Brake Asbestos Concerns

I've only recently entered the hobby of auto restoration, and for my first project I decided to tackle a badly-rusted 1988 Honda Civic (not exactly a classic, but this particular car has sentimental value to me). The degree of repairs needed is beyond what any sane technician or restorer would attempt to tackle, but - progress is being made. Since the vehicle is outside, the arrival of winter has greatly slowed the amount of work I can do on the body, so I started working on some of the components I could take indoors. Right now I've got a rear control arm with the brake assembly on the workbench, and I've begun sizing up what brake components need replacing. The rust is so bad that everything - shoes, springs, cylinders, even the parking brake cables - will need replacing, but that's not why I'm writing. The reason is because I'm concerned about hazardous dust that may be in this area. Before touching anything, I rinsed everything with brake cleaner and allowed it to run off. I didn't think there was any need to wipe with a cloth. Now, after a couple hours of working on this (long after the brake cleaner dried), I notice my throat is a bit irritated. That worries me, because I've encountered asbestos in antique radios (another hobby of mine), and exposure to it, if I didn't wear a mask, would cause the same throat irritation. I've heard far too much about the hazards of asbestos and I'm now concerned about my health. Do you think I should see a doctor, or is already too late? And finally, how can a non-professional safely clean brake parts without access to industrial brake-cleaning equipment? I very much want to pursure a hobby, or perhaps a career, in automotive technology, but I want to make sure I do it as safely as possible. Thanks for any advice.

Reply to
Chris F.
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If you're replacing the shoes and wheel cylinders (and I assume that you are) wash everything first in hot, soapy water (except for the drums and wheel bearings.) Save the brakleen for when you really need it (cleaning up hydraulic and/or friction brake components that you are planning on reusing.) There's almost no risk from asbestos; I suspect that it was not used by 1988 anyway, and even so there's little chance of a car that old still being on its original brake linings.

nate

Reply to
Nate Nagel

Reply to
Chris F.

If you're working with brake cleaner, which is really really nasty stuff for your lungs, asbestos is the least of your worries.

If you are worried about asbestos, get a spray bottle and fill it with water. Moisten the area and keep the air moist around it. The thing with asbestos is that the tiny particles get in the air and you breathe them in and your lungs can't get rid of them. If the air is damp and the particles are damp, they fall out of the air.

I think you'll be fine, but you can see a doctor if you want. The thing about asbestos is that it builds up... work around friable asbestos every day for a few decades and you can develop problems. An afternoon is not something to worry about, unless it is super dry.

Keep it damp, and do it outside or in a place with plenty of ventilation. If you are really worried about the brake cleaner (and you probably should be), wear a respirator rated for it.

--scott

Reply to
Scott Dorsey

I'd be willing to bet that the irritation that the OP described is more from working with rusty dusty stuff than specifically asbestos. No matter how neat I try to be whenever working on an old car I always have black nose goblins for a day or two afterward.

This is a neat trick for cleaning up backing plates, suspension components, etc. prior to painting:

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I love using this method for really rusty parts, e.g. old frame crossmembers etc. Lots less gunk to inhale than blasting or wire brushing, and you can "work" while sitting on your couch having a beer :) (which reminds me, I have lots of stuff to clean; I need to find an old battery charger or two at a yard sale so I can set up a tank in my back yard.) I did all the backing plates with this method when redoing the brakes on my '55 Stude; they really came out nice, and it's a joy to work on when you have to go back and redo them in a couple years when everything was all nice and clean and painted last time around.

nate

Reply to
N8N

What I find particularly ironic and stupid is that the "non chlorinated" brake cleaners (in the GREEN can- they must be safe!) contain a witches brew of hydrocarbons and MEK that reads like a superfund site and is flammable as hell. While the original stuff is just tetrachloroethylene. Yes, its bad for your lungs if you're dumb enough to use it without ventilation (hey, stupidity should be painful), but at least it doesn't melt your nervous system.... or blow up in your face ;-) Its amazing to me what a dirty word "chlorine" has become these days. You have to pay 2 bucks extra per box just to get the old formula dishwashing powder that has chlorine bleach in it.... and actually gets dishes CLEAN.

Reply to
Steve

Reply to
Chris F.

Steve wrote in news:- JmdnabAPqAwdbjUnZ2dnUVZ snipped-for-privacy@texas.net:

The chlorinated brake cleaner available to me is perchloroethylene -- dry cleaning solvent.

How long before they ban table salt?

Reply to
Tegger

Yes. Tetrachloroethylene, which is a little bit bad for you to breathe, turns out to be very bad for the ozone layer. So instead we use perc, which is very, very, very bad for you to breathe.

