You need to look at the total number of vehicles each company had on
the road at the time of the recalls, and the number involved.
The percentage of Toyotas on the road subject to recall, even with the
MASSIVE recalls currently under way, are significantly lower than the
percentage of either Ford or GM over the years.
The infamous engine mount recall by GM in the early 70's involved
something like 80% of all GM vehicles on the road at that time. I
installed a LOT of tie-down cables!!!!!!!!!!!!
You're preaching to the chior. Over the years GM Ford and Chysler have
recalled millions and millions of vehicles for even more serious issues
than this; Ford even got away with issuing dashboard stickers for
transmissions that could slip from Park to Reverse.
Toyota has one serious recall, albeit affecting a LOT of their vehicles,
and all of a sudden they're the worst car maker on Earth.
This is affecting people who would never buy a Toyota in the first place a
lot more than those of us who have had a few...or more.
OMG! I remember that! But it wasn't that they would slip into
reverse...I had a '76 Ford Granada with a automatic tranny that when you
put it in park it occasionally wouldn't engage fully in the tranny, but
on the column it was fine. The first time I discovered this, I had
parked it on a very slight incline, got out of the car and started to
walk away and then I heard "tick-tick-tick-tick..." getting
progressively faster and looked to see the car rolling away! Had to run
after it, unlock it while moving and jump in to hit the brake...Glad
there was nothing around! lol Thier fix at the time was to issue a
letter that said that this might happen and you should use the parking
brake to prevent it from happening... lmao! NO car companies would not
get away with that now, but Ford is a much different and better company
now than in the 70's....and you have to remember too - Recalls were a
"growing" evolution of car manufacturers and Gov'ts during that time.
Back in the 60's 50's, 40's - There were no recalls...Things that
happened on cars were considered "quirks" and owners were much more
involved in the maintenance and fix of the cars than they are today's
consumers, who demand 100% perfection all the time - no mistakes. So to
say that "they got away with..." when you are referencing anything
before, oh say around 1980 is kind of unfair. In fact, wasn't it the
whole Ford Pinto gas tank thing in the 70's that really got the Gov't
involved and the whole ball rolling on recalls and manufacturer's
Recalls are by far nothing new. I remember when the likes of USA Today
would front-page ANY recall GM or Ford had, no matter how insignicant
it would be as far as safety or reliability was concerned.
The big thing is the total number of recalls the Toyotas are having
today. It's totally in the tens of millions over the past few years,
and like a snowball rolling downhill, growing on an almost daily
basis. You can whitewash it any way you want, they have major issues
to deal with.
And, unlike the tire pressure monitor, or dome light malfunction, or
heaven forbid, the leaking gasket recalls GM had in the 80's and 90's,
Toyota has REAL safety and relibility issues.
Throttles sticking wide open.
If you feel that Toyota is being unfairly attacked, then you know
exactly how I feel about the way GM has been attacked for the past
Now, just compare the things on which the GM and Toyota were attacked.
Hey - just want to let everyone know that Toyota has gotten into
manufacturing keyboards and I picked one up today. Little pricey but
the quality seems
damn.....never mind... :)
Due to overly optimistic extended drain recommendations.
Talking the old Tercel recall, or the recent pickup frames?
As late as the early '80s , or whenever GM stopped using full frames
on their cars, GM also had a SERIOUS frame rusting problem.
The early Ford Taurus line had a serious problem with subframe mounts
rusting off, litterally drolpping the subframes off the body. (due to
body-mount washers disintegrating) The 80-81 Tercel rear suspension
rustout was fairly limitted to the "rust belt" and when doing the
recall, well less than 10% even here in "salt central" Ontario
required replacement. The recall involved punch testing, and
rustproofing those that passed the punch test. Some had internal
coating (like paint) from the factory, and some did not. I THINK it
was a dual source situation.
Toyota used to ALWAYS have 2 sources for everything.
2 different brake suppliers. 2 different tail-light suppliers. 2
different headlight suppliers, 2 different suspension strut suppliers,
etc way back when all toyotas were made in Japan. They were
interchangeable as an assembly although parts did not necessarily
interchange between assemblies.
EXTREMELY rare occurrence. Sticking partway open, yes - but , except
for the floor mat issue, virtually NEVER without warning. The sticky
throttle has ALWAYS been a "progressive failure" - with pedal effort
increasing before the throttles stuck.
Which have NOT been "brake failure" - it is a brake "feel" issue and
it only shows up in situations where braking is affected already -
like rough and/or slippery roads - where if you are driving sensibly
for the conditions it will NOT cause an accident. Nothing mechanical
I suspect that this incident is what caused both the US and UK
governments to pass a law laying out automatic controls as P-R-N-D-L.
I remember our government passing it after a series of AT cars went
backward instead of forward, I remember one horrific incident where an
old lady in an AT car was on a Ferry on the Tamar, but instead of going
forward her car lurched back off of the ferry into 30feet of water, her
body was recovered the next day.
Or perhaps it's just that they're global with a car that passes the
criteria of all governments whereas for instance the EU is very strict
on what cars can be sold in it's area, which is why firms like Ford and
GM have to make a totally different product for the EU.
That why they don't sell US designed cars there?
The UK version of the Escort was pretty close to the US version.
OTOH, GM had to buy Vauxhaul to get an 'in' in European markets.
I've heard they're junk, too...
A large part of why there are different cars for different markets is
that the markets have different needs. The Japanese and European markets
have fuel that is like 3 or 4 times higher than the price of fuel in the
US. SO fuel economy is more important than in the US. In addition, both
Europe and Japan are much more interested in fuel economy than we are in
the US. In both markets, there is less room for cars, so smaller cars
are more useful.
And, besides this, the people have different tastes. In the US, for
years people have liked big boat-type cars. In Europe, people have
preferred smaller, more nimble cars. For example, Olds was advertising
that it had the first 4-wheel independent suspension car made in the US
in 1987 or 1988. The Peugeot 504 on which I learned to drive had
four-wheel indpendent suspension 13 years earlier.
And the emissions and safety requirements are different, too.
vw have been 4-wheel independent since the 30's. those french citroen
2cv's were in the 40's. the fiat 500 was independent in the 50's. it's
basically only detroit garbage that is /still/ being sold with
horse-and-cart solid axles.
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