'95 Camry Chronic Fuel Leakage

Our '95 four cylinder sedan was a great, trouble-free car for many years, until it developed a modest fuel leak. Little did we know how much of a problem this would be! First the dealer replaced the gas tank; the leak stopped, only to return a short time later. With no apologies or discount, the dealer then said it was a rusty fill pipe, and replaced that, with the same result: the leak stopped for a while, then returned.

I'm sure that some of you have guessed what comes next. Next time around we were told that it was "probably" the evap vapor recovery canister leaking gas. The price for the part was so high - about $400 for the part alone - that I went to to Ebay and got one for $100 from a reputable seller. The part *looked* authentic, and when installed the problem again went away, this time for about a year. Last month the leak started again, and the local shop said it was the canister O-rings, and replaced those. Yes, you guessed it, the problem came back again last week. The local shop said it was the canister leaking. The problem occurs either mainly or only after filling the tank completely, something we obviously try to avoid doing if possible. The only other clue I can offer is that the fuel gauge became inaccurate after the tank was replaced, and now reads a little high. This makes it harder to

*almost* fill the tank.

The car has 190k miles on it, but we hate to junk it, because both the engine and transmission are still tight and smooth, the body is still fine, and we had timing belt/water pump/CV joints/brakes done last Fall. The new brakes are the first ones the car has had that actually felt strong and smooth! The car still averages 30+ mpg per tank. So, does anyone have a a solution? I'm cross-posting this to the Volvo newsgroup because there are several clandestine Camry owners there. ;-)

Reply to
Leftie
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Oh, and we haven't gotten a Check Engine light at all. Just gasoline fumes.

Reply to
Leftie

Can you tell exactly where it's leaking from? I've never worked on a Camry, but the Toyotas I've dealt with have been quite good overall. There's only so many places fuel can leak from, and it's usually not too hard to see where.

Reply to
James Sweet

Initially from the rear. After the fill pipe was replaced the leak next appeared under the left front of the car, roughly where the evap canister is buried in the engine compartment. I don't doubt that the gas is coming from the canister; what I suspect is that there is another underlying cause that isn't being addressed. The 'replace everything until it stops' approach of the dealer has been replaced by the 'just fix what's obviously wrong' approach of our local mechanic. My housemate thinks they somehow mis-installed the filler pipe and that is causing the canister to flood with gas. Maybe, I don't know...

Reply to
Leftie

Now for a dumb question - has it been 'over-filled' with fuel at any stage? Even once?

Cheers, Andy.

Reply to
Andy

That depends on how you define "overfilled." It's gone slightly past the pump auto shutoff, but not to the overflow point. That was before the first canister was replaced.

Reply to
Leftie

OK.

Well, that would be a reasonable definition :-)

OIC. Probably irrelevant then.

Are you able to get a visual/easy removal on the hoses at the cannister end? There shouldn't really be any liquid petrol anywhere near it.

Cheers, Andy. (Reading/responding from the Volvo group, so please don't trim followups)

Reply to
Andy

I think the canister is buried - I can't even see it from above. To clarify: I think there was one overfill from a malfunctioning gas pump before the first canister failed - probably from the raw gas. After that, I would occasionally check the fuel economy by rounding it up to the nearest nickel after the shutoff. I' m talking about *two or three cents* worth of gas, here. That shouldn't be enough to damage a canister under normal circumstances...right?

Reply to
Leftie

Sounds about right.

Correct. That much wouldn't have been enough to fill the vapour line with raw fuel.

Anyway, apologies for more questions, but I'm pretty sure I missed the start of the thread - anyway,

Mention was made of the entire filler pipe being replaced - this was definitely replaced with the correct part for the car, yes?

I'm thinking there's some kind of strange vacuum condition pulling gas from the tank to the charcoal cannister. Stuffed if I know how that would happen though. Hoses hooked up arse-about on the cannister is a possibility (a long shot, but I've learnt to never rule anything out).

If it were me, I'd pull the vent hose that runs from the tank to the cannister at the tank end, start the car and run it under various throttle conditions to try and feel for any particularly strong vacuum.

Let us know how you go.

Cheers, Andy.

Reply to
Andy

Sounds like this might be one of those 'drop it off the workshop and tell them to just fix it' type jobs.

I'm not all that familiar with Camrys - do you get any 'check engine' light or codes on the dash whilst driving before the leaking starts?

I'm inclined to agree.

I found this online which outlines the system pretty well:

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Something (someone) blocking off the bottom of the canister where it draws fresh air (perhaps in a failed attempt to stop the leak previously?) could (and I'm taking a massive, massive stab in the dark here) potentially cause unusual amounts of vacuum on the fuel tank from the canister.

Realistically, the whole evaporative control system will need to be looked at to get a proper diagnosis. Components could be acting up causing strange behaviour. Someone who knows these cars needs to double check that the hoses are connected to the right ports to/from the canister to the thermal vac valve, the purge point and the fuel tank.

A '95 Camry? Hell, it's probably only just run in! :-)

Cheers and good luck, Andy.

Reply to
Andy

The new fill pipe was installed by a Toyota dealer. I can't work on it myself (poor health) but I'll see if I can get the local mechanics to do that check when they install the second new canister. My housemate thinks the dealer screwed up the fill pipe installation...

Anyway, two questions: if we never fill the tank completely, can it still pull gas to the canister? And is there a way to bypass the canister after it's inspected? I'm a firm believer in emissions controls, but this one isn't working properly. It would be nice if the car could get through one more Winter, as it drives better than some of the newer ones out there.

Reply to
Leftie

I basically agree with you, but I don't have a lot of confidence in the local mechanics - or the dealers! - to correctly diagnose the problem. We will probably have the new canister installed and then carefully not fill the tank to the top as we (hopefully) get another Winter out of the car.

Reply to
Leftie

You looking at at least an $800 bill for the canister install with labor? Do you support questionable emissions standards THAT strongly?

Reply to
Sharx35

$285 for the canister, via an online parts retailer, about $125 for the labor. Now what is it about containing unburned gasoline vapor that you think is a bad idea? If you say "This particular implementation of a vapor recovery system" then I'll agree. If you say "Recovering the vapor", then we have nothing to discuss...

Reply to
Leftie

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