I have a 1998 Range Rover with 23,000 miles and the check engine light recently came on. When I took it to the dealer, I was told that the exhaust valves had carbon deposits and it would cost $1,700 to clean the valves or $2,400 to replace them with ones used in later models that would not have this problem. I asked if this was unusual to have this problem and was told that fuel additives are present in gasoline especially in the Souther US that combined with short trips cause this problems. I pressed and told that our similarly driven 1996 Toyota Land Cruiser had not had these problems. The technician said that the
1998 engine was a holdover from a time when engines used leaded fuel and it had been modified and then upgraded when Ford purchased the company. I called another repair facility and they suggested that I drive a few miles at
4,000-4,5000 rpm and use "Techron" which is a gas additive.
Is this a common problem and what do I need to do about it?
Yes, it's common. Yes, the engine was designed in the late 50's. By Buick, actually. Go to any GM dealer. They have many similar problems. Especially Cadillac. They make a "Top engine cleaner" that works very well. One of their service folks will know how to use it. Suck it in via a vacuum hose. The large port on the front of the intake works well. It works wonders, and it's slightly cheaper than $2,400.
FTR: Ford bought Rover sans Mini from BMW in 2000. BMW bought Rover in 1994. Neither had anything to do with the engine, those troubles were/are all Rover.
However, the best engine you'll find in a Rover is in the Range from
2002 until at least 2005. It's the BMW 4.4 V8 with a BMW drivel>I have a 1998 Range Rover with 23,000 miles and the check engine light recently
On or around 18 Dec 2003 01:45:25 GMT, snipped-for-privacy@aol.com (HugYourPug) enlightened us thusly:
FFS, I'm moving to the states and starting a Rover repair shop, if they can charge that much...
lessee... work required - I 'm assuming power tools such as air wrenches where they can be used (won't fit in everywhere)
disconnect inlet gubbins, say about 15 minutes if you know what you're doing. Remove plenum and manifold, maybe another 15 minutes.
unbolt exhaust manifolds, say 15 minutes each, some of those bolts are a bitch to get at. that's an hour.
lift heads, 15 minutes each. strip out 4 exhaust valves per head, another
15 minutes each. that's 2 hours.
cleaning valves, maybe another half-hour, plus if you're doing a proper job you should lap the valves in when refitting 'em... which is about another half-hour. so we've got to 3 hours.
another 2 hours to put it all back together again, so 5 hours... say 6 hours total work time.
you'd want head gaskets and a valley gasket, and i guess to be complete a pair of rocker gaskets - I think the top-end set is summat around the 50 quid mark from Real Steel. Say a hundred bucks for gaskets, by the time you get 'em posted to the states.
that means about $1600 for labour, which is a nifty rate per hour, even if you reckon on it taking a full 8-hour day.
if you had new valves, you don't have to arse around cleaning the old ones, but otherwise the job is pretty much identical, so they're charging 700 bucks for a set of 8 exhaust valves... Real steel list stainless valves from GBP 3.41 each... so a set of 8 would run say about 40 quid... say a hundred bucks, maybe.
and if anyone wants to take issue with the times, I pulled the complete engine out of my 110 the other day in about 3 hours start to finish, with no power tools and no pit/lift, just an engine hoist. OK, it took me about 4 days to get the replacement in, but that was mostly 'cos everything was slightly different and had to be adjusted, or different parts got to make it fit.
Had it been a straight, like-for-like swap i'd have done the lot in about 10 hours, I expect, in and out.
You're probably not far off with your guess here, you ever considered how much insurance costs in the US, any kind of insurance that is.
It makes us look bargain basement...trust me.
Salaries in the US are eye boggling to us, so is the cost of getting work done by a garage or any business. But when you figure out whats in their running costs you understand why they need to charge such high prices.
Our professional indemnity insurance has gone up 400 percent in five years, public liability by 280 percent and employers policy by nearly
250 percent. These increases inevitably get passed on to the customer or we take a loss to remain 'competitive'. We could employ two new members of staff for what various insurances cost us :-(
I figure we are catching them up, but sometmes I just can't quite get my head round how thigs are running in this country.
Pick up your local paper and take a look at what jobs are available, full time jobs for well qualified people in central London for $14K and £16K. How are people expected to live on this?
I'm self employed (in the construction industry) which pretty much means I can charge whatever I can get away with, which sounds mercinary. Basically when I get busy my estimates increase to a point where they stop being accepted. When I reach that point I know what I can charge. But it never fails to astonish me when people tell me I don't charge enough and the next day a customer will be gobsmacked how much an estimate is.
It's all perception, it'll never change, we always hear the stories of what the other guy is charging and the grass always looks greener on the other side, but it ain't, there always seems to be a catch somewhere.....well most of the time...:-)
The Buick dealer cleaned the carbon deposits for about the same amout the Range Rover dealer charged to diagnose the problem. So far, I have seen no check engine lights. They did discover a leak of coolant near the throttle connection and sent me back to the RR dealer. Hope that is just a gasket.
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