Diesel Engine swap into 1971 Mustang Fastback...

Just wondering about the feasability of placing a Diesel engine in a 71 Ford Mustang. I've always liked the 71 Fastbacks, and with the added bonus of them having one of the largest engine bays, I assume that this swap is possible.

Of course this would be for a biodiesel project, and perhaps eventual conversion to WVO (Waste Vehicle Oil) but I don't want to start looking at any fancy new type of diesel engine (common direct rail, etc). I was just wondering if anyone would know off-hand what Diesel of the Ford line-up would be the least amount of hassle for this swap.

I think my last post to this group was in the year 2000...things have changed.

Where is Bill S.?

Thank you for your time, Bruce Lortz Mililani, HI snipped-for-privacy@hawaii.rr.net (replace .net with .com) Former 66 Mustang owner Former 72 Mustang owner Current 93 Escort owner (sucks to be me)

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Dear Lord, give me strength.........

Okay, with that being said, please don't butcher up this car. My advice: The money you invest in putting a diesel in a '71 Mustang will never be recovered by the fuel that you may (or may not) potentially save. To me this smells like you want to do something because it's the latest fad and everybody else is doing it. (Or claims they are doing it)

Now, if you really want to do a diesel conversion that should be economical (if you run it for 100K miles) buy yourself a gas Chevette. The little junked out POS Chevettes are cheap. Stay away from the diesel Chevette, you can't get parts for them. Take out the gas motor and put in an industrial 3 cylinder Isuzu motor. New motors can be had for $2500. Mate a manual transmission to it and maybe then you can feel good about your conversion. Of course, if you have state inspections it won't pass, but the '71 diesel Mustang probably wouldn't either. If you try the Mustang diesel swap, you will end up with a worthless car or you will give up on it long before it is finished. My $.02 worth. It's probably worth less because I don't think you will listen to me anyway.....

Reply to
Kruse

A diesel Mustang? Have mercy... but if someone has to do it, a '71-'73 would be the way to go.

Paul

Reply to
Paul

You obviously live in the wrong section of the country. A few months ago I bought an '82 Chevette Diesel, 2 door, five speed for $200 bucks. It is rust free with brand new tires. Engine is shot. The 3LD1 Isuzu diesel 3 cyl motor has an SAE 3 bell housing and bell housing adapters to mate SAE blocks to GM trannys are made about 15 minutes away from me. I might be trying the project that I posted about this coming spring. There are several more fairly complete Chevettes in the area salvage yards. Have I bought the parts yet to complete this swap? No. But it is very tempting, especially since my state does NOT have annual car inspections or exhaust sniffs. Next time gas again goes over $3 a gallon I will probably take the plunge. Is my idea far fetched? Maybe. But so is the diesel Mustang.

Reply to
Kruse

It's absolutely NOT feasible if you want to be respected by anyone who owns a Mustang!

But, it sounds as if you are bound to try, so I have a nice wooden stake I am putting a pointy end on... got a water pistol filled with Holy Water... and just melted down a crucifix to cast a couple of silver bullets for good measure. And my brother, who lives down south, is sending me a shipment of garlic. That gives me all the tools needed to give you a helping hand with the project.

May the Great Kahuna give you the strength to resist!

Reply to
Spike

Dear Sir: I would suggest dropping a new ford crate motor with a modern fuel injection system than the diesel engine. If you talk to anyone who has a ford F250 or F350 the diesel does not get all the great of gas mileage. I know I am comparing a truck to your mustang but we are talking a weight issue here. I feel with the advanced technology of the crate motors thease days you can expect better mileage and performace. Also, the crate motor may bolt on to your existing tranny without extensive modification.

Reply to
rlhaag

There was a guy around here years ago that put a Perkins Diesel out of a ThermoKing unit in a early Bronco. I guess anything can be done if you're willing to try hard enough.

Al

Reply to
Big Al

Bill S. is in alt hi po big block ford mercury these days - too many nutjobs in the the RAMFM.

Reply to
Merc

Unforutnately, this post would most likely lump me in with the "nutjob" selection... (but thanks for the info).

Bruce

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RR News

Mostly my interest in biodiesel is about using waste vehicle oil as a fuel (as opposed to gaining milage with a diesel). In fact, I don't care that biodiesel is supposedly better for the environment (Although I believe diesel produces more particulates than regular unleaded gasoline. (a subject for another newgroup and/or thread)).

Here in Hawaii, during the short gas crunch, we had fuel prices spike to almost $4.00 a gallon. Pacific Biodiesel kept their prices at $2.69 a gallon. Granted, since that time, regular unleaded has come down a great deal, but there is nothing to say they can't jump back up again. But again, this really isn't about spending a lot of money to save a little. The concept of this project is for my personal satisfaction of running the vehicle of my dreams (71 Fastback) on a renewable energy source.

These musings of mine will most likely never see the first bolt turned, but I do want to look into it. I also agree with you that the crate motor would be the easiest and economical way to go for a new engine in a old vehicle. But this current pipe dream is not about easy, economical, or even "smart".

