A bunch of questions

Background: I have been driving Corollas since '84 (after switching over from a Plymouth Duster & then a Datsun B-210), & bought a new one in '04. I
seriously considered getting a Prius this last time - instead of yet my 4th Corolla ;-) , but... logistics weren't in my favor.
First, I'd promised (since '03) to sell my '98 Corolla to a buyer by the end of June '04. Went car shopping in April, thinking that was plenty of time. Ha! Quickly found out that it was a minimum of a 5 month wait for a Prius, & I couldn't even find one to test drive - or even just gape at. Despite trusting Toyotas - based on experience, I wasn't about to plunk down over $20K on a new model of car, sight unseen or undriven. Through the help of the internet (actually I *think* it may've been a woman on this ng who kindly e-mailed me about it) I was able to test drive an '04 Prius which the Ithaca, NY Toyota dealership had as a rental. Ithaca's 100 miles from here, but was worth the trip. Loved the car. But... there was the little problem of the gap created by selling my car when promised, & the new one arriving - sometime in the future. At least a 4 month gap, probably longer. My local Toyota dealership offered me a deal of renting me a Camry for $100/month until my Prius came in, but that could go on for months & months & months (they acknowledged that they had virtually no control over which option pkgs/colors arrived in their monthly Prius allotments), & so it would be just more $ down the drain - despite being a great rental offer.
Secondly, no matter how many times I did the math, I realized that it was economically smarter to just get another Corolla. Even with gas consumption figured in (although I wasn't figuring close to $3/gallon at that point!) along w/ federal & state tax breaks, over the course of approx. a 6 year ownership the Prius would run me about ~$5K more (than a fully loaded LE Corolla - for which I bargained likely crazy & paid $200 above dealer cost) for the pkg. options I definitely wanted on a Prius (IIRC, it was the 3rd pkg - not the lowest deal, but not near the top, either).
Okay... So... I'm presently driving an '04 Corolla, not a Prius. But in the back of my mind, I'm still possibly thinking of one for the future, after this car's paid off next year. I usually like to drive my cars for 2 - 3 year loan-free, & then sell or trade them before they -really- lose value (IOW, sell them just before they hit the "sell it now or drive it into the ground" stage), but we'll see...
In the meantime, I have some questions:
1 - What changes, if any, have already been made to this present Prius since '04?
2 - When is the next generation of the Prius supposed to come out? '08, or '07? In reality, several months early for either date? And what changes since '04 have been bandied about as being liable to happen?
3 - I've had automatic daytime running lights along w/ automatic full headlights (light sensor is on the top of the dash, near the windshield) - which I *love* - on my last 2 Corollas. Does the Prius have automatic lights - no manual turning on & off, except for brights? I got different answers on this back in '04 when I asked salesmen, & I couldn't find it in mentioned in the Prius literature back then. Odd, IMO, but true.
4 - What's known - if anything other than pure guesswork - about the future of the tax breaks for the upcoming years for hybrid purchases? Federal? NYS?
5 - I've noticed in the last few months that all-of-a-sudden there are more Priuses on the road here in upstate NY, & the local dealership has actually had 1 - 3 of them sitting on their lot from time-to-time. Are they still being built in just one factory & just in Japan? I know they added a work shift in '04 to try to help out with the long wait list problem - did they add more? Or are sales down, compared w/ initial sales? (Although I'm kind of doubting this last one...) Is there still a lag/wait time for the option pkg. & color one wants, to show up after ordering? Are dealerships helping each other out & doing trades w. each other as they do with other models, if they don't have what you want on their own lots? Or are most Prius orders still being filled via monthly allotments & you have to wait for the next fresh batch to show up & see if what you want happens to be on that truck, or forfeit to the next person on the waiting list?
6 - How about price - MSRP? I haven't paid anything *near* MSRP for the Corollas, & refuse to. In the end - usually by the 3rd bargaining session, the salesman/manager always moves down, down, down... to what I was after in the first place; they'd rather make any sale than lose it, is my understanding. I realize that supply/demand has mandated otherwise w/ the Prius, re: price. Are dealerships not budging an inch from the sticker price, are they budging a little, or are they still getting *more* than sticker?
7 - What tires come on it? Do they handle well? Do they corner well on dry roads, are they good in rain - no hydro-planing, or on snow? (I *hate* the tires Corollas come with, & change them over as soon as I can - they don't corner very well, & they're *horrible* on snow. Waste of $400, but I really can't stand the factory equipped ones - don't feel safe, esp. on snow.)
8 - The back-up beeper... is it heard only on the outside, or does it sound on the inside, too? How loud or soft is it? One can get it disconnected, I think? (I can't imagine my neighbors appreciating it if I were to pull out of the driveway late in the evening, esp. in the summers when windows are open...)
Okay, I think that's it... thanks to anyone/everyone who replies with info.
Cathy
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

