Time to be worried...

Of course if the same car is auto-recognised in two distant places at the same time, far away enough from each other but close enough in time to make it impossible or unlikely that they're the same car, then it does become more of a giveaway. Then you're back to the situation of one innocent person having to prove that they're not a crook though. Provided that it's easy to spot the fake car then it shouldn't be a problem, but you'd still end up in the hands of the law for a short period of time and in my limited experience that's never any fun at all even when innocent.

On or around Sat, 24 Dec 2005 22:10:07 +0000, Ian Rawlings enlightened us thusly:

better yet, use the number of the local chief of police.

The scary thing is the bastards might have shot you before they realise they have made "a mistake", on the basis of the electronic intelligence they have received - and the Police complaints authority launches its usual white-wash.

Steve

On or around Sun, 25 Dec 2005 08:49:43 +0000, Ian Rawlings enlightened us thusly:

yeah, but if I were planning a heist, I'd hunt say a white mondeo, then put different plates on it to confuse the plot more, but which bleong to a differetn white mondeo..

On or around Mon, 26 Dec 2005 10:59:58 -0000, "Rory Manton" enlightened us thusly:

which is better, being blown up by terrrrists or shot by the police? you're just as dead.

Yeah, 'cos that happens every day, doesn't it? Get real.

Personally, I don't mind a 'pull' if I look or act suspiciously, in the end the Police are looking out for all our best interests.

I was pulled once as the suspect on a nasty murder. (1970s)

The thing I remember was how totally helpless I felt. I couldn't account for my movements on the day in question accurately, it was just an ordinary day. However two detectives took my woolly descriptions, zoomed round talking to people and filled my time in minute by minute. The moment when they popped the big knife from my car tool box under my nose and asked what was the last thing I did with it was a bit of a tummy inverter. I sat in the interview room and had to explain how that was the first time I really realised what was going on. They had a real person really dead. That only happened on the TV in my little life.

That evening, as they put me in my car and sent me home they said "We knew you didn't do it as soon as we spoke to you but we had to prove it before we could let you go." It's a good thing I'm a total and obvious wimp.

nigelH

Agreed, but unfortunately they have demonstrated they are incapable of doing so in an acceptable manner. One 'mistake' is one too many, the next one could be you. I have yet to hear a plausible explanation of why it was necessary to shoot an arrested suspect 9 times in the head, I'm not sure we've yet been told 'sorry it was a mistake', mostly it has been 'it wasn't my fault.' When we hear such an explanation I will consider wether they should continue to be entrusted with the powers they currently enjoy let alone any extras such as imprisonment without trial for suspects. eg those detected by ANPR.

Not quite sure what you mean, but I'd copy the plates off another car and then knacker it somehow to make sure it wouldn't be driven, then drive around in an identical car with non-stolen legitimate status registered to someone other than me. Then try not to do anything suspicious to attract attention, such as rob a bank or something like that!

I work from home and don't socialise much so for the vast majority of my days, no-one can confirm my whereabouts at all. I also have an absolutely woeful memory so I'd be in the shit in a similar situation!

So far my experiences with the police have been limited to being accused of minor offences that I didn't do, e.g. getting prosecuted for doing 25MPH in a 30 limit (copper told me my exhaust was too loud for his liking when I was 17 so did me for "speeding") or being pulled for driving on the hard shoulder (which I hadn't done). Never actually spent any time in the cells, but then I don't see any police at all any more as I live out in the sticks and don't drive much any more.

The difficulty is that because you are so totally helpless, it really leaves an extremely bad taste in your mouth afterwards. While the police do an essential job, c*ck-ups and small instances of dishonesty seem to make an impact far out of proportion to the real harm caused, due to the helpless feeling of being caught in a machine that assumes you're a bastard. Similar c*ck-ups by businesses or even the local council just don't have that kind of impact, presumably because you have the option of telling them to shove it and walking away.

I think I'd be suffering from paranoia for a few months after an event like that!

So, on how many days will you permit it, and what happens if its you or yours next time ? Carrying a bag of suspicious looking ----table legs ?

Get real, to coin a phrase. The "Police" as a service no longer act in our best interests. They are increasingly acting as a para-military government enforcement agency. Legitimate protest near OUR parliament anyone ? Protest against the visit of the leader of one of the most repressive regimes in the world ? All supressed by the Police service. There are still lots of good people in the service, just not in the senior ranks. And everyone obeys orders.

Steve

I think the police ballsed up - go and check the records - Stockwell police have a track record of being trigger happy - they have a higher rate of police shooting innocent suspects than any other group in the country.

At the point where the army trainers who train the police in the use of weapons state that they are uncomfortable with the personality types ("Gung ho morons who are more interested in looking cool to girls at the pub than firearms safety" was one sentiment that I heard more than once) then we need to *seriously* worry about the armed officers.

And shooting a suspect in the head is just nuts - it's trivial to design a device with a deadmans switch that goes off of the carrier ends up dying - shooting them in the head will simply set the device off.

I honestly believe (albeit on the basis of what has escaped into the public domain) that the officers in question were probably under orders but the orders were based on piss poor intelligence.

Yes, bombs on busses and trains are nasty. No, nobody wants more of them, however all that happens by assassinating suspects is that you up the game

- terrorists will simply come up with newer, faster ways to hit that are less likely to be intercepted. It's an arms race, and it's one that the police can never win as long as there is any pretence at the rule of law. At the point where the rule of law is gone then there is *nothing* to preserve - catch 22 guys.

P.

It does NOT stop the bomb going off. They use a dead-man switch. And this guy was totally innocent, murdered by people "protecting his liberty". Sure, he'd exceeded his visa, but I didn't think that was a capital offence.

Did he ? Who challenged him, and where ? A uniformed officer, or just a menacing looking couple of blokes ? With the lies, sorry, dis-information spread by Sir Ian Blair immediately after, what does anyone actually know ?

Steve

The policy was taken on advise from Israeli police, who have a fair old record of dealing with such things, which is why they listen to them and not us. I suspect the idea is that you need to make sure they're really, totally, not messing about dead so that they can't trigger their bomb as they croak. The deadman's switch relies on the person pressing it before they're dead, and the best way to make sure of that is to pounce on them and kill them as fast as possible, hence the policy. Not foolproof but the Israeli police seem to have found that it's the best thing to do in a bad situation.

Unfortunately it doesn't leave much room for error, as was seen.

Seems to be the case!

No, A deadman's switch relies on some one NOT pressing it, can be set to go off on RELEASE, or go off if its not pressed once a minute, so you can actually show the nice policeman you've got clean hands, or if you don't push the key in the right rhythm , or released by someone else calling a mobile. Or put it in his shoes, so if there is no pressure on the soles for 60 seconds it goes off.....

So, to be honest, dropping anyone really carrying a bomb is likely to be highly counterproductive.

And the Israelis have a worse record than even the Met. - can't even see guys in fluorescent green jackets waving white flags apparently.

Steve

Sorry didn't mean I wouldn't continue to discuss the subject just end of contribution. Sometimes wish we used the Merkin 'period' meaning at's it!

On or around Sun, 25 Dec 2005 20:19:19 +0000, Ian Rawlings enlightened us thusly:

if you start off by stealing a car (yer not exactly going to use a traceable one for robbing a bank, after all), 's a fair bet that it's been reported stolen and someone might be on the lookout for it. However, if you steal a car and then fit numbers form another similar car which ain't stolen, it only become suspicious if the 2 are side by side.

Hmm, somewhat contradictory there, releasing a not-pressed button. Interesting concept.