Do you know what an EDR is?

Not a single sales person knew what an EDR was not to speak of disabling it.
an Event Data Recorder (EDR) is wired into your cars air bag system. In
the event of an air bag deployment this litttle solid state spy will record your speed, seat belt usage for all passengers, brake and throttle position and some mfr's record even more parameters.
I am told the 07 Mustang's "little spy" is located under the console. does anyone know how or who might be able to disable it?
These little boxes are in most late models...the data in them is going to be a tort attorney's and insurance co's wet dream.
Norm
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EDR is a relatively new acronym.... Event data recorders have been built into restraint contol modules for many years. The equipment to retrieve the data is still quite expensive and there are legal ramifications to the recovery of this data,,,,
However, I refuse to be the cause of an accident if I can possibly avoid it.... However, if I drive like I can cause an accident, I would be worried that the EDR can hang me by the nuts. There is no way, at the dealership l;evel, for us to disable this event recorder.... Even if it were possible, I doubt that I would because of little peckerheads that think street racing or "getting frisky" are part and parcel of vehicle operation.
Life's a bitch... deal with it.

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Knock wood. I haven't had a speeding ticket in 29 years. That still doesn't make the little spy any more palatable. Even boring sane drivers such as myself are at risk. This is a way bigger deal than the NSA screening offshore telephone calls by computer for terrorist leaks. And here we have this little frankenstein spying on American citizens creating a little digital records.
Right now, explain how this would deter street racing? It only records the last 20 seconds or so before air bag deployment. So idiots can race all over creation as long as they do not crash there will not be a trace.
There will be ever more increasing parameters recorded. Speed. Average speed. GPS location. Percent of time driving after dark. Miles to work. Etc. Wait till GEICO figures out how to get their hands on this data. Want insurance? Let us download you little black box, then we'll tell you how much *extra* we are going to charge you....Won't give us the info...? No insurance. No insurance...no financing.
Now suppose they start recording long periods. You take your car to a track day or drag strip for a sanctioned event...on the way home, under the speed limit, you get in an accident not your fault. The court gets its hands onthe box and WOW, look at that you had your foot flat on the floor 100 times in the last 24 hours (on the track)..."balif lock him/her up forever"
Jim Warman wrote:

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I wish I could have gotten the information off of my son's 1995 Camaro after he totaled it out. This is not so that I can punish him, is was so that I could prove to those dumbass cops that he wasn't horsing around when he was almost killed by a hit and run driver. The cops in this case just assumed that he was acting out because 1. he was a teenager 2. he was in a red Camaro, 3. he had two girls in the car. I was able to take evidence back to them to show that he was forced off the road and that their police report made no sense at all. In fact, it was impossible for the car to do what he says it would do in the police report. They were still not willing to change the report. I have has other similar experiences. You see, in cases like these, these event recorders expose the truth. The truth, should never be an issue.
Like one of the author opined. If you are driving right and obeying the law, these types of devices are your friend. If you caused an accident, you caused an accident...period. This is an investigative tool not an invasion of privacy, that is why it's limited to 20 seconds. Since it's only recording automobile conditions, presumably on public streets, there is no expectation of privacy.

disabling
In
going
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wrote:

Since it's YOUR car you should have the right to have or not have the device. When you are on public streets would you agree that if the gvt wanted to they could make you run around naked because "presumably on public streets, there is no expectation of privacy."
You sound like just another sheep....

