I will get under it and closely investigate everything in the morning. I'm going to do Jeff's tests and also attach the steering stabilizer onto the tie rod instead of the drag link. I sure hope moving it will correct the problem. First glance the stabilizer appears to still be good. I can't imagine there are any loose or worn out parts already on the front-end, being that everything is practically new. But of course stranger things have happened.
You are right. DW is nothing to take lightly. It gets the pucker factor up in a hurry!
You know, if the track bar being worn was the cause of the wobble, removing it wouldn't change anything. If it's already so worn that there's movement there, imagine the movement if it was gone. I know that the track bar is critical to this problem on the TJ and the XJ's with coil spring suspension, but on a leaf spring jeep, even if it's got square headlights, I don't think it's a contributor. There are just too many people with leaf spring setups that have trashed the track bar for more articulation.
-- Old Crow '82 Shovelhead FLT 92" 'Pearl' '95 Jeep YJ Rio Grande ASE Certified Master Auto Tech + L1 TOMKAT, BS#133, SENS, MAMBM, DOF#51
Quit trying to wiggle out of the fact that you give a flippant=20 answer to the orignal question that could have gotten the OP in=20 serious trouble. What I thought or knew was immaterial.
If you wish to continue this "discussion" in this public forum=20 you may. I will continue to repond that your original reply was=20 incomplete and could have gotten the OP in trouble.
C> Believe what you want, as I take your opinion for what it's worth.= =20
Seems to me it isn't much needed since there isn't much lateral axle movement anyway on leaf-sprung vehicles. I dumped the one in the back years ago. The local front-end mechanic (who also owns a 78CJ-5) suggested it should even ride better without it. We'll see because I plan to leave it off for now. Thanks.
If all of that stuff is new, I would not think the steering stabalizer would be so significant. Did you attempt the tests that I described? (If I described something incorrectly, did you try what might have been suggested to correct me?)
If you suspect the track bar is worn, and causing a problem with looseness, then removing the trackbar altogether is not much of a confirmation test. If yo had no trackbar, and complained of DW, then put the bar on to see if the DW went away, then you would have a reasonable diagnostic test. Taking the trackbar off is the same thing as having one on that had worn bushings.
The ball joints appear to be good. I did the push-pull-raised-tire test and it checked out Ok. All the rod ends are tight and lubed. I'll get the caster checked out next week. Explain, if you will, why caster would be a player in DW. This could be my problem. If the caster angle is off, wouldn't this only cause the vehicle to pull to one side or the other?
It was suggested to move the steering stabilizer from the drag link to the tie rod. When I did this, I still got the same DW. I thought I felt a little air in the stabilizer at the extended end while testing it, and will replace it as soon as I can find one.
Your track bar comment is noted. I'd like to leave it off all together because real estate up front is a premium right now with the Dana60. But will put it back on nice and tight and put the DW to the test again.
Think of how the forks on a motorcycle are raked. A chopper goes straighat ahead really good, but can be a bitch to turn, and a racing bike can turn on a dime, but the steering is very twitchy. The most significant difference in these examples is the rake of the forks, and this rake is similar to the Caster angle.
As I said earlier, caster typically does not play a large role in the adjustments of the front end geometry because it is pretty much set during manufacturing of the axle. The spring perches define the caster angle. Assuming the axle is the right one, the caster angle should be right. Of course, with custom modifications - lift - the caster angle can change enough to become a player in DW.
Caster angle is the imaginary line through the upper and lower ball joints, and the center of the spindle. Properly set, the caster angle should be about 7° towards the rear of the vehicle. That is, the upper ball joint should trail the lower by about 7°. Perhaps the number is a little bit different in your case, but greater angles will be more stable than lesser angles. When the angle drops to about 4° or less, then the tires will search for the straight ahead position, and this sets up the DW symptoms. There is an easy test for Caster angle ... Go to an open area and make a Uturn, or a manuver that simulates what you might do when backing from a parking stall. Turn the steering wheel fully to one stop, then begin going and see if the wheel returns to center on its own, or if it remains in Turning Mode and requires you to physically turn back to center. If you have to drive it back to straight ahead, then your caster is not great enough, but if it wants to go to center on its own, then the caster is probably OK.
In my motorcycle analogy, there are other geometry forces at play, so the analogy breaks down pretty quickly, but in general terms, it works pretty well. I am certain that my analogy will be corrected, but it works for now.
I am not saying it is not needed, clearly it is. But, I am saying that if all other parts are in excellent shape, a weak stabalizer ought not be so dramatic.
Having said that, I am ignoring whatever kind of tires he might be running, and if they are large, and heavy, then the steering stabalizer will come into play sooner than I am suggesting.
I just get the overpowering impression that he has some other problem that even a good steering stabalizer will not be able to mask for very long. How I get so much power from my keyboard and monitor is a mystery to me.
And, I don't hate you ... You don't use you Jeep right, but I don't hate you ... ;-)
He has a custom front end that sounds like it wasn't built properly.
The builder might not have known how to set the caster so just guessed. He certainly didn't know how to put a steering stabilizer shock on in the correct place so that implies he guessed at everything....
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
No, you are guessing. The front end is professionally built by Dynatrac. Everything is tight and fits correctly. I'm betting the caster is alright, but will get it checked anyway. I've also known quite a few people who have placed the steering stabilizer onto the drag link just like I have it. The reason it is on the drag link is because real estate is tight up front with the D60 and placing it on the tie rod initially interfered with the track bar. The track bar is going back on today.
If you have a question about my rig, feel free to ask me about it. I've been Jeeping for many years and don't guess or take short cuts when it comes to my rig.
Quit trying to wiggle out of the fact that you give a flippant=20 answer to the orignal question that could have gotten the OP in=20 serious trouble. What I thought or knew was immaterial.
If you wish to c> I take your opinion for what it's worth, which was worthless for=
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