Does this seem right..?

Sounds like they may have damaged it during the repair or it could of been damaged when it had bad motor mounts and the new motor mounts could of finished stressing it. Hard to say without seeing the damage which they dont want you to see.

When it comes to transmissions you really have to shop around hard. A guy I know with an Olds Aurora paid over 3000 bucks for a rebuild. I told him, after I done some searching on the internet, I could of got him a brand new one for 1000 bucks after a core exchange (1700 without exchange). It was a 4T80E which is commonly married to the Northstar engines. They had to go back into his transmission because they missed the actual problem with the transmission. A piston in the valve body was cracked. Thats something that would of been avoided with the new transmission. Makes me wonder what they spent all that money on for a REBUILD. Wasnt on no valve body thats for sure... I would probably have replaced his transmission myself for 500-1000 bucks of labor in my cramped garage. I would have saved him a grand and he would of had a NEW transmission.

For future reference the transmissions in S-series Saturns is called a TAAT transmission. There was some changes between a certain year but you could of had one pulled from a wrecked Saturn for a couple hundred bucks I would assume. Then a small shop would of probably installed it for about 400 bucks or so. Since the TAAT isnt a GM transmission I'm not sure what they sell for new.

If you have a true GM car these 2 links are pretty good sources.

So did you pay the $1,800+ for the repair, or $240 for the diagnosis? Other than the top mount (torque axis mount), I can't see why the other mounts would have been bad at only 60k on the odo. I don't know how much time and energy you have, but sounds like small claims court (or the threat of) to me. Sorry for the hassle.

The dealership originally thought the problem was a drain plug or loose transmission filter. The guy also thought that the Coolant sensor may have been the leak situation. On his taking the car up on the life he stated that the "transmission fluid was not red but pink or purple in color with metal shavings" he then said it was not repairable.

I told him that 10 days ago when we came in for that 60,000 mile service the mechanic said the motor mounts were bad and he replaced them, did the transmission fluid flush and fill with filter, the oil change and filter, the replacement of the CT sensor and stated that all looked great. They even washed the car when it was snowing out.

When we showed them the work that was done and that the mechanic found no problem with the transmission he (service manager) stated that a problem like that could have occurred via spinning tires on icy roads and then hitting a dry patch, or rocking the car to get out of a snow filled road etc. I told him nothing like that has ever happened and the snow on the ground in upstate NY was a quarter inch.

He said he would get a used transmission for the lower price with a 12 month warranty. However the Refurbished tranny from Saturn with core charge would carry a 3 year warranty, and if anything was wrong with it we could go to any Saturn dealer for repairs. Grand total of the bill was $3459.00 my regular mechanic said that he felt the cause was the motor mounts that caused the problem. Since I cannot get the original transmission back from them it would now be pretty hard to prove.

I did think of small claims court and that still is an option.

Elector

Brutal... not the kind of bill I want at Christmas.

I would think you have a good reason to keep going higher and higher up the Saturn pecking order until you get answers. Generally whenever something happens its usually the last thing that was touched. Since it happened right after they messed with it for the service, I would think that the service had a lot to do with it. Add to it the fact that they won't show you the part, it sounds pretty bad.

I would tell them to go f*ck themselves and take the car out of there immediatly.

Thats why I do all my own work........

I have seen drain plugs over tightened which crack the case at the drainplug hole. I would pull the car from there ( after having them top it off ) and find out where exactly it is leaking from. You could have the dealer its at show you and hope they are honest enough to show you. Or have your local mechanic show you . Or you could buy a $3 can of brake clean , shoot the whole trans down and look for the leak yourself . If its around the plug then its very likely their fault.

1st of all, motor mounts dont just go overnight. In your 2nd post you referred to "my regular mechanic", which I guess suggests that this mechanic would have also had an opportunity to notice any problems with your car too during the long period that it takes for motor mounts to go completely bad.

