Engine overhaul.

Time has come to do something about the high oil consumption on the old Rover. Not helped by all the leaks cause by piston blow-by.
It's many years since I did a full engine overhaul, and all the places I once knew for the machining work have closed down. Presumably because many engines now outlast the car. My favourite was Prince Engineering, Kingston on Thames.
There are plenty specialists for the RV8. Real Steel, Turner, RPI etc. All will do an exchange short engine - at a cost.
A basic short engine - no camshaft - seems to average out at around £2500 exchange.
Thing is, the costs of a set of new pistons and bearings (from Rimmer - hardly the cheapest) is about £400. Leaving over £2000 for the actual re-bore, crank grind and assembling the short engine.
Where have my maths gone wrong?
I have a spare engine. My idea is to have that overhauled as a short engine and fit the bits needed from the existing unit - as the heads on that are Stage one and recent - as is the cam and drive gear.
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*What was the best thing before sliced bread? *

Dave Plowman snipped-for-privacy@davenoise.co.uk London SW
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On 14/02/2017 14:23, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Try Regal Engines, Purfleet, a father/wife/son run place with at least 40 years experience rebuilding engines to my personal knowledge. 01708 867190
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Thanks - I'll contact them.
I've also had a recommendation for a place in Bromley which is a bit closer for me.
They have given me an email quote of £600 to do all the work, supply the bits and assemble the basic short engine. (I've never actually fitted new pistons to the RV8 rods - so makes some sense to pay them to do it)
Trouble is that seems too cheap given the norm of four times that plus. ;-)
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Dave Plowman snipped-for-privacy@davenoise.co.uk London SW
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On contacting them again about another matter - and asking if the quote included VAT, it seems I read their original quote wrongly. In my defence it was a rather badly written email reply - that may have come from a phone. Basically they gave a parts cost and a 'labour' cost separately, but made the labour cost look like a total.
The true figure is a total of £1060. Which isn't a million miles from my original guess, before looking into it.
Incidentally, chatted to a pal of my brother who used to run a garage. His hobby since retiring is restoring old MGs - so is up with current machine shop costs. He said where he lives, a ballpark figure is £30 per bore, and £20 per crank journal (all journals needing grinding) for the machine work, with parts obviously extra. Both on an average 4 cylinder engine.
Working on that, it would be £240 for the re-bore, £180 for the crank grind and the rest labour to re-assemble, making up that £600.
--
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Dave Plowman snipped-for-privacy@davenoise.co.uk London SW
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On Tue, 14 Feb 2017 14:23:16 +0000 (GMT)

Not having done this for over 30 years, I don't know what the work costs now. But if £2500 is the average price, then it's worth doing what you're thinking of doing. I did that many years ago with a Spitfire engine, then installed it, and an overdrive gearbox, into my Herald 13/60. Very useful and nippy it was, too.
Does the £2500 get you some warranty?
--
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The last full engine overhaul I did was to my Austin 1800 (Landcrab) in the '70s. Was better than new afterwards. ;-)

Not sure anyone would give you much of a warranty on what is a part built engine?
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Dave Plowman snipped-for-privacy@davenoise.co.uk London SW
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Dave Plowman (News) submitted this idea :

Be very wary of the replacement engine suppliers, many are just engines pulled from scrap cars and just cleaned up. The warrantee is worthless.
I have no personal experience just what I have seen on TV. I have only rebuilt them myself and not for very many years. The last time was a complete replacement engine, which was bought as an emissions failure imported from Japan. It was absolutely fine, apart from the mess the company I bought it from, dropping it in the engine bay. I spent days fixing their mistakes.
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Quite. No intention of using one of those. That's why I want my block and crank refurbished.

