timming chain

If chain broke while engine was running the motor is junk because it is a interferance engine and the pistons would have collided with the valves and damaged pistons, valves, maybe rods or head too. If you want to keep car figure on a bone yard motor because it will likely be cheaper than fixing current one. A saturn is one car that you do not want to run to complete chain failure.

----------------- TheSnoMan.com

You may be able to get a good Saturn motor for low price at a wreckers. Here in Saskatchewan, there are so few Saturn engine failures that Saturn engines are melted down in the smelter, as there is very little market for them. A friend bout three for $50 each; he retrofits them into other vehicles.

Good Luck! David

I suspect that SnoMan is correct, but I would remove the head to confirm the actual damage.

230k miles? or km? At 230k miles I would suspect that the clutch is due, and if the timing chain failure was due to a life of old or dirty or poor quality oil, then there is probably more issues like high oil consumption which may be aggravated by a rebuilt cylinder head. Main bearings are pretty tough and AFAIK it is possible to do an inflame removal of pistons which will allow a proper inspection of pistons and conrods. and replacement of rings and conrod brgs.

If you are not able to do this work yourself, then a good used engine will probably be a more cost effective repair than a rebuild but YMMV and much depends on the quality of the replacement engine. BEWARE the 'guaranteed' engine from a wrecking yard. Guaranteed engines are usually more expensive. Wrecking yards seldom inspect any of the engines they sell, it is easier and cheaper to just guarantee all engines they know nothing about since most customers will not discover that the engine is a worn out oil burner until after installation and by that time removal and return is just too much trouble. It is usually easier to just sell the car, often with the lie that 'the engine has just been rebuilt.' Caveat Emptor.

Good luck.

Hide quoted text -

If that's true, then that's really saying something about the reliability of these cars. If they are being junked and the motors are fine, what, then, are these junked Saturns "dying" of then? Not the body... they don't rust! They are also good on gas, with the price of gas the way it is, used Saturns should be in high demand.

Let's see... around $80/hr for labor, what do owners do when the car gets up there in miles and the blue book is pretty low and they need new brakes, struts, ball joints, etc.? Sure enough, "It'll cost more to fix than it's worth" is usually what eventually comes out of most people's mouth. It's unfortunate too, since the average driveway mechanic with some patience, confidence, and a service manual can easily do almost any regular maintenance on this car and end up not draining their pockets. And have a smile on their face when done too. :)

Lane [ lane (at) evilplastic.com ]

I guess that's true, but then it must be true of many different kinds of cars also. People would rather just buy something new than be bothered with fixing them. I just can't see junking something that still has a good motor, transmission, & body. If one of those three has some major problem then I can understand junking it.

The average American just lives with car payments, often owing more than the car is worth. A lot of my friends feel they have to own a car with a new car warranty - in case something big goes wrong. Just out of curiosity, I pulled the expense records on my daughter's 93 SL2. I bought this car new in 1993 (Kathy was 3 at the time) and sold it to her a couple of months ago. It now has 222K miles on it. Over the last seven of those years, this car has cost us $4670 to maintain. This includes tires, oil changes, wipers, etc as well as a clutch and a timing chain. That's a whopping $667 a year - less than

2 car payments. One year it cost me more to maintain my road bicycle than the Saturn! This car still runs great and looks good. (Having said that, were the timing chain to break, we would probably junk the car.)

I used to work with a man named Dave who bought a new Mercedes or BMW every 2 years. He told me he drove them because they were cheap to drive. I replied "your car will depreciate more in the next 2 years than mine cost to buy. It gets far less miles to the gallon and burns premium. It cost 3 times as much to service, and much more to insure. Just where are you saving all this money." He had a new Mercedes, a new house, and a net worth approaching zero. America is full of Daves and people who would love to be in his shoes.

Terry

I guess you're right. I really don't understand that mentality, though. I understand from the point of view that you want a new car because it is (or should be) reliable, but that's about the only reason. If you keep breaking down and getting stranded, it's time to junk your car. If it's still ok for getting around, it's wasteful (from a material as well as a financial point of view) to just junk it because it's old or only worth $400. A lot of people could drive their cars a lot longer than they think if they could live with a few flaws. Just my opinion.

It is likely because there is not the many used Saturn being fixed up and the aluminum engine has a lot higher scrape value that a cast iron engine. If it was a cast iron motor they would let them pile up.

----------------- TheSnoMan.com

Personally I'd rather go buy a slightly used car for $7000 that I know has been taken care of well. Its when you buy a used Saturn like I have that probably was in an accident - thus having to replace a good amount of the front end. It burns oil, but I've gotten around that, and or over that.

It'd be nice to have a car with a sun visor, mirrors that aren't glued on, or burns on the headliner. The sunroof is stuck Simi popped, but no water or snow gets in. But all of these I can fix myself, and I'm really just whining. The car runs great even though its obvious that the previous owner beat the living shit out of it. I wish Saturn made S-Series cars still, I'd be down there buying my first new car. $15,000 "fully loaded" isn't that bad. I've gotten 40mpg on my automatic, and I can drive damn near from Chicago to St. Paul without stopping for gas.

People probably junk their Saturn's because they are afraid to undertake anything like I just recently had to do - replace front wheel bearings. I live in a city that has excessive amounts of Saturn owners, and when I was looking at options for a second car, people had some that were literally falling apart (front end turn from its rivets.)

And yeah, the Dave mentality is why most pe>> The average American just lives with car payments, often owing more

That's actually a good point. There aren't that many aluminum engines out there, so there may be a higher demand for aluminum.

By the way, someone mentioned the wheel bearing problems... exactly why is it that the wheel bearings tend to go on Saturns? I have had front wheel drive Buicks and Oldsmobiles on which they never failed the entire life of the car, so I never expected them to go on the Saturn either. They look pretty much the same as what the other GM cars have so I wonder why this is a common part to fail on a Saturn.

I don't think it's a common part to fail, it's just a wear item. Why does it seem to wear quicker than other vehicles? Who knows. Maybe they used cheaper components designed to last not quite as long to reduce costs, or maybe owner maintenance on average for Saturn isn't up to the level of other brands (anyone check what the recommended interval is in the manual for replacement of wheel bearings?)...

BTW - in reference to the subject of this thread, what the hell is a 'timming chain'?

Lane [ lane (at) evilplastic.com ]