I can't answer these questions since many of them 'depends.' What I can share is how I got my NHW11 03 Prius after losing my '91 Camry in an accident last September.
I looked at the Ford Escape and local Prius but neither was offered at any reasonable price. The local Toyota dealer was adding $4,500 to MSRP and putting everyone on a waiting list. Then two months later, they called me at work and said, "First one with $1,000 to our door gets the next Prius." I declined.
So I started looking at Ebay and in three weeks, bought a 2003 Prius, last year of that production run, with 49,300 miles. I paid $17,300 and flew out to Texas to pick it up. It now has over 64,000 miles and I'm getting a little over 51 MPG.
Toyota has shifted the allocation around from time to time and one California couple flew to Fairfax VA to buy a new Prius at MSRP and drive it back home. One thing for sure, Ebay opens your options, a lot.
There are two Prius warrantees, 3/36000 and 8/80000. My thinking is a Prius after the 3/36000 will have a lot of life left and give you years and years of good service. You won't get the tax credit but the reduced purchase price will make up for it.
GOOD LUCK!
Bob Wilson
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

Thanks. You're braver than I. I've bought things on eBay & had no problems, but somehow would be very leery of buying a big-ticket item - such as a car - via that route. And no matter how much I wanted one, I doubt I'd be willing to fly somewhere to pick it up. ;-)

No middle route of 5/50,000?
My thinking is a

Thank you - just doing groundwork, to eventually make up my mind...
Cathy

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

. . .

It was a one-owner car and the price and age were right. I bought it from a Toyota dealer so risk was minimal. I wouldn't have done it with an individual.

I understand in some states it is 10/100000.
Bob Wilson
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:>> Thanks. You're braver than I. I've bought things on eBay & had no

Okay, that makes more sense - to me.

Well, something that I'd find out easily via the dealership. I'm pretty sure I rmeember that the battery has a 10 year warranty, but don't know about the rest of the car, in general.
Cathy

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

8-year warranty. I understand the 10-year warranty is only in California (US models). I'm curious to know if the MSRP is higher where they have the 10-year warranty or if the cost is spread across those who have an 8-year warranty.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Bill wrote:

US Prius info:
basic new vehicle warranty: 3 years/36,000 miles powertrain warranty: 5 years/60,000 miles hybrid system warranty: 8 years/100,000 miles
If you purchase/register/primarily drive a 2004-current PZEV Prius in a CA emissions state, the hybrid battery alone is further covered under the CA emissions warranty for 10 years/150,000 miles. For a 2004 Prius those states were CA, ME, MA, NY, VT. For a 2005 Prius those states were CA, CT, ME, MA, NH, NJ, NY, RI, VT. I'm certain that more states adopted the CA emission guidelines for the 2006 model year, but I do not have that list.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Okay, back up to 10 years then - I'm in NY.
Cathy

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Also in states that have adopted the California emissions criteria (mostly New England states and New York State).

The MSRP is the same throughout the country.
--
Stop Mad Cowboy Disease: Impeach the son of a Bush.

