Least Troublesome Cars

And since you've obviously never driven a decent IC engined car with a decent modern auto, your views on electric being so much better can be taken with a pinch of salt too.

I'm utterly amazed at the claim that 40% of dwellings have their own garage. Where did this come from?

Harry Metcalfe has just produced a Youtube video that sums up my position very well:

I don't have charge at home facilities so my compromise is a Lexus hybrid, purchased used because the depreciation from new would have been horrific. I get the 'almost Rolls Royce level of refinement' driving around town and the mechanical simplicity of the drive train makes even a clutch and manual box look crude and unnecessarily complicated.

I'm not sure. In Sheffield, we recently had every street lamp changed, involving digging up every pavement. Cost billions (to be paid for under a privatisation arrangement over 30 years, natch). I did write in during the consultation suggesting street charging infrastructure, but had no reply, and to my knowledge, there isn't any.

To my untrained mind they more or less ruled out one possibility by moving pretty much all of the street lamps as far from the kerb as possible.

Should have been clearer - that's a direct quote from the English Housing Survey 2010. To my knowledge, there's no raw data, but this could give you an idea of dwelling type by UK household (from NOMIS/2011 census):

Whole house or bungalow: Detached 6,336,308 Whole house or bungalow: Semi-detached 8,268,561 Whole house or bungalow: Terraced (including end-terrace) 6,674,620 Flat, maisonette or apartment: Purpose-built block of flats or tenement

4,903,447 Flat, maisonette or apartment: Part of a converted or shared house (including bed-sits) 1,070,132

Detached, semis and flats /tend/ to have more access to parking. It's terraces that are stuffed.

IME people who live in London are astonished at the small number of flat dwellers in the UK, and at the high rates of owner occupation.

From what I gather, you're basing your opinion on a test drive. I think a year's ownership and regular use might help?

I'd agree with that bloke's appraisal. Wouldn't quite suit me as well as him, but a hybrid with charging at local 'pumps' is a possibility, and would cover most of my city use.

I had looked at the BMW hybrid saloons - a mate had a 330 which seemed nice. But I've driven so little the past 6 months it's not exactly front/centre of my thinking right now . . .

I've got the 2016 report for work, and found the following which confirms Rob's report:

James

In 2016, 38% of dwellings had a garage. Provision was markedly higher among owner occupied homes (53%). Over a quarter (28%) of dwellings had off street parking while 18% had adequate street parking which was most common for local authority and housing association homes. Only inadequate street parking was available for 14% of homes, and this was least prevalent in the owner occupied sector. Just 2% of the stock had no parking provision,

The most common form of parking has been the use of a garage although from 1996 to 2016 the proportion of homes with a garage steadily decreased from 43% to 38%. There was also a fall in the proportion of dwellings with adequate street parking from 23% to 18% over the 20 year period. There has, however, been a concurrent increase in homes with other off street parking from 17% in 1996 to 28% in 2016. This may be partly a result of garages being converted into living spaces and front gardens being converted into driveways. Furthermore, the increase in new build flats may account for some of these changes.

Fair comment but the step from ICE to EV is a quantum leap (in the popular sense of the word) and whilst I have absolutely no doubt there will be new problems to deal with, the step change in propulsive mechanism is so huge it?s pointless for anyone to argue about how a ?decent? ICE car would be as good.

Apples and oranges. I have discovered that I much prefer oranges. It?s as simple as that.

Tim

Soul EV seems to be limited to 8,000 revs, which is possible for ICEs (and at least one manufacturer has sold them). I expect the Soul would be able to go over 100mph with 200 bhp, if only it had some more g***s.

Of course. 8000 rpm of flailing reciprocating and rotating parts versus a motor armature. The numbers aren?t really relevant as the motors aren?t comparable.

Possibly but seriously, if it gets up to license losing territory reasonably quickly who needs to go faster on public roads?

Tim

Quite. ;-)

OK, your mind is set :-)

I think you're not persuaded by some of the more emotional reasons for using ICEs. What you describe as a grinding, flailing etc I don't see - and if I did, I'd fix it (most of the time). It's also an appreciation of the engineering and the often elegant solutions - and I quite like the sound of some ICEs. Then there's the whole evoking a time past etc. I could go on :-)

I wouldn?t be agin keeping an old ICE vehicle as a hobby and just for fun. Be fun to show off to the grandchildren archaic practices like ?changing gear? etc. If it?s old enough, maybe even ?pulling the choke out? and ?double de-clutching?. ;-). But for a daily driver, it?s EVs for me now.

Tim

Quite again. Seems Tim is determined to persuade himself electric is so much better in every way. Fine - but no need to try and convert others.

I'd ask again. After driving this - what - £30000 new electric vehicle, did he also try a similar new petrol one?

Bit like those who don't like autos. Based on the one they drove many years ago. Which was probably an old clunker anyway.

Why would I want to? Seriously, I?m not asking anyone to agree with me, just pointing out the gulf between the mechanics of EVs and ICEs and why I?ve no intention of buying a new EV again. Ignoring battery and charging issues for the moment, I don?t think anyone can argue that an ICE is a better method of moving a car than an electric motor. ICEs got very good over the years of its development but only because there wasn?t a viable alternative.

Battery and charging improvements now make EVs a viable alternative from many folk like myself. Obviously not going to suit everyone but that?s okay. In time though the ICE options are going to diminish/disappear.

Love a good auto. My Jag was very nice. Love EV power/transmission more though.

Tim

Doh! Obviously meant ICE there!

Tim

If your current vehicle requires double declutching and pulling a choke out no wonder you appreciate an new EV. ;-) But surely you should be comparing a milk float to that?

The only I can a way forward is to lease battery packs and change them at service stations.

At the moment they are built in, but if they became a modular that would save a lot of issues surrounding charging.

It might also bring down the capital costs of EVs.

All current EV's except 2 speed Porsche Taycan are top speed limited by the electric motor's rev range and single fixed drive ratio. They have plenty of power to go faster but the rotor would explode. Gearing them for top speed that used all the power with a single fixed gear would have a major detrimental impact on acceleration.

In the 1950's and early 1960's lots of Yanks used to option the high ratio final drive on cars with 3 or 4 speed gearboxes just for acceleration. Then they got 5 speed gearboxes, final drive options are now unheard of.

Rimac - Don't add gears just make the electric motor with the required rev range.