1995 Toyota Camry Freon leak in aluminum tubing?

1995 Toyota Camry Freon leak in aluminum tubing?

I have a 1995 Toyota Camry with a slow freon leak. I can see the oil exiting from the vertical section of the foam rubber insulation that surrounds one of the aluminum freon tubes. It is the tube that runs across the car along the bottom of the radiator. The leak is visible exiting the rubber insulation at the vertical section on the drivers side of the car when it goes to the receiver dryer. There is no joint or any other feature that would be a likely cause for a leak, just a bend in the tubing. The tubing is covered with the rubber insulation so it is hard for me to locate the exact spot. Right now the leak is relatively slow and I can probably just put in a can or two of freon each season. Fortunately it is R134 which I can buy.

My guess is that there is a pinhole at the bend. Have any Toyota experts seen this before. Is there a way to repair the tube or do I need to replace it?

thanks Mark

Reply to
Mark
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Slice the insulation lengthwise to see the exact pinhole location. I would advise you to have a soap-water solution and wipe it on the tube to see where the bubbles would appear. Use any household sealants, putties to cover the hole, try to use those reworkable type of sealants first just incase you make an error. Let it dry and then wrap the sliced insulation with duct tape or any tape to closeup the sliced insulation. I think this type of repair is best for a 13 yr old car, it would be expensive to replace the whole tubing. I've had luck using RTV silicone (its reworkable for the first two days or so but once it was cured, it will sure last until the life of the car) on my honda civics radiator, but it was on a ceramic surface, but I think RTVs would hold well on aluminum surfaces too.

Reply to
EdV

"Freon" is the brand name for R-12 refrigerant that is no longer made. The refrigerant for your Camry is used in all vehicles made after around 1993 and is known as R-134-A.

The proper repair is to replace the section of tubing with the leak, but you can try something like JB Aluminum Weld first. Wipe the area that you are going to repair with rubbing alcohol to remove any oil on the outside of the tubing. If you have to remove any insulation, replace it with the stuff available at a hardware store and secure it in place with plastic zip ties.

Reply to
Ray O

Slice open the foam insulation and take a look exactly what you have, and where. It could be a crack at a bend, or at a weld for a support tab, or simply a flaw in a straight section of tubing. You can glue or tape the insulation closed later, it's there for padding and thermal efficiency.

You can try scrubbing the tubing down thoroughly and applying a two-part epoxy made for refrigeration repairs - with two caveats. The system has to be totally discharged (with a recovery machine, then recharged when you are done), or the refrigerant pressure inside will just push it's way through the epoxy before it sets. And the repair may last a week, or 10 years, you never know.

The more reliable repair (other than replacement) is TIG welding. If you can physically get to the leak with the condenser still in the car, they could bring the welder to the car and fix it right where it sits, and you don't have to chance any other leaks from disturbing the fittings and removing the condenser.

You will need a technician to recover the refrigerant and purge the AC system with an inert gas like Helium or Argon so the TIG welding doesn't contaminate everything inside. Then the welder crawls under the hood and seals up the crack. After they check the repair for leaks, then you purge and recharge the system.

(And if the system has leaked down to zero before where it sucked in some air, change the filter/drier at the same time you do the repairs. Moisture inside the AC system is bad, you get freeze-ups at the TXV or metering orifice and the AC starts and stops working randomly. The bag of desiccant crystals in the drier section can only absorb a few drops of water before it is spent.)

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Reply to
Bruce L. Bergman

Since you have evidence that oil is being lost along with the refrigerant I would say DO NOT continue to just recharge as necessary as the system is low on oil already and you risk locking up the compressor. The proper (expensive) repair is to recover what refrigerant is left, disassemble the system, drain the remaining oil out of all of the components, replace the leaking tube along with the drier, refill the compressor with the proper number of ounces of the correct type of oil (PAG or POE), reassemble, leak test with dry nitrogen, triple evacuate using a vacuum pump and a micron gauge, and recharge by weighing in the specified number of ounces of refrigerant.

BTW as was mentioned by another poster Freon is a DuPont registered trademark for refrigerants (mainly R12 and R22) manufactured by them just as Puron is Carrier's trademark for the R410 used in their systems. This probably doesn't matter though as people still call any adjustable wrench by any manufacturer the Crescent name, any locking pliers by the Vise-Grip name, any facial tissue by the Kleenex name, along with any others you can think of.

