MAF failure in 95 GT

That's kind of uncommon. The worst part is that if your MAF did go bad, you could get a bigger unit from C&L for WAY cheaper than you paid at a dealer (I'm guessing about the dealer part). I can't believe you got charged 80 bucks for labor considering it only takes like 15-20 ,ins to install. I do hope it worked.

HOLY CRAP Bill!

When the one on my 95 GT went bad, I paid $75 for a new one at Autolife and replaced it in their parking lot with a borrowed screwdriver in 5 minutes.. and *I'm* a girl who had never seen one before!

If it starts to go haywire on you, try cleaning it next time. All of the symptoms you described are what I experienced, and the results were the same after replacement.

Now, as regular maintenance, I clean mine. It's easy to do... you can learn it in a minute or so right here in this newsgroup :)

Kate

98 Cobra Drop Top

I see some of the knee-jerk answers.... MAF failures can be an either/or. Gunk will slowly build up on the sensing elements and result is a very slow degradation of performance - so imperceptable that it will almost seem like an overnight ocurance when we finally realize things used to be better. Equally, the MAF can just plain fail..... when it fails, it will usually have a build up of gunk on the sensing elements. I don't think that one necessarily leads to the other.

There is always someone that can find the part much cheaper than you paid...... $300 is a tad rich (especially if it's bux 'Murikan) but if it is a Ford piece covered under the Ford warranty, things become a little more palatable. Additionally, some of those that fix their problem with an "off brand" piece have generally paid a very real price in un-needed parts replacement as well as the aggravation of driving a less than perfect car for several weeks while they furble around with misbegotten "cost saving" self repairs.

I can't speak one way or the other, but DIYers usually try to impress with low cost repairs and short repair times........ 15 minutes at home in the driveway for a buck 85 is a battle cry I hear all too often. I'm sure the 15 minutes refers to the total time spent in the bathroom.....

The important thing is that your car is running better...... yes, you could have done it cheaper, but at what cost????

-- Jim Warman snipped-for-privacy@telusplanet.net

I assume you consider my response, Kate's and KICKERSCRT's "knee jerk" answers but damn if I can figure out why you care to demean them. Do a Google search and see how many people have solved mild detonation and drivability problems with a $2 can of brake cleaner, a Q-Tip and 15 minutes of their time. What does it hurt to try this? If it doesn't work then go on to Plan B.

For $380 Bill could have bought a Pro-M Universal MAF (IMO the best one available) and maybe a cold air kit. This might give him a few additional horses for his trouble and money. The Pro-M Universal is light years ahead of the stock Ford MAF. BTW, I consider this Plan B.

Who the hell are we trying to impress? I believe we're just trying to share knowledge and help each other. Maybe you're one of those mechanics that is too quick to just throw away a good MAF and replace it with a $300 stock piece, charge $80 for 10 minutes of labor and make a tidy profit? BTW, how does it feel for me to berate your response and make assumptions about you with no justification? I didn't like it either.

At what cost? It could have been $2 for a can of brake cleaner and another $0.02 for the Q-Tip. Maybe unnecessarily spending $380 of Bill's hard earned money doesn't bother you but I wish he would have had the opportunity to at least try cleaning the MAF first. There's nothing wrong with a $2, fifteen minute repair in the driveway by a DIY'er. Cleaning a MAF isn't on the same level of difficulty as splitting the atom. It's this type of service that give mechanics bad stereotypes. The fact you seem to be defending the mechanic's actions leaves me scratching my head and asking "why?".

It's late and I'm tired so maybe I misinterpreted your post. If I did then I apologize.

Speaking of jerks... WTF is your problem to day Jim?

Kate

I don't know Michael, it's early and I'm awake, and I saw the same thing in his post BEFORE I read yours.

Kate

| > There is always someone that can find the part much cheaper than you | > paid...... $300 is a tad rich (especially if it's bux 'Murikan) but if it is | > a Ford piece covered under the Ford warranty, things become a little more | > palatable. Additionally, some of those that fix their problem with an "off | > brand" piece have generally paid a very real price in un-needed parts | > replacement as well as the aggravation of driving a less than perfect car | > for several weeks while they furble around with misbegotten "cost saving" | > self repairs. | | For $380 Bill could have bought a Pro-M Universal MAF (IMO the best one | available) and maybe a cold air kit. This might give him a few | additional horses for his trouble and money. The Pro-M Universal is | light years ahead of the stock Ford MAF. BTW, I consider this Plan B. | | >

| > I can't speak one way or the other, but DIYers usually try to impress with | > low cost repairs and short repair times........ 15 minutes at home in the | > driveway for a buck 85 is a battle cry I hear all too often. I'm sure the 15 | > minutes refers to the total time spent in the bathroom..... | | Who the hell are we trying to impress? I believe we're just trying to | share knowledge and help each other. Maybe you're one of those | mechanics that is too quick to just throw away a good MAF and replace it | with a $300 stock piece, charge $80 for 10 minutes of labor and make a | tidy profit? BTW, how does it feel for me to berate your response and | make assumptions about you with no justification? I didn't like it either. | | >