Im not being mean here, and it is unfortunate when I read another horror story about saturns, but I dont think you can hold them entirely accountable as you do have a second mechanic who should have noticed any problematic issues. What has occurred between 30k and 60k miles and who did any work in the period in between? If the ONLY mechanic working on your car in between then was Saturn, then your complaint has more merit, but if not, then the responsibility of this unfortunate series of events is now shared between saturn and your "regular mechanic".

Personally (and again with all respect, Im not trying to be mean here) I believe there is much more to this story here. Also, IMHO, if that is the way that you were treated by Saturn, that sux and isnt the way. The salesman should have had more patience and couth than that, and if your engine was in such horrid condition in the 1st place, you should have been confronted by the service writer immediately, informed about the bad condition of your car and "asked" if you would like to talk to a salesman concerning getting out of a potentially expensive situation and into a newer or better car, before this whole series of events began.

IMHO, if your story is as you say, then I would immediately and without hesitation fire your "regular mechanic" and leave your local Saturn repair shop to go find a more competent mechanic!

marx404

To me the salesperson's involvement is a smoking gun. IMO, let's fix the car right and then if the customer wants to look for other options let the customer raise that option. Maybe it's just a sales guys being a sales guy and there's nothing else going on - I dunno...

Well the first question as to a whole story, well at 30K the Saturn Dealership did the service (They did not top off all fluids and the oil drain plug was loose. They gave us the 33K oil change for free. At

36K the oil was changed OK and at 39K, 41K, 44K, 47K, 50K, all the way through the 60K service this car has never had a serious problem. The Tensioner and pulley were replaced via a SAE certified mechanic do to a squeal ( I could scan every single work order and it would show service done correctly and no problems).

At the 60K I went in for the service which included the Transmission flush and fill, oil change and they (Saturn) said there was a bad Coolant Temperature Sensor, and that we needed motor mounts. I have all paper work. I also stated on arrival for that service to make sure the job was actually done right since we have not had that great a service with Saturn of Albany ( I also stated and proved on parking the car that there were no leaks of any kind. Oil or transmission or coolant. When we got the car back an hour and half later Saturn said that the car was in great shape. They also said that the little bit of red fluid was due to the transmission fluid being on the engine and that it would go away as we drove it. After 9 days it still was leaking and it was red in color, on the Saturn work order they stated that it also had a additive added to the transmission since Saturn recommended it at this mileage.

Not being a mechanic they looked for the leak and said it came from the top of the transmission and that some sort of pin or other cracked the casing to the transmission and that they did not cause it since they replaced the lower motor mounts. Now again the car ran perfect on service date in, and I did not question the motor mounts needing replacement, or for the coolant temp sensor or the additive for the transmission. I am not a mechanic.

However the initial costs quoted was $1804.00 then 45 minutes to an hour later it jumped to over $2500.00 and then they came back and said after examination the cost was not worth the repair. If I wanted it back as to when it came into the dealer it would be $240 for the look over. I was then offered a second hand transmission with a 1 year warranty for $2800.00 or a remanufactured Saturn transmission for $3459.00 with a full 3 year warranty and 36K miles. We opted for the full warranty then a day later the dealer ship called and said that Saturn needed a $1,000.00 deposit in order to even ship the transmission. It was at this point we (Wife and I) decided to tell Saturn that we were going to pay the bill and then sue them via the maintenance records and that Saturn was the last to touch the car and it had no leaks prior to the service. This made the guy at Saturn very pissed. So we are now looking at the end of next week for the install. They did however give us a brand new 2005 ION to drive while we were waiting.

I will not know more until next week.

Elector

I have to admit that your particular dealership shop sounds fishy, the answers that they are offering you, etc.. ie: when you asked about the red fluid on the engine, why didnt they clean it off, instead of telling you that it would go away as you drove off? No matter what your disposition, they should have treated you and done thier work profesionally. No, you dont even need to be a mechanic to recognize when someone is pulling your leg.