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

So the answer, then, is that I'm paying for part of a two-year warranty I don't have. Oh well, I'm also making up the difference for someone else's child tax credit.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Okay. Well, most likely a moot point in my case, anyway. I tend to keep my cars for ~6 years each.
Cathy

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Bob Wilson wrote:

Huh? The only 8/80000 I can think of is the hybrid warranty on the Hondas. The federal emissions warranty is 80,000 miles, but I think only 7 years.
There are many more than "two" Prius warranties. basic, powertrain, hybrid, federal emissions, CA emissions, accessories, and IIRC separate ones for safety restraints and the early alignment.
http://www.toyota.com/vehicles/2006/prius/faq.html quoting from question 17: <quote> 17. What is the warranty for Prius?
Toyota has extreme faith in our hybrid technology, so Prius comes standard with the following coverage:
Basic: 36 months/36,000 miles (all components other than normal wear and maintenance items).
Hybrid-Related Component Coverage: Hybrid-related components, including the HV battery, battery control module, hybrid control module and inverter with converter, are covered for 8 years/100,000 miles. The HV battery may have longer coverage under emissions warranty. Refer to applicable Owner's Warranty Information booklet for details.
Powertrain: 60 months/60,000 miles (engine, transmission/transaxle, front-wheel drive, rear-wheel drive, seatbelts and airbags).
Rust-Through: 60 months/unlimited miles (corrosion perforation of sheet metal).
Emissions: Coverages vary under Federal and California regulations. Refer to applicable Owner's Warranty Information booklet for details.
Accessories: For accessories purchased at the time of the new vehicle purchase, the Toyota Accessory Warranty coverage is in effect for 36 months/36,000 miles from the vehicle's in-service date, which is the same coverage as the Toyota New Vehicle Limited Warranty. For accessories purchased after the new vehicle purchase the coverage is 12 months, regardless of mileage, from the date the accessory was installed on the vehicle, or the remainder of any applicable new vehicle warranty, whichever provides greater coverage, with the exception of car covers. Car covers are warranted for 12 months from the date of purchase and do not assume any coverage under the Toyota New Vehicle Limited Warranty.
You may be eligible for transportation assistance if it's necessary that your vehicle be kept overnight for repairs covered under warranty. Please see your authorized Toyota dealership for further details.
For complete details about Toyota's warranties, please visit www.toyota.com, refer to the applicable Owner's Warranty Information booklet or see your Toyota dealer. </quote>
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Cathy F. wrote:

Depends where you are. Fortuitous circumstances/lucky timing allowed me to go to a Toyota dealership last month and drive away with the model I wanted. The color ("magnetic gray" / gray leather) would not have been my first choice, but it's OK. Passing it up would have meant getting on a list.

I didn't drive my Prius before I bought it. I had driven an older one, however.

I'm not certain that driving a Prius is entirely about the owner saving money. I think it's a political statement and a statement of where one stands on the environment, oil wars, UBL, and all that business. Then there's the act of being different from the hoi polloi, and, for many, just a touch of smugness about it all. My Prius replaces a 13/17 pickup truck <http://www.davidillig.com/starcar.shtml .

I can't answer all of your questions. Detailed specifications for every model year are available on-line, however.

??
My '06 does, but it has "Package #8" @ $6890 list. You should go to toyota.com and select the "Build and Price Your Toyota" option. You will be able to view all of the standard and optional features.

www.irs.gov
I believe so.

My dealer knocked $1100 of the msrp. The discount would have been less with a lower-grade options package.

Don't know much -- too new. Handles well enough -- haven't skidded into anything yet. Not much snow in MD in July.

Inside. Too loud for me, and I'm hard of hearing. I'm 62-years-old. I have driven for many years (I was about 5-years-old when I soloed in a motor vehicle) without a beeper to tell me I'm in reverse, and without incident.
Davoud
--
usenet *at* davidillig dawt com

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

I am Picky. Picky-picky. So would've passed unless the color was one I really wanted. ASAlong w/ one of the prob. two pkgs. I want/could dela with. I know I don't want a high end pkg. - has stuff I'm not interested in, & way too much $$.

Oh, if I'd already driven another Prius it wouldn't bother me to order one. But I hadn't even -seen- one in person at that point! Now, having test driven the '04 model 2 years ago, I'd feel confident enough to just put in an order should I decide to.