| > The important thing is that your car is running better...... yes, you could | > have done it cheaper, but at what cost???? | | At what cost? It could have been $2 for a can of brake cleaner and | another $0.02 for the Q-Tip. Maybe unnecessarily spending $380 of | Bill's hard earned money doesn't bother you but I wish he would have had | the opportunity to at least try cleaning the MAF first. There's nothing | wrong with a $2, fifteen minute repair in the driveway by a DIY'er. | Cleaning a MAF isn't on the same level of difficulty as splitting the | atom. It's this type of service that give mechanics bad stereotypes. | The fact you seem to be defending the mechanic's actions leaves me | scratching my head and asking "why?". | | It's late and I'm tired so maybe I misinterpreted your post. If I did | then I apologize. | | >

| >

| > -- | > Jim Warman | > snipped-for-privacy@telusplanet.net | >

| >>The Mass Air Flow sensor went bad in my 95 GT (80,000 miles), and I had to | >>get it replaced at a cost of almost $300. $210 for the MAF and around $80 | >>for labor. | >>

| >>The question I have is - does the MAF go bad all of a sudden, or is it a | >>gradual degradation? | >>

| >>I ask the question because the car seems to run better and have more power | >>than ever, since the thing was replaced. | >>

| >>I have a feeling the MAF started to go bad over a month ago. The Check | >>Engine light came on for a second or two about 3 times in a two week | >

| > period. | >

| >>The car didn't seem to have any driveability problem, however. I brought | >

| > it | >

| >>into the shop anyway to see if they could detect the problem. They said | >>there was no code stored, and they couldn't tell there was a problem. | >>

| >>Then last week, the Check Engine light went on and stayed on, and the | >

| > engine | >

| >>started running rough, with a noticeable loss of power. | >>

| >>Now that it's fixed, it just seems that the MAF might have been robbing | >

| > the | >

| >>engine of power for some time, since it seems like a new car now. Is that | >>possible? | >>

| >>

| >>-Bill J. | >>95 GT | >>Laser Red | >>5-speed | >>

| >>

| >

| >

| >

|

Actually, part of the labor charge was figuring out what the problem was. The error code from the EEC was "lean condition," so if you look in the book for that, you check the fuel pressure and then the MAF. So I can believe that they spent a good hour or so on the car.

As far as getting an aftermarket part instead of the replacement Ford part, well, I just have always liked to keep my cars stock for the most part. I might replace the shifter or something like that, but I even use Motorcraft oil filters when changing the oil (Mobil 1 only).

The shop isn't a dealer, but rather a good service shop in town, and I trust the guy. The first time I went there was for my 84 Z28 that was running so bad that I almost couldn't make it down the road. The problem was the O2 sensor, and he only charged 15 minutes for that job, and he's always treated me good ever since. $62/hour isn't exactly cheap, but I think he's much better than the local Ford dealer, and a lot cheaper to boot.

But to get to the point, I wasn't asking if I got a good deal or not - I was just asking was it possible my MAF was bad/dirty for a long time, and the car wasn't really running right that whole time?

-Bill

95 Laser Red GT 5-speed, bone stock (except for the aluminum anniversary edition shift knob)

Michael, the only post I "demean" (if that's the term you care for) is the ever-present "Man, you got ripped!!". The guy got his car fixed and he's happy with the way it runs....... what price is satisfaction??

I made a simple statement about MAFs..... Good MAFs gone bad have a fur coat..... most of the bad MAFs I have seen have a fur coat. Nowhere did I say not to try cleaning a MAF..... you WILL NOT KNOW if a MAF is bad or just pretending to be bad without cleaning it. In fact, cleaning the MAF should be considered periodic maintenance - even the best air filters allow something through (after all, air gets past them, right?). When a stranger, thousands of miles away, has control of your job and disallows your diagnosis, you get a bit testy. 16 hours of labour, not being allowed to replace the parts I want to (those parts will NOT be covered under warranty)..... working till midnight only to start the car and have the same noise. Not an excuse.... but certainly enough to drive a man to drink (which it did).

I will admit to using a pretty wide brush - this is borne of some past posts and a day spent dealing with a less than agreeable manufacturers "lukewarmline" (oops, I meant hotline). For that part, I truly apologize.

Pax.....