Like I said, it still strikes me odd that nobody noticed the symptoms of broken motor mounts or the smell of leaking fluid that would have been burning on a hot engine. You dont have to be a mechanic to notice things like an exceptionally shaky car in idle caused by broken motor mounts or the stinky burning smell or telltale constant fluid leak spots wherever you park either. Thats the part that doesnt leave me all warm and fuzzy.

Nonetheless, you need to go find another mechanic. If this occurred as you state (and kudos to you for keeping reciepts in order) then these ppl did not handle you nor your car in a very professional manner.

marx404

I just wanted to comment on this section. They may not have noticed any of these things because the mount may not have been that bad or bad at all. A lot of mechanics/service managers will look for anything they can to bill you for. Last January I dropped my car in for an oil change and a couple hours later I got a call that I needed a new serpentine(alternator) belt, air filter and battery. I told them they could go ahead with the air filter but I wanted to see the reports and belt for myself. I knew my battery didn't need to be replaced because three days earlier it was -29C with a windchill of -50C and my car started on the first shot after sitting overnight. The mechanic was worried about me because the 700CCA battery was only doing 489CCA at -15C. I figured almost 500 cold cranking amps should be plenty to turn over and start a 1.9L engine. A year later I'm still running the same battery that they told me needed to be replaced immediately and the other day when it was -20C it started with no delay at all. The same shop last spring told me that I needed my entire exhaust replaced from the manifold back. I told them thanks for the estimate and haven't been back. My catalytic converter had been replaced with a new one by the Saturn dealership 6 months earlier. I went to Saturn after jacking the car up and looking for myself. They left all the pipe and cat converter there and just replaced the muffler which did have a hole in it. They also charged me for a $2 clamp. $300 for the Saturn muffler was better than $800 for a whole new system including replacing a six month old cat converter. This wasn't at a Saturn dealer, it was a Canadian Tire shop. I've had great experiences with the Saturn dealer here in Fredericton NB, good enough that I'll definately consider another Saturn.

My advice would be never commit to anything unless you are sure the work needs to be done. I always go in if I have a problem and tell them I would like an estimate and a call before any work is done. If I'm suspicious I just tell them I don't have the money right now and I'll be back later to get the work done then I go get a second opinion. Of course you can only do this if the car is driveable.

The car did not vibrate so I had no notice of any bad motor mounts. Lack of knowledge in that area and I did not notice any smells until after the repairs. The car was running great. Very Strange

Elector

Hi Elector

I live in your neck of the woods and have visited Sat of Alb when I moved here 3 years ago. My SW2 had 37K and a cracked resonator. They told be I needed a new exhaust system. After I told them about the known resonator crack and I personally saw the crack they changed there tune. Did it for free. Recently I went there for some lug nuts (wheel nuts). They wanted $2.86 each. Told them where they could stick them. Got them here,

at .68 cents each.If your transmission case crack didn't affect the operation I wouldhave used Marine Tex or JB bond to repair it. What they are chargingis a clear ripoff. A used tranny from a wrecker $400 to $800.Try for advice regards Steve

Thanks Steve I may just do that. In the old days I simply went to AAMCO and it was fixed. Pretty high there also but a better warranty back then.

Elector

Why would they want a core if it was in fact a BRAND NEW tranmission? Usually cores are for rebuilt things with new ones carrying no core....

Thats what gets me too but its not the first time I've seen that before. If they know someplace that rebuilds them and pays that for cores they probably just give like a discount on the new one and call it a core exchange. gmpartsdirect.com is the site that I seen that at.

That's its exactly what I was wondering. A transmission from Saturn to Saturn on a Saturn bought there was a real kicker. However after it is repaired I will buy a new car from Chrysler. What a run around and now I have to sue to recoup most of the money back.

Elector

I just was in to get my remote keyless entry programmed on my 00' SC2 and came back that night and was checking over stuff and found that my oil was low....it was changed less than a 1000 miles ago, hasn't ever leaked and continues not to.....don't know if i trust my local saturn dealership after that.

Start checking it when you get gas to get a feel for the consumption rate. One qt in 2000 miles used to be within spec. Some use this much, some more and some less.