Willys/Ford Engine Swap? Possible?

It will start and run. Whether it will vapor lock or freeze and flame out on climbout or overtemp when you go to takeoff power,is another question. But if I was on the ramp in an overrun third world shithole and it was fly out or get taken prisoner, I'd do it. It would, with some sense, get me home.

Gas is a bad diesel extender. K-1 isn't so bad. Some veg oils are probably OK, but don't ask me which ones.

A serious congenital defect, but we're trying to fix that.

Yes, the M1 Abrams. It's multifuel, like all turbines.

Different story entirely - I was just commenting on the jet turbine part. That's basically a blow torch - spray fuel out the nozzle and light it. If it burns and sustains the flame, you're in business. The USAF manuals I still have around for several models all specify what will work in an emergency situation and what usable substitutes are available. We had to keep a copy of the list because almost no civilian field had JP4 and we were always winding up in some podunk strip when Gulf coast weather caught us. The goal was to find someplace with some sort of jet fuel but a lot of guys wound up at some private strip or a crop duster operation - the jet I flew at the time required about 4000' of runway and I put one down on a 1500' dirt strip, so we could use about anyplace when home plate socked in. Now that I think about it, I did come home on 115/145 avgas from that one. They poured walnut shells thru the engine to clean it, then pulled the turbine to inspect the blades for cracks (avgas burns hotter in that case) and deposits. I got to fly the test flights before the bird was released for unrestricted flight after that.

I would NOT play those games with a diesel engine - I've spent too many hours tearing tractor engines and fuel systems apart to clean out what was supposed to be "good" diesel to begin with. Even minor contamination will kill a standard diesel - I'm sure Bill can tell all sorts of stories about trucks and a dirty fuel load.

There is a world of difference between an otto cycle diesel and a turb> So will just any old kind of 'fuel' work in a Jeep diesel then?

Even more common - put a jet down in some west-of-nowhere location and the AF will do the arithmetic: is the resulting inspection/repair cheaper and quicker than trucking in a load of JP4? We never sweated the vaporlock issue and freezeup (in RVN or South Texas) was pretty unlikely below 15-20,000 feet even in winter unless it was cut with water but that tailpipe temp was a bugger, especially on start before the RPM got up enough to keep the flame off the pipe. I did bring a few home with whatever the Army had available at the fire support bases in Vietnam - pumped by hand from non-descript 50 gallon drums - as about everyone in the chain of command agreed that spending the night waiting for a fuel truck was not a very good idea.

But running used Mac D's used fry oil in a turbine is a whole lot different than putting the raw stuff in a diesel engine. What works for turbines is completely immaterial to a discussion of diesel engines as we know them and comparing mil spec diesels to the civilian counterparts is equally unproductive. The damage to a diesel engine from trying to run it on straight gasoline (leaded or not) has been demonstrated time and again - sometimes intentionally even.

Bill is a little dense. That's all I can say, he does not read correctly what I wrote and, further, keeps posting the same link to a web page that isn't the whole story-it's a very generalized picture for school kids.

I have wrenched on both Diesel and Gas Turbine engines and Bill, apparently, has not. I know pretty well what you can and can't get away with fuelwise because I've seen the disasters.

Diesel fuel in turbines is usually OK, if temps are watched, short term. If the environmental freeze and coking points aren't exceeded,etc. Helos and small turboprops in the warmer climates, this isn't a problem. Avgas in turbines is (generally) bad. Gas turbines are to a goodly extent, naturally multifuel engines and aviation fuels are more engineered for the environment than the engine itself. Ground gas turbines are often "good to go with anything that will burn".

I don't know why anyone would pick 115/145 for jet use if 80/87 or

Kero is OK in diesels as long as lubricity is met (add oil) and cetane requirements are something like in bounds. Cetane requirements for Diesels differ with different engines, just like octane rating in spark engines. Some diesels will eat K-1 straight,some with a little oil, some don't like it at all. Almost all diesels are OK with up to

Jet fuels-except the JP-7 which went the way of the SR-are _NOT_ straight kerosene. Your chart is full of s*it. They are a wide cut of

Bill, if you tell me any of this is wrong, you're full of s*it and an old hard-on talking out his ass. Put up a photo of your A&P license on that web page and I'll maybe be more inclined to explain all this. I've made it as simple as I can and you seem not to be able to understand.

No. Each diesel engine has a set of requirements as to fuel that won't cause damage. But there are different possible fuels that will within those requirements work. If you have a specific fuel you want to burn, get the engine manual and read it. Some engines will burn a wider variety than others. It's just like a gasoline engine: an old Model A will burn various kinds of garbage "gas" that would kill any modern car engine.