-- Jim Warman snipped-for-privacy@telusplanet.net

| I will admit to using a pretty wide brush - this is borne of some past posts | and a day spent dealing with a less than agreeable manufacturers | "lukewarmline" (oops, I meant hotline). For that part, I truly apologize. | | Pax..... | | | -- | Jim Warman | snipped-for-privacy@telusplanet.net

Well... *I* have never had a bad day it just seemed out of carachter for you

| > I assume you consider my response, Kate's and KICKERSCRT's "knee jerk" | > answers but damn if I can figure out why you care to demean them. Do a | > Google search and see how many people have solved mild detonation and | > drivability problems with a $2 can of brake cleaner, a Q-Tip and 15 | > minutes of their time. What does it hurt to try this? If it doesn't | > work then go on to Plan B. | >

| > >

| > > There is always someone that can find the part much cheaper than you | > > paid...... $300 is a tad rich (especially if it's bux 'Murikan) but if | it is | > > a Ford piece covered under the Ford warranty, things become a little | more | > > palatable. Additionally, some of those that fix their problem with an | "off | > > brand" piece have generally paid a very real price in un-needed parts | > > replacement as well as the aggravation of driving a less than perfect | car | > > for several weeks while they furble around with misbegotten "cost | saving" | > > self repairs. | >

| > For $380 Bill could have bought a Pro-M Universal MAF (IMO the best one | > available) and maybe a cold air kit. This might give him a few | > additional horses for his trouble and money. The Pro-M Universal is | > light years ahead of the stock Ford MAF. BTW, I consider this Plan B. | >

| > >

| > > I can't speak one way or the other, but DIYers usually try to impress | with | > > low cost repairs and short repair times........ 15 minutes at home in | the | > > driveway for a buck 85 is a battle cry I hear all too often. I'm sure | the 15 | > > minutes refers to the total time spent in the bathroom..... | >

| > Who the hell are we trying to impress? I believe we're just trying to | > share knowledge and help each other. Maybe you're one of those | > mechanics that is too quick to just throw away a good MAF and replace it | > with a $300 stock piece, charge $80 for 10 minutes of labor and make a | > tidy profit? BTW, how does it feel for me to berate your response and | > make assumptions about you with no justification? I didn't like it | either. | >

| > >

| > > The important thing is that your car is running better...... yes, you | could | > > have done it cheaper, but at what cost???? | >

| > At what cost? It could have been $2 for a can of brake cleaner and | > another $0.02 for the Q-Tip. Maybe unnecessarily spending $380 of | > Bill's hard earned money doesn't bother you but I wish he would have had | > the opportunity to at least try cleaning the MAF first. There's nothing | > wrong with a $2, fifteen minute repair in the driveway by a DIY'er. | > Cleaning a MAF isn't on the same level of difficulty as splitting the | > atom. It's this type of service that give mechanics bad stereotypes. | > The fact you seem to be defending the mechanic's actions leaves me | > scratching my head and asking "why?". | >

| > It's late and I'm tired so maybe I misinterpreted your post. If I did | > then I apologize. | >

| > >

| > >

| > > -- | > > Jim Warman | > > snipped-for-privacy@telusplanet.net | > >

| > >>The Mass Air Flow sensor went bad in my 95 GT (80,000 miles), and I had | to | > >>get it replaced at a cost of almost $300. $210 for the MAF and around | $80 | > >>for labor. | > >>

| > >>The question I have is - does the MAF go bad all of a sudden, or is it a | > >>gradual degradation? | > >>

| > >>I ask the question because the car seems to run better and have more | power | > >>than ever, since the thing was replaced. | > >>

| > >>I have a feeling the MAF started to go bad over a month ago. The Check | > >>Engine light came on for a second or two about 3 times in a two week | > >

| > > period. | > >

| > >>The car didn't seem to have any driveability problem, however. I | brought | > >

| > > it | > >

| > >>into the shop anyway to see if they could detect the problem. They said | > >>there was no code stored, and they couldn't tell there was a problem. | > >>

| > >>Then last week, the Check Engine light went on and stayed on, and the | > >

| > > engine | > >

| > >>started running rough, with a noticeable loss of power. | > >>

| > >>Now that it's fixed, it just seems that the MAF might have been robbing | > >

| > > the | > >

| > >>engine of power for some time, since it seems like a new car now. Is | that | > >>possible? | > >>

| > >>

| > >>-Bill J. | > >>95 GT | > >>Laser Red | > >>5-speed | > >>

| > >>

| > >

| > >

| > >

| >

| |

Kate... you should know by now that I'm *always* out of character..... Open mouth - insert foot.... come easy some days....