Sodiochlorium? It's made from a reactive metal and a toxic gas, of course they'll be banning it soon. It's also a major component of seawater, the same seawater that killed tens of thousands in the tsunami in Southeast Asia....

--scott

Reply to
Scott Dorsey

Car restoration is not an endevore to be entered lightly. The gang has answered your question regards abestos and the use of cleaners. Yes "ventilation", No or little dainger from asbestos. I think "No".

Being that this is your first stab at car restoration your assesment of "amount of rust" "condition of part" is in question. A GOOD part will have light to medium rusting where the paint or coating is gone and a fair amount of dirt, grime and grease where it is not rusty. It's really a matter of "Has the rust eaten through the metal at any point? Or significantly change it's streingth".If the control arm and brake parts you have are this bad I am concerned about the rust in the rest of the vehicle. Not only do you have to repair panels but if rust is deep then the body has to come off to get at frame rails and I don't know if you can do that to a Honda. But I digress....you didn't want to hear about this did you? Good Luck.

It might be more convinient to get the entire control arm, brake aperati off a car at the junk yard. Some junk yards are cheeper than others. The ones you pull your own parts are usually cheeper. You can work on the one you have so you know about it's pieces and then a used unit might be a better place to start for the final product.

If you are going to try to replace the bushings in the control arm you will prolly have to have that part done for you. Again not that familiar with Hondas but this is usually the case. So you may find a used part with servicable bushings.

I guess this is rear drum brakes? You can buy new cylinders. Fixing rusted, pitted cylinders is a waste of time. And prolly get a new spring kit too.

BTW I think you will be able to find most new parts you need readly availible

I think an 88 Honda is a classic car. Good looks and getting rare. I always did like them even tho I never owned one. If you keep it for 4 more years you can get antique tags.

disston

Reply to
disston

I google this and found indications asbestos was used in brake pads by some manufacturers at least as late as 2002.

Any sort of particulate matter can be seriously dangerous to your lungs. It is better to use an appropriate mask, no matter what sort of solids you are working with.

Reply to
HLS

The control arms are not severely rusted - like you say, just some light rusting in places where the paint has flaked. Inside the brake drum the rust is much heavier, to the point where most components WILL have to be replaced for safetys sake. The chassis itself has been a nightmare - large holes in the floor, rear bumper falling off, wheel arches rusted out.... this is where most of the work is. But I never expected this to be easy, and I'm willing to do whatever it takes to save this thing from the junkyard. Once enough progress has been made, I'll post some pictures so you guys can see for yourself.

Nice to see someone else who appreciates these older Hondas. An '88 isn't so rare; I still see the odd one on the road (though they might be newer, since these were made through 1991). But speaking of rare... when was the last time you ever saw an '82 Civic hatchback - at all? This is what my parents had when I was growing up - a silver one with red vinyl strips along the side - and even back then these were a rare sight on our roads. I would love to have it back - they traded it in 1991 and I'm now trying to find out what happened to it. It's probably long gone by now, but I want to at least confirm its demise, before I look for a similar car to replicate it. I actually did find someone with a similar car in Saskatchewan, but I'm in NB so needless to say I can't afford the transport cost, at least not right now. Heck, if I ever have the money and space, I'd like to build a collection of pre-1990 Civics. Some of these cars are now very rare, but could be had cheaply since few if anybody actually collects them. Call me an old stick in the mud, but I just don't like modern cars. Sure they're quiet and comfy and have all kinds of gizmos and gadgets, but they just don't have the character of older vehicles. I like cars that look like cars, not modern art sculptures.

Reply to
Chris F.

snipped-for-privacy@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) wrote in news:gg6jav$ndt$ snipped-for-privacy@panix2.panix.com:

And don't forget that other highly dangerous, insidious chemical: dihydrogen oxide...

Reply to
Tegger

I have done this sort of work before, and you are in for a job. A rustbucket is difficult to fix and make it last. Very very difficult.

You have to get the rust off EVERYWHERE, repair the damaged panels, and prime with anticorrosive primer. It is probably most successful to strip the chassis and have it media blasted or acid dipped, in severe cases (and I think you might have a severe case).

Anything less that a correct fix is money thrown down a hole.

Reply to
HLS

"HLS" wrote in news:XakWk.7803$ snipped-for-privacy@nlpi068.nbdc.sbc.com:

For a good face-slapping wakeup call for how tough (and expensive!) proper restorations can be, read the past year's worth of Hemmings Classic Car magazine. They've had a few very extensive restoration series recently.

The upshot seems to be to find a restoration subject that requires little bodywork, otherwise you're in for a long, very discouraging slog that will probably end up as a "for sale" ad in some publication one day once the would-be restorer throws in the towel. Not all aging cars are worth a complete rebuild.

Reply to
Tegger

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