Generally, Jet A is safe in diesels. I'm not guaranteeing it is, if you get a batch that's low cetane, you possibly have bought a new set of pistons, and neither the engine maker nor the fuel vendor will listen to complaints. If you buy it as Diesel fuel and it happens-and it has-you have a case, if you can prove that's what did it. I have driven diesel cars (and fuel trucks) on Jet-A and flown in turbine aircraft-legally and otherwise-on Diesel fuels and in neither case worried too much.

No. Each diesel engine has a set of requirements as to fuel that won't cause damage. But there are different possible fuels that will within those requirements work. If you have a specific fuel you want to burn, get the engine manual and read it. Some engines will burn a wider variety than others. It's just like a gasoline engine: an old Model A will burn various kinds of garbage "gas" that would kill any modern car engine.

Generally, Jet A is safe in diesels. I'm not guaranteeing it is, if you get a batch that's low cetane, you possibly have bought a new set of pistons, and neither the engine maker nor the fuel vendor will listen to complaints. If you buy it as Diesel fuel and it happens-and it has-you have a case, if you can prove that's what did it. I have driven diesel cars (and fuel trucks) on Jet-A and flown in turbine aircraft-legally and otherwise-on Diesel fuels and in neither case worried too much.

Gasoline will usually tear up the pump before it tears up the pistons-if the engine will even make enough power to get very hot. Usually they won't even start on gasoline, but if there's diesel in the lines and the engine is already hot they'll get out of the parking lot and the gas slugs'em. On gensets the effects vary-usually on Detroits we'd just drain the fuel system, check the injectors, do a compression test, and if everything looked OK fill'em with diesel and a couple of quarts of SAE 30 oil, and they'd be fine. On Cummins the rail pump would usually die,a rebuild kit fixed that. Cats had Bosch style pumps and gasoline damage,if the percentage was high, was Big $$$-as with everything on Cats.

Unleaded gas with a little oil would be OK on most turbines if they were trimmed for that fuel-if EGT and TIT (renamed ITT for politicorrect purposes now!)were in bounds it would be fine.

I have no experience with biofuels (besides alcohols) in gas turbines, ground or air. I don't think anyone else does either. Maybe you could apply for a research grant and buy one of Thornton's T-38s-and a spare runout J-85 for pretest on a stand-and research the matter. I certainly wouldn't recommend throwing the stuff in and flying without full testing of all the fuel tank and plumbing materials-airframe issues,as always, are the big thing. My guesss,though, if it is flammable and doesn't contain heavy metals that will attack turbine materials, at operating temperatures, and can be kept reliably flowing to the can nozzles, the engine won't bitch.

There are STCs to operate recip aircraft and PT-6 King Airs on ethanol for what it's worth.

You have absolutely no turbine or aircraft experience of any kind and very little with diesels. You just have a hard-on for diesels. Gasoline engines are toys and diesels are the real thing as far as I am concerned.

Every time you buy "Winterized #2" diesel, they already added kerosene.

I don't have a Web site, and there's no way I'm putting my A&P number on the Web, even though I haven't signed a logbook since 1988. It's the same as my SSN and I'd get it changed, but since I don't practice, why bother?

Bill oIIIIIIo wrote-believe it or not-

God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O

Ted Azito wrote:

This proves you are functionaly illiterate,oIIIIIo, like many ASE patch holders.

A seventh grader-even in today's public school-could comprehend that the writer(me in this instance)was differentiating-that means saying they are different, that means not the same-the Diesel or compression ignition engine, from the Otto or spark ignition engine. If you cannot comprehend this, you are even stupider than your posts make you appear. However, despite my admitted naivete, if you will, even I have to admit that this is not unlikely.

You know so much about Diesel, why aren't you driving one then? The Mercedes Benz is the best small diesel in the world, you know that then. It's a good thing DCX bought Jeep, the Iacocca era peckerwood patrol thinking is an endangered species.

I hope the EPA makes all diesels over 600 cid burn biodiesel so you get to spend hours making it work. Since you are such a mechanic, I'm sure it will be no problem for you to get those Celect Cumminses and DDEC Detroits running like sewing machines on the stuff. Meanwhile I'll be driving an American car with an OM 617-sitting in my garage now-under its hood. Maybe I'll even put a big chrome Moroso air cleaner on the turbo inlet so the musclecar mentality people will look good and see that engine cavity defiled like that.