amsoil - good or bad?

"That AmSoil doesn't even meet minimum specs was entirely my point. We agree. CJB"

and that was the reason for my snake oil comment also

That is probably not true. The XL7500 Product Line is API Certified and available in the latest grades (even for Ford's that spec 5W20). On the other hand, it is not a "true" synthetic. It is one of the faux synthetics like Castrol Syntec (heavily refined petroleum).

Amsoil may be great stuff, but the whole marketing scheme is a giant turn-off. The Amsoil corporate site stays just on the right side of the truth (everything is true if over hyped), but some of the individual dealers who market the stuff don't have much of a grip on reality and don't mind crossing over into the Twilight Zone when hyping the products.

Ed

Just because it doesn't meet API specifications does not mean that it cannot be leagues better than it. It is different in that it doesn't conform. It might be a far superior lubricant but if used in an already worn engine it might damage the catilyst. I'm not saying that is the reason for non conformation but it could be, so the 'snake oil' comment is not valid. It is true that conformation and accreditation to API standards prevents snake oil being sold and is therefore a 'good thing' but for oil enthusiasts who may want the very best without compromise then different standards may be more important. Remember that the API have traditionally set the lowest standard for oil below which is unacceptable. Nothing to stop somebody producing a far superior oil though it would be better if the superior oil also passed all parameters required to pass the API standard as well. This would stop any confusion. All standards are a compromise, none more so than the API minimal standards. Amsoil use a different set of compromises for some of their range. Hooray for variety and nonconformity. And I will probably never use their oil.

Huw Huw

Yes it does! It is a meet or exceed specification, it either meets the minimal API specification or it does not, that means it is NOT good enough! Period.

It may be a superior lubricant but may have a technical aspect like too much phosphate or zinc which is above the limit set for emission tests when burnt in significant quantity in a worn engine. That is just one example.

The API is just one standard setting body. There are many others which are less well known such as the ACEA and the Japanese one whose name escapes me plus engine manufactuers own standards such as Mercedes Benz who actually set high performance standards upon which other superior standards are based including the ACEA international ones. Personally I would, as I suspect you would, stick with an oil that meets higher standards as well as API standards rather than use one that does not meet API. Now if I was track racing then many aspects of the API compromise could be ignored and I would have no hesitation in using the Amsoil compromise which is biassed towards performance [or so they claim]. The paradox is that since Amsoil does is not accredited with API certification it is unlikely to meet any higher *official* standard either so no one really knows how good or bad Amsoil really is, except by taking their word for it. I am willing to give them the benefit of doubt by taking their word for it that it is a very good oil but not to the extent that I would use it in any of my vehicles.

I hope that explains how an oil can be excellent without being API accredited and also why I would not generally choose to use it given a choice of other oils that actually meet exceptionally high standards such as mb229.5 which sets the present benchmark and which also meets API lower standards. There is absolutely no point in using this kind of oil [an extended drain ultra high performance oil] whether from Castrol/Shell/Fuchs/vehicleownbrand, unless the potential is exploited in drain interval terms. Anything under 10,000 miles in a temperate climate and you might as well use a good dino oil.

Huw

I declare this thread closed! Stop! Stop that!!

You don't have that authority or power. Carry on everyone!! Onwards and upwards towards enlightenment ;-)

Huw

I don't know how much money Am Soil costs, but what does a new engine cost? Plenty! So why fool around with something that isn't

Use Mobil1. Aside from the extended change intervals, you're saving your engine parts from unnecessary wear. So it is said.

Lg

Unfair to call it that but I won't be using it.

A lot is 'said' as you see here and from the type of inference shown when you call Amsoil "Scamz Oil". Most of it is balls. As for Mobil 1 synthetic, most of the product range do not meet any especially high standards apart from the 0w/40 and the 15w/50 viscosity grades. Check out their spec sheets and compare to the other Mobil1 viscosity grades.

Huw

Unfair? There are only 2 things you need to know about Scamz Oil.

#1) They don't/won't/can't compete in the *open market* because? ( they would get their asses kicked off the shelves? )

#2) You void you engine warranty if you use that trash. It isn't reconized by ANY OEM as suitable lubricant for warranty purposes.

Now are you still going to hype the stuff? There's a sucker born every minute.

Lg

I would not hype any brand though you blatantly hyped Mobil 1. For me the brand is not important. The standard met by the oil is. For most of my vehicles I need API CH4 and mb 228.3 as a minimum combined with API SL while for other more demanding applications I need international ACEA A3 and B3 [which most Mobil1 does NOT meet] or Mercedes 229.3 or BMWLL01 but prefer to use oils meeting mb228.5 ultra high performance. Hope that makes sense and please note that Amsoil does NOT figure and I do not hype a brand, any brand.

Huw

Hope that makes sense and please note that Amsoil does NOT figure and I do not hype a brand, any brand.

Huw

" you claim that you are not "hyping ", but you still claim it is a far superior oil, even though it does not meet API certification ,and it does not meet any certifications for your euro cars.

now I may just be a stupid truck driver, but it sure sounds like you are pushing this snake oil to me.

I have NOT claimed so. I have said it could be and if you listen to Amsoil it is. I have explained that it is difficult to verify if it does not meet any specific standards. That is what standards are for. They can also be restrictive in some circumstances. I believe a lubricant can be superior and still meet the basic API standard which is why I use that kind of oil.

Of course it does. The same standards are universally recognised.

You said that. I didn't.

but it sure sounds like you

Then look again.

Huw

Woops! This does not make sense and is the result of careless snipping. AFAIK you are right that some varieties of Amsoil do not meet any recognised standard but I have not checked in the last two years or so.

Write in haste and repent at leisure. That didn't come out sounding quite right either. Sorry.

I'll stand by that one ;-) I have no view on Amsoil other than it might or might not be a good product but I cannot form an accurate view because it does not meet the official 'standards' that I would expect. Because of this an in the absence of any real evidence as to its suitablity, I would prefer to use another oil.

Huw

Now, wait a minute...as far as I know, Amscam has not paid the money to get API certification. That doesn't mean that the oil will not pass.

Am I wrong on this?

You are correct. However some of their oils have been accredited so we must presume, rightly or wrongly, that the remaining oils would not pass, probably for technical reasons not for quality or performance reasons but who knows?

Huw

Maybe I am missing something here, but I don't understand how Amsoil can be at the bottom of a API ratings list when they don't submit their product for API approval?

I don't use their motor oil, but I am a long time user of their other lubricants such as gear oil, compressor oil, grease tubes, and 2 cycle mix. They are also the only company thus far to offer an alternative to Daimler Chrysler's ATF4. I have not had a Amsoil related negative experience thus far and in many situations I have noticed minor improvements over what they have replaced. My only complaint is I wish their products were more 'available'. Currently I either go to their local warehouse or order over the web. It is a bit of an improvement now that they offer Bosch and Hastings products, since I use them as well. For motor oil I use Mobil 1 since I can usually get it a little cheaper and given my change interval of 3-4k miles I don't think I would notice a difference either way.

I think that most of the time complaints about Amsoil are from people who don't even use their products. I have yet to hear someone who has had bad experiences as a user, in fact it is usually the opposite, they are satisfied with the Amsoil products they use. regards, Joe.