Oh, yes, I agree, re: the reasons for buying one. OTOH, it also would be cost-effective *if* a person's been driving a car that costs over $20K &/or gets crummy gas mileage. But in my case I've never spent over $17-ish for a car, and I get decent mileage, & the Corolla has decently low emissions. So buying one would be a splurge - a rather large treat for myself. Even though it would also be a bit of a subtle statement.

Okay. Although I realized I already know of one change. In '04 the basic cPrius didn't come with a rear window wiper! You had to order the next pkg. up to get one, which for a liftback was absurd. I know that the wiper is now standard equipment - as it should've been from day #1, IMO.

Well, you know how the '04 was distinctly different from the '03? It was a big redesign. And the other models get a makeover every 4 years - each one's a new generation - that's what I meant. Is there a big revision due out 4 years after the '04 model was introduced?

Ackkkk!
You should go to

I've done that before, but I still don't remember seeing it listed. Maybe because it doesn't kick in until the high end pkgs?? I hope not, because it's one amenity/detail I'd find really difficult to give up... No more accidentally leaving the lights on, no more forgetting to turn them on at night in lit parking lots & then driving down the city streets sans headlights...

Is it in plain, normal, non-taxese English?? ;-P

Okay, thanks. So maybe a little wiggle room. Better than paying over sticker, at least!

Okay, will have to look into this more if it becomes a reality. I wish one could order tires the way other options are available...

You have me beat out - I'm 56 & have been driving since 16, but also tend to know when I'm in reverse. ;-) I can understand the beeper on the outside, esp. for parking lots, or if one has little kids - or maybe even pets, as a warning in the driveway. But I really think I'd rather silence the thing! And I have a long driveway - I'd guess my neighbors would rather it'd be silenced, too. Beep, beep, beep, beep.... arghhh.
Thanks for replying.
Cathy

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

I turned of my backup beep when I arrived home from the dealership and haven't missed it a bit. I have an '05 and don't know if it is as easy to turn off in the '06. I'm 65 and find the Prius comfortable and agile. It's a pleasure to drive compared to my Explorer. Comparing mileage figures and using, as I recall, $2.68/gallon, my Prius will use about $14,000 less fuel in 100,000 miles. That's one hell of a lot of hydrocarbon emissions eliminated too. Remember, Cathy, if everyone got 50 mpg gas would be a lot cheaper.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

It also has a *lot* of leg room in the back seat. When I test drove one, I first pushed the driver's seat all the way back (how I drive - I'm fairly tall & have long legs), & then sat in the back seat behind the driver's seat. My knees still didn't even touch the back of the drivers' seat - had a couple of inches to spare, in fact. The engineers/designers did a good job of making a car which is small on the outside manage to have plenty of room on the inside. I also liked the storage room: the double glove box, & the extra storage drawer at the bottom front of the center console. And the general fact that it's a liftback. My first Corolla - an '84, was a liftback & I loved it - could fit a whole Xmas tree back there, but then they discontinued that version.... :-(
Cathy
. It's

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Bill wrote:

Any one would save on gas dropping down in size from an Explorer to mid-size car. A co-worker dropped from her Explorer to a 4 Cylinder Escape and her mileage went from 10 to 20 mpg.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Right, and I applaud everyone who makes such a move, but when doing so, one should carefully consider going from 10 to 50 mpg instead. We tend to consider how cleanly a car can burn a gallon of gas. Even if a car burns a gallon as cleanly as the Prius, hydrocarbon emissions depend on how many gallons are burned.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Two problems though. One, the older trade-in isn't scrapped out, and two, if one cannot afford it it's one thing but if they can but don't then all they're concerned about is their sorry little ass.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Eventually the gas hog will be scrapped but yes, in most cases it simply moves to someone else. The solution lies in not putting these cars on the production line in the first place and, of course, involuntary sterilization of all males who have sired two children. :-)
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Site Timeline

Motorsforum.com is a website by car enthusiasts for car enthusiasts. It is not affiliated with any of the car or spare part manufacturers or car dealers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.