Thank you for your input, Bruce Lortz

Reply to
RR News

I realize the undertaking would be immense, but if I ever wanted a diesel engine in a muscle car, it would be in a 71 Mustang fastback (my favorite body style). Personally, my feeling is that a biodiesel engine would produce more interest if it was running in a nice car. This is really just "wishful thinking" because old mustang parts are difficult to source where I live (Hawaii) and in the 20+ years that I've lived here, I've seen perhaps 3 of these cars (71 to 73 Mustangs) running, and only 1 in a junkyard . Living in Hawaii, does give me an advantage for the diesel use though, because smog checks are non-existant and BioDiesel is readily available where I work.

I do appreciate the practicality of your statements though, and you definately seem more knowledgable in the subject then I am (I know little enough about gas engines and almost nothing about diesels). If I was serious about just getting any biodiesel vehicle running, I would most likely go the route of a used Mercedes Diesel from Ebay.

My concept about how this entire undertaking would unfold would be as follows:

  1. Find out what sort of diesel engine is a good canidate for the swap (my current stage)
  2. Source locations in California to do the work. (My brother lives about 4 blocks from Danny Bahn's shop in Rosemead, he seems to be a quality Mustang Modder, not sure about his diesel knowledge though).
  3. Find a chassis for around ,000.00 (Has to be a 1971 Fastback, ideally with the Nasa hoodscoops, cause they are neato)
  4. Depending on information gathered about question 1, find a diesel engine to have installed (solid rebuilt diesel engine prices anyone?)
  5. Have a knowledgable person perform the engine+transmission installation for me (I don't have a clue on how many man hours of labor this would take, or the price of said mechanic).
  6. Install other components myself (most likely done piecemeal over the course of few years. Estimated cost at 00.00+)

I feel confident about restoring/installing brakes, suspension, electrical, vacuum, and the interior of this vehicle. I feel your recommendation runs along the lines of "don't jump in head first", and that's damn good advice. I'm really only in the intelligence gathering phase, and will most likely experiment with the used Mercedes-Biodiesel car first. However, I was hoping that someone would post something along the lines of "hell, the 7.3L powerstroke uses the same motor mounts as the 428, and they go all the way back to the 82 models that use indirect injection"

I doubt that I'll ever get out of the "wishing" stage of this project, but I do recognize this newsgroup as being one of the better places for information.

Thank you for your input, Bruce Lortz

P.S. I used to have a 82 Isuzu P'up, that I got for free (with a blown head gasket) After fixing that head gasket that engine worked great. I ended up giving it back to the original owner (when I got the 93 Escort), and he gave it to his son-in-law, who turned around and sold it for an undisclosed amount of money. That being said, I do like the Isuzu engines (not that I've worked with the diesels).

Reply to
RR News

Did you not notice that diesel went way up too, and has dropped more slowly than gasoline AND remains at a higher price?

Kate

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Reply to
KJ.Kate

Yea. There are probably a half a dozen reasons for this, including the time of year when everybody uses heating oil for heating their homes. (A cousin of diesel fuel) But I think the main one is that the refiners are being mandated by the EPA to take the sulfer out by late 2006-early

2007 and that will increase the price of it. On a side note, with you being a Jeep lover, right? A recent 20/20 show, or maybe Dateline, I don't know, did a little bio on the diesel Jeep. EPA rated at 22 miles per gallon, in reality it got 11. Diesel is not always the way to go. Especially, IMO in a '71 Mustang. ;-)
Reply to
Kruse

Here is your biggest problem. The engine needed to power the weight of this car (to where it is driveable) would need to weigh about twice of what is in there now. Lessee, a '71 used a 351, a six banger or if you were lucky, the 429. If you would put a 6.9/7.3 in there, the brakes, suspension and steering would fail rather quickly. Diesel engines weigh a lot more than their gas counterparts and horsepower is usually down considerably. Do ALL of your homework on this, ask several experienced diesel mechanics, check the prices of all the parts needed and then, IMO, back up 5 yards and punt.

Reply to
Kruse

All due respect to Bill S and his expertise and seniority, the REAL issue was with a certain 'droit de seigneur' that he wielded... which, in turn, brings OUT the 'nutjobs'.

"Merc" wrote:

Reply to
Backyard Mechanic

French for 'The Lord's right'

"> was with a certain 'droit de seigneur' that he wielded... which, in turn,

Reply to
Merc

Well, that too...

The supposed right of a feudal lord to have sexual relations with a vassal's bride on her wedding night.

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droit du seigneur SYLLABICATION: droit du seign·eur PRONUNCIATION: drwä dü sn-yor NOUN: The supposed right of a feudal lord to have sexual relations with a vassal's bride on her wedding night. ETYMOLOGY: French : droit, right + du, of the + seigneur, lord of a manor.
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Reply to
351CJ

Reply to
cprice

It would be far easier to go with an ethanol or E85 converison.

For the last many months diesel has been more expensive than gasoline. E85 cheaper.

Combine these two factors and a few other things and E85 is the winner IMO.

Another benefit of going ethanol is that it's also a reversible modification and most of it, (stainless steel fuel lines, higher grade hoses, seals, etc) doesn't have to be reversed. The heart of the change is the jets in the carb to deliver a higher volume of fuel.

If I wanted to run a 30+ year old mustang on alternative fuel it would be E85.

Reply to
Brent P

Wait a sec....so to get him to answer a post, I have to let him doink my wife?

This forum has changed....

Bruce "Honey, can you do me a favor?" Lortz

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