Obviously the wheel was mounted crooked. But the rotor wasn't damaged and that's my point. But any reasonable person on a wrench should know enough not to tighten one bolt to extreme. It doesn't require a torque wrench IMHO. Of course as I've pointed out earlier in the thread any jockey may do the job using a torque wrench and it relieves the shop of any consequences.
Just for the hell of it I'm going to take off (in turn) each front wheel of my vehicles with disc brakes and retighten the rim to try to achieve what you guys are telling me. I'll be watching very closely for any changes. I don't expect any.
No it was not. Just properly tightening the bolts one at a time to the proper torque was enough to fix the problem. The wheel was not removed, which would have been needed had the wheel been put on crooked.
If you retighten with an ordinary socket and BO bar, you probably wont. The human brain and sense of feel will give an even slightly experienced person some control.
Slam it on with an impact wrench, all rotored wheels, as if you were a tire monkey. Watch it for a month or two. You may be lucky and you may not.
Not much of a test, there is nothing that says that the warpage would correct itself if you did that. Only some evidence that in some cases it helps.
Where does the warpage come from? You're sandwiching steel between steel. There is nothing to give or bend. No gasket material between like installing a head on an engine. If something got between then I can understand the claim.
........ just the other day I had a tire replaced. The mechanic threw the wheel back on the car and ran it up with his impact - "hammering" each lug. But... his gun is set very low, so the torque being applied to each lug is well under the torque spec. To hear it, it sounds like he's just hammering the lug nuts on. He grabbed the torque wrench when that was done and proceeded to get around a quarter turn (or maybe a bit less), on each lug nut...... ________________________________________________________________________
I bought two new front tires for my motor home at Sears in Fairfeld CA. I was worried when I saw the tech hammering the lug nuts on with an air gun. But then she went over the nuts with a torque wrench until the wrench clicked so I felt more at ease. After 400 miles of driving, the front end started wobbling. I discovered that five of the eight studs on one front wheel were broken and the flopping wheel was attached to only three studs.
I had just left the freeway when the wheel began wobbling. I was lucky to be driving on a city street. or the result would have been much much worse, for my motor home, for me, or for any one in my path. It was a very costly experience, involving a tow, one new wheel and sixteen new studs (only one broke on the other wheel but I had them all replaced).
Looking back, I realized that the technician had been too lazy to torque the lug nuts correctly, so she had greatly over-torqued them with the air hammer set too high, then applied the torque wrench only for show, to get the click without actually turning the already over-torqued nuts.
Now I torque everything myself. If a technician has to torque my wheels I stand and watch what he does. Then I re-torque them at home anyway.
Rodan.
They can both bend. When you tighten a lugnut to 100 ftlbs, it can apply thousands of PSI to the rotor/hub, more if using an impact wrench. Steel, cast iron etc all bend easily under such forces. HTH Ben
The torque applied to the lug nuts does not have to bend /warp the rotor. All it has to do is apply uneven pressure to the rotor. After that heat will finish the job much the same as heating a metal plate or rod while applying pressure to it. With the materials they are using today it doesn't take a bunch of panic stops to do it. Heavy traffic, coupled with the driver riding the brakes could well cause the problem.
My Safari started showing signs of warpage after the first aftermarkrt brake job. I think I will buy all new OEM parts and do the job myself. New rotors, drums, pads and shoes.
My theory:
You are sandwiching aluminum between steel. My guess is that the hub flange gets warped when the studs or threaded holes are pulled with excessive force into the fairly soft aluminum. The aluminum between the holes does no bend and thus the flange, and rotor warps slightly.
Steel rims are not susceptible to this as it is much softer between the holes.
Uneven clamping forces in the assembly, along with the natural stretch of fasteners, along with the thermocycling (especially extreme changes like water puddle quenching or pad bake at the end of a really long stop and mashing the pedal down for a long time, which causes localized hot spots and pad material transfer). The three things you can control as a driver are 1) driving through less puddle with smoking hot brakes
2) not holding the pedal down hard after a long hot stop - creep a few inches a couple times and lightly hold the brake pedal instead 3) torque your own wheels to spec. The only thing a tech can do for your car is #3.Toyota MDT in MO wrote in news:eKz0m.3249$ snipped-for-privacy@flpi144.ffdc.sbc.com:
I do believe you could also perform #4 on a horse.
I've found that if an automotive engine is missing, it's usually due to an ignition problem, such as old plug wires or a weak coil. Conversely, if a horse is missing the trouble is often in the fuel system. Try administering additional oats, perhaps augmented by a few carrots and sugar cubes.
The studs/hub flange/rotor is steel. On that you put an (soft) aluminum rim, which often has a solid flange, and you clamp that with steel nuts/bolts.
I think an analogy is if you put a flat sponge on a table and a flat piece of (printer) paper on top of that. Now spread your fingers and push them down against the paper. Watch what happens to the paper as you increase the force. The rim is made of soft material like the sponge.
If the clamping force against the rim had been even, instead of concentrated around the bolt, this would not be a problem. The flanges would not deform.
If anything the weakest part is the stud. it would stretch.
In order for that tho happen the rotor has to shift it's position. Between two flat pieces of steel?
But the aluminum rim is on the outside. The rotor is between.
Me, I would buy a generic set of Coopers for the car, keep the "badyears" for the turn in or just try to hit every piece of debris you can find and pop em to get them replaced.
IMHO, cheap Coopers kill a Goodyear integrity, Damn that is a s***ty tire. Don't look to BFG for anything better and a Michelin... Only if you want 80k miles out of a s***ty riding, poor handling tire.
Falken, Nokian, Coopers and Continental. Cheap tires that work quite well in standard sizes. Falken has a bad rap due to the huge (think 22") tires that are mounted on after market rims that won't balance, ever. Their standard sizes are pretty good tires. Al
I would buy Cooper tires too, mainly because Cooper has a factory in the State of confusion I live in.
One time years and years ago when I worked at a auto/truck/lawn mower/old style MG battery factory, when we came off of our half hour dinner break,,, I told one of those women, Shake it baby, don't break it, wrap it up and I will take it. She backed up about two steps.She said, What did you say?
It wasen't about brake shake I was talking about. cuhulin
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