public
doesn't care to buy-that is one reason their market share keeps declining.
The fleet sales hide just how bad GM's decline is because they hide an even
bigger decline in "regular" sales. Then there are the many, many ticked off
ex-GM owners that have been badly burned by poor customer service and poor
engineering. We have very, very long memories of how we were screwed by GM
and its payback time. GM is going down.
I doubt that will happen. I suspect that, at worst, GM will declare
cancel the contracts, make all the stocks worthless, and reorganize under
To declare bankrupt you don't have to be dead, just on the point of dying.
Daimler Benz, of course, acquired Chrysler, so the concept is possible.
I have been in sales meetings, by the way, where executives made the kind
of statement another poster has quoted. "If we gave you a car that would
for 20 years, troublefree, would you be happy"
This might have been similar to what happened in the Ford story.
In fact they can't do this, or at least never intend to do it.
When you are trying to get a sales organization to improve its market share,
the salesmen always say "We could, if you could give us this, or that, or
It is a common CYA situation.
The worst thing you can do to a salesman, sometimes, is give him what he
Then his excuse is ruptured.
It can be really hard to figure out how to design a product, and the
which will take a large share of the business from a competitor. Books have
written on it. Some companies have wasted millions or even billions on
GM has had it share of fools in management.
toycars wrote, "I think Toyota could teach those guys [GM] a thing or
two about building reliable cars."
I submit that if you made the above statement to the average person on
the street--in other words, outside of this discussion room--they
wouldn't know what you were talking about.
GM cars aren't generally regarded as being unreliable by the
population at large.
If someone didn't know what a GM car was, and began reading about them
in this group, they would think they're absolute junk, which is far from
The main problem with GM, as I see it, is they're saddled down with so
much expenditure from health care and pensions.
I sure as hell wouldn't have any problem with buying a GM car.
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