Reply to
Daniel Who Wants to Know

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Freon is DuPont's trade name for its odorless, colorless, nonflammable, and noncorrosive chlorofluorocarbon and hydrochlorofluorocarbon refrigerantS, which are used in air conditioning and refrigeration systems.

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The current trademark, serial number 72414415, lists it as "CHEMICAL COMPOUNDS IN THE FORM OF REFRIGERANTS, FREEZANTS, PROPELLANTS, SOLVENTS, AND BLOWING AGENTS FOR GENERAL USE IN THE INDUSTRIAL ARTS".

Reply to
clifto

Is this what the line looks like:

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The line going into the receiver/drier is the *high pressure* line. Better to replace it the proper way than to try temporary fixes.

Reply to
johngdole

I looked some more, if it's the all-alum line then it's a dealer item because nobody else seems to stock it. Get a new drier and o rings while at it.

Reply to
johngdole

no it's all aluminum and runs across the width of the car under the radiator....

I was just surprised that a what looks like solid aluminum tube would spring a leak...

yes it is the high pressure side...

I'll peel back the insulation when I get a chance and see if I can locate the exact location of the leak...

the tube runs along the bottom of the radiator and is hard to get to from the top of the car.

thanks

Mark

Reply to
Mark

Bet you find the "solid aluminum" is corroded through.

One of the reasons I don't like the insulated lines. Best repair is to replace the line.

Reply to
Steve W.

get a pro to try to FIX it hacly a " Dealer line" might cost more than the car since "Dealer markups" are a rip

Reply to
ransley

Yeah, it wouldn't hurt if the shop can do AC tube brazing, at least residential/commercial shops do them. See if the shop will route the tube in better ways. :) :) Of course always check OEM prices first as much markup there might be. .

Reply to
johngdole

Follow up.. I had a chance today to peel back the rubber insulation from the tube. Looks like water would get into the space between the tubing and the insulation at the vertical section and then be drawn down and be stuck there so the tube was forever wet. I peeled off all the insulation, doesn't make sense to me anyway, it's on the high side anyhow. Then using soap and water I was able to find that there is a tiny leak at the bend on the outside radius. You can eaisly see the bubbles. The tubing looks pretty good though it's not all corroded. I don't think there is any easy fix, any epoxy etc would not hold long enough to set unless I evacuated the system first. And I can't just hose clamp a split rubber hose around it because it's at the bend. So I'll just leave it, it took over a year for it to leak down enough to cause a problem so its a slow leak. When I re-charge I'll be sure to add more oil. I think the easiest repair would be to cut off the tubing at the bend and use a suitable rubber hose and clamps to fill in the removed bend. I would have to have a shop do this so I'll just leave it for now. If it gets worse, that's what I'll do..

For long term reliability, I would remove any rubber insulation that is around any tubing if water can get in there and sit forever.

thanks for the replies Mark

Reply to
Mark

The old rule-of-thumb is: if the system leaks < 0.5oz/year then it's considered "completely sealed"; if the system leaks > 6oz/year (1/2 can) then you have a leak. Somewhere in between go to Walmart and buy a can ~$7. Don't know if this still applies.

You can pick up a replacement pipe cheap at the local junkyard (they already evacuated all gases/fluids). Keep it around until you really need it I guess. Just bring your tools.

Reply to
johngdole

On Apr 19, 2:40 pm, Mark wrote: And I can't just

I wouldn't add too much, unless it's spewing out enough to make a mess and collect dirt. If you don't see much oil at the leak, I wouldn't add much unless you hear obvious compressor noise.

I'd rather just replace the whole section of tubing. Shouldn't cost that much if you got one at a junkyard. It really shouldn't cost *that* much for a new one, but the dealers are probably quite proud of them. :/ Always be real clean, and always use new seals. You don't want a weak spot on that high side to worry about. The hose will degrade, and some day, pssssssssss... Maybe even *POP*.. :/ Micky Mousing it will just cost you more in the long run.

You want that insulation. I'd leave it on. The tube is already toast, and the reason was likely a stress crack at that bend, from the bending process and weak tube, and later vibration more than likely. I doubt it was from corrosion, and you say it looked pretty clean.

Reply to
nm5k

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