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In Pennsylvania (at least), driving is a privilege, not a right. You may own the car, but you do not have an inherant right to drive it on public roadways.
If you DO drive it on public roadways, you've got a TON of rules and regulations (plus optional common courtesies) that must be followed. If you've ever been a student of modern commuter traffic, you would marvel that it works at all (99.9% of the time).
The first thing that happens in any plane crash, from a 747 to a Cessna, is the opening of the black box, to help in finding out exactly what happened to cause the crash. The hope here is NOT that the crash can be blamed on the pilot, but that the answers will help avoid future crashes in similar circumstances. Now, if the pilot DID screw up, I think we'd all like to know about it.
A similar little black box in my car wouldn't bother me in the slightest. In fact, I welcome it; in the event that there IS an incident, I trust that it would back me up, not point a finger of blame. I'm not worried. Yes, I like to drive somewhat faster than posted speed limits, but how often is that single element the cause of a crash?
But go ahead, disconnect your little black box. If you're all that worried about "government interference in your private life," stay home. Once you take your privately-owned automobile out onto a public roadway, your actions behind the wheel are NOT your private concern, but a public risk. What you do as a driver could well impact MY health and happiness, none of us drives in a vacuum.
And if all of these millions of little black boxes serve to make our roadways in any way safer, I'm all for it.
dwight www.tfrog93.com
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Dwight hit the nail on the head... am I above making mistakes? No, that's part of the human condition..... Bad choices, however, are something I can avoid...
At this point in time, Crash Data Recordings aren't ebing used a lot though I see a growing momentum. Analyzing this data makes accident reconstruiction easier, quicker and (in terms of manpower/hours) more economical....
Bad guys are bad guys... is it so bad that those of us that obey the rules be subject to some minor scrutiny?
Only those with something to hide are afraid of examination....

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On Sun, 01 Apr 2007 18:03:39 GMT, "Jim Warman"

For those of us who still believe in the principles the US was founded on (this lets you out), yes, it is so bad to have the gvt subjecting us to MORE scrutiny. Every day there is more and more scrutiny by our more and more oppressive gvt. You people are like the frog in a pot of cold water that's put on the fire. You sit there without noticing that the cold water is getting hot till you wind up cooked. Our freedoms have never been under greater assault then they are at the moment and you and others sit on the sidelines cheering on the assault.

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Reconstructing an MVA can be an inexact science.... A CDR can remove doubt about some of the events...
Here's the information available to those with the equipment to recover the data.... speed, throttle angle (position), brake applied (yes/no) amongst other non-judgemental information. Used to be (before ABS) they could judge your approxiamte speed and brake application by the length of the skid marks you left... Now, since ABS is doing it's best not to leave skid marks, there arises the opportunity that the scene may be "misread".....
If you were facing a vehicular manslaughter or criminal negligence charge, I'm willing to bet you would be more than happy to have this relatively benign information come along and save your ass.... Unless, of course, you have something to hide....
For my part... if I did something wrong and admit to it, there is nothing recorded in my RCM that can make things worse.... If I didn't do something wrong, the data in my RCM can prove that I am telling the truth...
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I think you're confusing the Constitution with your driver's manual.
Where are your precious rights (or mine, for that matter), when you operate a motor vehicle on public roads? Please - point me to them.
What is it? The so-called Right to Privacy? Non-existant in this situation. Maybe you want to plead the Fifth, to claim that your car should not be forced to testify against you? No, sorry, doesn't apply here.
Do you own an EZPass? How about a cellphone? Ever drive through radar or a traffic camera? How is it that your every movement is tracked and has been tracked for years, but you rail about a little black box in new cars?
You're worried about scrutiny? Do you have any idea how many video cameras point at you though the course of a day?
What freedom is it, exactly, that is under attack by this little black box? I'd really like to know.
Are there any legal scholars in this newsgroup that can help?
dwight www.tfrog93.com
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The EDR keeps track of everything you do legal or illegal. If you all are so worried about getting caught for driving illegally don't do it? When you drive down the road you risk running into speed traps or getting caught on cameras. If this "black box" makes you so worried about getting caught then its the slow lane for you. If you speed and are worried about getting into an accident, maybe you should think about what you are doing instead of the other retards on the road. As long as this black box is only used when I'm in an accident, then I'm not worried. Now if it's gonna send in data every time I speed that's gonna suck. But mainly if you are worried about your data you should either grow a pair and be ready for the consequences or drive legally. Now I do realize that some people can't drive over 30 without crashing but what about all of us who live on an old county blacktop that like to open her up every once in a while? I've done my share of speeding and drag racing and the 2 times my car got hit it was parked. So as long as these black boxes are only used in the event of an accident I have no problem, but if they are gonna send in data continuously I'm gonna stick with older cars, they are better anyway!
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On 6 Apr 2007 00:13:02 -0700, "84_mustang_5.0"

