Hi All,
Responding to that Amsoil poster got me into doing a bit of online research, I've compiled my findings here. Please comment and enjoy!
The ATF+3 / ATF+4 transmission fluid issue
As we all know, Chrysler vehicles with auto trannys are speced by the factory to use ATF+3 or ATF+4. Current recommendations are for ATF+4 in everything except minivans older than 1999. This normally would not be a big deal - except that over the last decade, a general consenses has been reached by everyone familiar with the Chrysler 4 speed auto tranny (known as the Ultradrive) that you have to change the fluid in it rather frequently. You can't just fill it with fluid and leave it for the life of the car. The problem here is that ATF+4 is EXPENSIVE, big time, because Chrysler has a lock on it! $8 a quart is not uncommon, and for a full Ultradrive flush you need at least a case of it. $100 for fluid alone isn't a particularly fun price to pay, espically when everyone else is buying Dexron and Type F and is paying a tenth of this.
Now, for most mid-90's vehicles, you can escape this somewhat by buying ATF+3, which isn't sole-sourced by Chrysler, and as a result is much cheaper. It's still not as cheap as Dexron, but it's nowhere near as bad as ATF+4. But, it's now been 4 years since ATF+4 was mandated, and more and more Chryslers are now needing ATF+4 for those those preventative maintainence fluid flushes.
At first glance, it seems that we can't do anything but bend over and take it in the shorts. There's pressure among fluid manufacturers on Chrysler to commence sales of ATF+4, but Chrysler hasn't given up this cash cow yet. Simply waiting out Chrysler in the hope that eventually the dam will burst isn't an option if you want your transmission to live. So, as it stands, we are screwed. Or, are we?
It turns out that there's some cracks in that dam already. This is what I have turned up in my surfing on the web.
1) ATF+3 and ATF+4 are Chrysler trademarks. Thus, ANY fluid manufacturer that uses ATF+3 on the bottle MUST get permission from Chrysler. Chrysler has a registration process for this.For reference, in the Product Data Sheet for Chevron ATF+3 Automatic Transmission Fluid, there is the following line: "Chevron ATF+3 Automatic Transmission Fluid has been registered with the Chrysler Corporation" There is also the line "Chrysler, Mopar ATF Plus, ATF+2 and ATF+3 are registered trademarks of DaimlerChrysler"
2) ATF+3 is mineral-oil based transmission fluid. ATF+4 is synthetic oil based transmission fluid.For reference, a Product bulletin from Gulf Lubricants for GULFPRIDE ATF +3 there is the line: "Vehicles manufactured after 1999 require ATF+4, a synthetic-based ATF only available through DaimlerChrysler"
3) ATF+3 cannot be used in transmissions requiring ATF+4, but ATF+4 can be used in transmissions designed for ATF+3.For reference, see Chrysler's TSB 21-006-01
4) The commonly-seen claim of synthetic motor oils that they do not need to be changed as frequently also extends to transmission fluid, a claim from none other than Chrysler itself.For reference a web link for Mopar ATF +4 sales literature contains the line: "The approved automatic transmission fluid for all vehicles factory filled with ATF+4. Check dipstick for fluid identification. A "fill for life" quality fluid."
For a second reference, a web link for sales literature for Mobile 1 Synthetic ATF contains the line "This unique, advanced technology has demonstrated extended drain"
The Chrysler TSB listed above also contains the line: "With ATF+4® fluid, color and odor are no longer indicators of fluid condition and do not support a fluid change." (ie: what do they expect that your going to use as a guideline for trans fluid change?)
Amsoil also claims this for their ATF (Need I post the actual reference, they claim this for everything)
5) At least one fluid manufacturer claims their product can "modify" standard Dexron into an ATF +4 compatible fluid.For reference, see LubeGuard's HFM-ATF Supplement
6) Many of the fluid manufacturers claim that ATF +4 is only available from Chrysler.For reference, see URL's from Gulfpride, Shell, and Chevron listed later in this post
7) The major oil companies are getting pissed that Chrysler isn't putting out on ATF +4For reference, see the imakenews.com article URL at the bottom of this post
8) There are a total of THREE manufacturers that claim to be selling Synthetic Automatic transmission fluid that is compatible with ATF +4. They are:Amsoil (duh) with it's Synthetic Automatic Transmission Fluid
Valvoline with it's MaxLife ATF
Petro-Canada with their Synthetic Blend Automatic Transmission Fluid
So, in summary, what I am concluding is that we are seeing the beginnings of a war between the oil companies and Chrysler over ATF +4, and Chrysler's attempt to squeeze it's customers. Quite obviously, Chrysler looks upon the lock on ATF +4 as a way to force people into the dealer parts departments, and as a way to gouge people for money. Yet at the same time they are not above catering to the "synthetic oil = extended drain" crowd (of which I am NOT a member) by winking and nodding that their special ATF +4 tranny fluid can last forever. I guess they are inferring that they should be allowed to gouge people because after all it's a "fill for life" Yah, right. In the meantime the oil companies are pressuring Chrysler behind the scenes, but if DC doesen't capitulate, they are getting ready to go ahead and start selling synthetic ATF and claiming that it's ATF +4 compatible. As time passes, and more and more Chrysler cars require ATF +4, the major oil companies aren't going to give up a source of aftermarket fluid revenue.
As for the idea that the synthetics (like Valvoline and Petro-Canada) that claim to be ATF +4 compatible are actually the same as Mopar ATF +4, well legally and technically, if those companies are not buying the additive package from the sole-source that Chrysler has defined, then they are not the same as Mopar ATF +4. HOWEVER, this does NOT mean that someone other than the Chrysler-blessed supplier of the ATF +4 additive package cannot come up with an additive package that is functionally equivalent. Obviously this will have to be done with a synthetic ATF. As of now, I am skeptical that anyone has yet done so, because the ATF manufacturers who ARE claiming that their synthetic ATF is compatible with ATF +4 are ALSO claiming that the same fluids are Dexron III replacements. There's plenty of ancedotal evidence that ATF +4 and Dexron III are completely different, (besides what Chrysler is saying) and it isn't logical to believe that Dexron III and Synthetic Dexron III are so vastly different as to make Synthetic Dexron III the same as ATF +4. To me, the early bird synthetic ATF producers are attempting to grab some extra money by getting a few fools to buy their fluid, who should be getting ATF +4 from Mopar.
But, sooner or later the installed base of cars that require ATF +4 will be big enough as to constitute an appreciable market, and one day one of these fluid manufacturers is going to come out with a synthetic ATF that claims compatibility ONLY with ATF +4, and NOT with Dexron III. At that time if DaimlerChrysler is still trying to hang on to their ATF +4 monopoly, it will be doing a huge disservice to the public, because people will not have any way of knowing what fluids really are equivalent. I urge people to write DaimlerChrysler and tell them to allow ATF +4 to be sold by aftermarket fluid producers such as Valvoline, Mobil and others.
URL's:
REMEMBER: A TRANSMISSION FLUID IS A PRODUCT THAT IS A COMBINATION OF A BASE OIL WITH AN ADDITIVE PACKAGE. THE ADDITIVE PACKAGE IS WHAT LETS AN OIL COMPANY CALL IT ATF +4. RIGHT NOW THIS IS CONTROLLED BY CHRYSLER. NEXT TIME YOU SPEND $100 AT MOPAR FOR A CASE OF TRANNY OIL, YOU WILL KNOW WHO TO CURSE.
Ted