I'm intending doing the majority of the engine build myself. And the installation.
--
*If at first you don't succeed, destroy all evidence that you tried *

Dave Plowman snipped-for-privacy@davenoise.co.uk London SW
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On Thu, 16 Feb 2017 15:46:30 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"

I hope to be in a similar position soon when the kitcar (single donor) is 40 years old. ;-)
It's currently running the original 1300 X-Flow from the 4 dr Mk2 Escort, but I have another 1300 long engine that was supposedly rebuilt (ready to go in another kitcar), a 1600 long engine (supposedly rebuilt and was briefly in a kitcar) and a 1300 GT long engine that I took out of a 2dr Mk2 when we built the kit.
So, like you I'd like to get back to a solid short engine (probably the 1600) and then use the best of the rest as appropriate.
Like, would using the 1300 GT head on the 1600 block give me the best airflow / performance? The chances are the GT head won't have hardened valve stems / seats(?), would they be as easy to get done as the 1300?
I also have the complete 2L Pinto I took out of the Sierra Estate (I had for 23 years) but I feel it's just too big and heavy (although one of the valid engine options in the kit) and would need too much work to make it fit 'now'.
Cheers, T i m
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On 16/02/2017 23:57, T i m wrote:

No, no, no, you want a Lotus twin cam in there.
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On Fri, 17 Feb 2017 09:27:48 +0000, MrCheerful

Whilst that sounds like a good idea and the sticker would look good on the back I'm pretty sure that would be even more of a waste of money than anything else I've mentioned for this particular vehicle so far. ;-(
Had it been a Caterham or any other L7 clone then it might make sense, but a Rickman Ranger, I down't fink so. ;-)
No, I just need to do something with the tired 1300 that's in there and get a little bit more power for towing (small goods trailers etc).
Cheers, T i m
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If its any use to anyone this long established company do engine re builds and gearboxes they, according to a mechanic mate of mine do them to very high standards but aren't the cheapest around....
http://www.ivorsearle.co.uk/
--
Tony Sayer



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wrote:
<snip>

Could be handy, thanks.
Cheers, T i m
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I've no idea what is easily available in that sort of engine size today, but the competition guys don't seem to use the old Kent based Ford engine in things like Escorts these days - unless their class demands it?
--
*How many roads must a man travel down before he admits he is lost?

Dave Plowman snipped-for-privacy@davenoise.co.uk London SW
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On 17/02/2017 10:46, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

A Pinto lump with uprated front springs would be simple, cheap and easy to fit and when needed, easy to repair. If a light powerful engine is required then either a K series or something Japanese would be my choice. Still won't beat the sound effects of the Lotus twin cam though.
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Think my niece's partner who races a Mk2 Escort used a Vauxhall unit at one time? Not sure I'd risk a large version of the K Series.

Very true - but I'll bet a decent used one would cost a fortune.
Obviously since it's RWD (I assume) the problem is finding a suitable engine and box or a way of fitting an engine to the original box. So wondered if one of the four cylinder BMW units would be a good idea? As there must be plenty written off.
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Dave Plowman snipped-for-privacy@davenoise.co.uk London SW
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On Fri, 17 Feb 2017 13:54:26 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"

It's all that sort of thing I'm trying to avoid, wanting any job to be as quick, cheap and easy as possible. That was the whole point of building the Ranger (over pretty well anything else available at the time) in the first place. ;-)

If I had a huge workshop and nothing else to play with then I would quite like to fit something that may not have been fitted before. However, there are at lest 4 motorbikes waiting to be done, the Messerchmitt KR200, a couple of boats and a million other smaller projects so I really need to do, so I try to make each job as easy as possible in the hope I get at least some done before I die. ;-)
Cheers, T i m
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On 17/02/2017 19:26, T i m wrote:

a man with similar ambitions to me!! a dozen cars, a dozen bikes , a 7 1/4 loco, and a house, all needing work
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On Fri, 17 Feb 2017 19:29:17 +0000, MrCheerful

I'm not sure I'd call them ambitions quite just I'm a sucker for a project and like taking unloved things and making them useable again. And that's the thing, not really interested in concourse or performance, just tidy and serviceable. ;-)

You trumped me, we only have 2 (if you count the Schmitt and the Enfield 8000) a van and the kitcar. ;-)

And again, only 9 here. ;-(

We probably make up for that with 9 boats of various types. ;-)

I'm also doing bits on / at Mums house ... bit's I still haven't done on ours!

Today, along with repairing a laptop for a friend (JB Welding some reinforcement on the hinge mounts), I was trying to design a 3D printable corner bracket to allow a straight wall light fit on a corner in Mums garden. I needn't have bothered do that of course but I wanted to. ;-)
Cheers, T i m
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Alfa flat four. Might be hard to make it fit though. ;-)
Tim
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Please don't feed the trolls

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