I'm amazed you all think the black box is going to be infallible at determining your innocence. So if you elect to accelerate "out of trouble" as many in these newsgroups do, your black box is going to show how you maliciously and purposely accelerated right into the side of the innocent guy turning left.
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wrote:

You make no sense. If you "accelerate out of trouble", then you won't have a problem since no one will see your black box. However, if you "purposely accelerated right into the side of the innocent guy turning left", they should hang your ass, black box or not.
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Let me try to be clearer. There are some accidents that you will not avoid. Having someone turn left in front of you is often one of them. When someone does that you have only a few options to try and avoid the inevitable. You can do nothing. You can brake. You can accelerate and hope to get clear before they hit you. In all of those cases the accident is the fault of the guy turning left in front of you. But in many cases the at fault driver is going to lie. So while you may have done nothing but try and avoid the crash by trying to accelerate AND NOT HAVE EXCEEDED the speed limit... your black box is only going to show that last few seconds. There will be more then one way to spin the black boxes showing of full throttle on your part just before the accident.
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wrote:

You merely prove my point in the frog story. The MEN who founded this country would be turning over in their graves were they to see what sniveling serfs most of the citizens have allowed themselves to become as they kneel before their gvt and beg for their "privileges". The RIGHTS not expressly granted to the Fed gvt nor reserved to the states are the PEOPLE. Too bad no one cares anymore.
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Ah. In other words, you have no answer. You want to scream and pull your hair about how the Man is trampling over your precious Rights, but you don't know what precious Rights the Man is trampling.
Me, I don't trust this whole internets thing. Just look at the one entity - Google. What an incredible undertaking it is to gather and retain all available information on all available users. Every post you've ever made is kept, just in case it can be used against you in the future. Now they entice you with gigabytes of storage, just to be able to track and file away your email. They dangle huge megabytes of online storage in front of you, hoping that you'll store your personal files in there, so that they can keep copies of everything.
If you want to invent conspiracies, start there!
dwight www.tfrog93.com
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wrote:

Driving is a right in every state. Like many rights the courts have ruled that there are legitimate reasons that there may be some controls as long as the basic underlying right remains. I doubt you can find any state where the issuance of a license is at the whim of the state and where a licence can be revoked for no articulated reason. Do you have a right to breathe the air? I'll assume you think you do yet the gvt has put many restrictions on that right including in many locations outlawing your right to exhale cigarette smoke in certain locations. SO does that make breathing a privilege?
You may own

Yes I do.

Commercial use is a different part of the law.

That's great, then get one.

In most cases if you are found to be going faster then the limit it will be prima facie (probably spelled wrong) evidence that you are in the wrong. Yet you are ready to provide evidence against yourself. Strange. Sure, it could back you up, but will it be up to you whether it gets used or not against you? If they extend the recording time to 60 minutes and you have been dicking around and speeding for the first 50 minutes but drove at the limit at the time of the accident how will that look in court when they introduce as evidence you speeding JUST 10 minutes before the accident.

That's a completely separate issue then whether I should be forced to provide a spy that might erroneously suggest I am at fault. No one is saying people aren't responsible for their actions. You are just creating a straw man having nothing to do with the question at hand.
What you

See comment above.

Well, then when are you getting a black box installed that limits your speed to nothing more then 60 mph, after all, that would make our roadways safer.

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Ashton Crusher wrote:

No you do not. In Louisiana the law specifically states driving is a privilege that may be removed at any time. I know a lot of states laws specifically read that way as well. In an IM someone tells me that Ohio is the same way, specifically called a privilege, not a right.
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What you all are missing in the "rights" discussion is that "...the people have the right to be secure in their papers and personal effects..."
Data that you created is being stored without your consent and will be accessed without your consent.
WindsorFox wrote:

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