What to look for in a 110 V8 LPG?

If it's been done properly with a good quality SGI system, it should drive exactly the same on gas as on petrol. No "if's or but's" or other excuses by the seller, just exactly the same! Check for 8mm copper feed pipe from tank to vapouriser, if it's 6mm then it's been done on the cheap and *may* run lean at high throttle openings/rpm's. If it changes back to petrol under hard acceleration then it hasn't been set up properly either. Much, much better than vapourmix systems - almost no chance of the dreaded backfiring issues so often reported, normally due to ignition deficiencies. If you tell me what system it is then I may have further pointers for you. Badger.

You'll need an LPGA installation certificate for your insurance company. A professionally installed LPG system should come with the certificate, so check the seller has it. If not, you'll need to get it certified by an LPGA member.

Matt

Can lpg injection systems be fitted to carbureted engines?

AJH

Thanks Badger. I'll go armed with my calipers! If I can find out what the make is, I'll let you know.

Cheers,

Andrew.

Thanks Matt, I'll check for a certificate.

Cheers,

Andrew.

In theory, yes. A lot of mapping would be required to make it successful though - one such system is the recent OMVL Piro (Dream 21-P). Badger.

A certificate only proves that the converter was LPGA Approved at the time of conversion, nothing else. Read up on the LPG forums and see what problems have been caused by cowboy converters that were "approved"! A lot of insurance companies will still accept conversions without an LPGA certificate, as they aren't stupid and realise that the LPGA is a self-appointed body with no real clout! Far better approach is to ask the intended converter to supply previously converted vehicles for inspection and proof of recognised training as an installer (training certificate - for the type of system he intends to install on your vehicle!). Badger.

In message , Matthew Maddock writes

You MAY need an LPGA certificate for your insurance company - others may just ask for a certificate from a competent installer, and some may not ask for anything at all.

OK, I've had a chance to take a look at the setup now. First off, so far as I can tell, it's not a sequential system. There's an OMVL Millennium controller, a couple of Pitagora emulators, an OMVL vapouriser and a mixer just at the inlet to the plenum, along with a couple of what look like solenoid valves floating around. The tank is a longitudinal mounted single hole cylinder on a seatbox in the back.

It drove OK on LPG, although it was a tad lumpy on petrol. I tried to provoke a backfire on the overrun, but it wouldn't play. Overall though, the quality of the installation didn't fill me with confidence

- the tank is strapped to the tub as far as I could see, the wiring was pretty messy and copious amounts of zip ties are involved keeping things together/apart.

Possibly against my better judgment I ended up buying the thing, albeit with a significant discount - it's a 110CSW with a decent chassis and straight body, so a worthwhile base to start from. I've been thinking about the LPG system and I think I might start by ripping it out and getting the engine running well on petrol before introducing the added complexity of LPG. Apart from anything else, I don't think the LPG system as it stands is particularly safe.

Assuming this isn't a silly idea, are there any pitfalls to be wary of? Obviously I'll need to run the LPG empty first and probably doing the work outside on a windy day would be a good thing. Will there have been any messing around with the standard ECU in order to get the LPG working, or should it 'just work' once the LPG gubbins are removed?

My plan being once the engines running well on petrol to go with a proper sequential LPG system and a chassis mounted LPG tank in place of the petrol tank, with a small reserve petrol tank. Some part of the system, like the vapouriser, look pretty tidy, so could probably be reused. Other parts, like the tank, are probably less viable.

Cheers & TIA,

AndyC.

deficiencies.

Ok, standard vapourmix system then. OMVL Millenium (AEB Leonardo with a different badge!) is a decent enough system if set up properly - as far as vapour systems go. It might be running closed-loop, see if someone's fitted a lambda probe in the exhaust (should be, why fit a closed loop control system and run it open loop?). Emulators are a good sign that no-one's "butchered" the efi harness to knock-out the petrol side when running on gas.

That's confidence-inspiring, at least.

Tank must be securely mounted - just bolting the frame to a thin aluminium skin isn't secure enough in the event of a collision. No need to rip the complete system out however, just to sort out any petrol issues.......

I'd agree with that.

Based on the fact it has emulators fitted, I'd say it'll just be a case of removing the extra as opposed to restoring the original. Connections to efi harness for throttle position sensor (blue/yellow) may be (should be!) soldered in.

Vap. will most likely be different as well, due to the pressure control arrangements with an SGI system. Be aware, for SGI the base engine ecu needs to be running in closed-loop via Lambda probes to get a good running conversion, and the lambda probes for a 3.9 (14CUX injection system) are very expensive items, 2-off! All the ecu's are the same, but not all harnesses have the lambda wiring installed. The lambda fuelling map already stored in the ecu is selected by changing a "tune resistor" on the efi harness. Your current setup will not fuel correctly if reading off a std landrover lambda probe, it's not calibrated to operate with the output values of the landy probes as they aren't an industry standard 0-1volt or

0-5volt!!! Hence their cost. With the current setup I'd be looking for a welded-in boss with a std 0-1v probe retro-fitted.

Badger.

I didn't get a good look at the exhaust, so can't say if there's a Lambda sensor or not. I pick up the Landy next week - so I'll take a look then.

That's good news about the harness.

Yes, I'd read an old thread on here about tank mounting and that's what rung warning bells when I saw the tank mounting.

Thanks for all the info - that's something to look into. The Landy was originally a 200Tdi, the engine is ex-Range Rover, so I guess depending on the age it may or may not be closed loop. Hopefully next weekend will be a bit drier and I'll be able to poke around and find out more.

Cheers,

Andrew.

"AndyC" wrote...........

So assuming it was an LT77 box, did you change the box or just the bellhousing from a Defender V8 or are all those fitted with the Santana box? What I want to know is, can I get hold of a Defender (short) bellhousing to fit between a V8 and an LT77 box? I also want a bellhousing or whatever to fit between a 200 Tdi and a 4 speed ZF Auto box out of an RRC or early Disco.

Martin

so I guess

On or around 13 May 2007 12:07:53 -0700, AndyC enlightened us thusly:

It'd be OK if they've reinforced it significantly underneath. Just bolted through the alloy is no good, but if for example there's something nice and solid on the underside, I'd say it was OK.