-- Jim Warman snipped-for-privacy@telusplanet.net

it's that way for all of us LOL....

lord only knows.

| > | I will admit to using a pretty wide brush - this is borne of some past | > posts | > | and a day spent dealing with a less than agreeable manufacturers | > | "lukewarmline" (oops, I meant hotline). For that part, I truly | apologize. | > | | > | Pax..... | > | | > | | > | -- | > | Jim Warman | > | snipped-for-privacy@telusplanet.net | >

| >

| > Well... *I* have never had a bad day | > it just seemed out of carachter for you | >

| >

| > | > I assume you consider my response, Kate's and KICKERSCRT's "knee jerk" | > | > answers but damn if I can figure out why you care to demean them. Do | a | > | > Google search and see how many people have solved mild detonation and | > | > drivability problems with a $2 can of brake cleaner, a Q-Tip and 15 | > | > minutes of their time. What does it hurt to try this? If it doesn't | > | > work then go on to Plan B. | > | >

| > | > >

| > | > > There is always someone that can find the part much cheaper than you | > | > > paid...... $300 is a tad rich (especially if it's bux 'Murikan) but | if | > | it is | > | > > a Ford piece covered under the Ford warranty, things become a little | > | more | > | > > palatable. Additionally, some of those that fix their problem with | an | > | "off | > | > > brand" piece have generally paid a very real price in un-needed | parts | > | > > replacement as well as the aggravation of driving a less than | perfect | > | car | > | > > for several weeks while they furble around with misbegotten "cost | > | saving" | > | > > self repairs. | > | >

| > | > For $380 Bill could have bought a Pro-M Universal MAF (IMO the best | one | > | > available) and maybe a cold air kit. This might give him a few | > | > additional horses for his trouble and money. The Pro-M Universal is | > | > light years ahead of the stock Ford MAF. BTW, I consider this Plan B. | > | >

| > | > >

| > | > > I can't speak one way or the other, but DIYers usually try to | impress | > | with | > | > > low cost repairs and short repair times........ 15 minutes at home | in | > | the | > | > > driveway for a buck 85 is a battle cry I hear all too often. I'm | sure | > | the 15 | > | > > minutes refers to the total time spent in the bathroom..... | > | >

| > | > Who the hell are we trying to impress? I believe we're just trying to | > | > share knowledge and help each other. Maybe you're one of those | > | > mechanics that is too quick to just throw away a good MAF and replace | it | > | > with a $300 stock piece, charge $80 for 10 minutes of labor and make a | > | > tidy profit? BTW, how does it feel for me to berate your response and | > | > make assumptions about you with no justification? I didn't like it | > | either. | > | >

| > | > >

| > | > > The important thing is that your car is running better...... yes, | you | > | could | > | > > have done it cheaper, but at what cost???? | > | >

| > | > At what cost? It could have been $2 for a can of brake cleaner and | > | > another $0.02 for the Q-Tip. Maybe unnecessarily spending $380 of | > | > Bill's hard earned money doesn't bother you but I wish he would have | had | > | > the opportunity to at least try cleaning the MAF first. There's | nothing | > | > wrong with a $2, fifteen minute repair in the driveway by a DIY'er. | > | > Cleaning a MAF isn't on the same level of difficulty as splitting the | > | > atom. It's this type of service that give mechanics bad stereotypes. | > | > The fact you seem to be defending the mechanic's actions leaves me | > | > scratching my head and asking "why?". | > | >

| > | > It's late and I'm tired so maybe I misinterpreted your post. If I did | > | > then I apologize. | > | >

| > | > >

| > | > >

| > | > > -- | > | > > Jim Warman | > | > > snipped-for-privacy@telusplanet.net | > | > >

| > | > >>The Mass Air Flow sensor went bad in my 95 GT (80,000 miles), and I | > had | > | to | > | > >>get it replaced at a cost of almost $300. $210 for the MAF and | around | > | $80 | > | > >>for labor. | > | > >>

| > | > >>The question I have is - does the MAF go bad all of a sudden, or is | it | > a | > | > >>gradual degradation? | > | > >>

| > | > >>I ask the question because the car seems to run better and have more | > | power | > | > >>than ever, since the thing was replaced. | > | > >>

| > | > >>I have a feeling the MAF started to go bad over a month ago. The | > Check | > | > >>Engine light came on for a second or two about 3 times in a two week | > | > >

| > | > > period. | > | > >

| > | > >>The car didn't seem to have any driveability problem, however. I | > | brought | > | > >

| > | > > it | > | > >

| > | > >>into the shop anyway to see if they could detect the problem. They | > said | > | > >>there was no code stored, and they couldn't tell there was a | problem. | > | > >>

| > | > >>Then last week, the Check Engine light went on and stayed on, and | the | > | > >

| > | > > engine | > | > >

| > | > >>started running rough, with a noticeable loss of power. | > | > >>

| > | > >>Now that it's fixed, it just seems that the MAF might have been | > robbing | > | > >

| > | > > the | > | > >

| > | > >>engine of power for some time, since it seems like a new car now. | Is | > | that | > | > >>possible? | > | > >>

| > | > >>

| > | > >>-Bill J. | > | > >>95 GT | > | > >>Laser Red | > | > >>5-speed | > | > >>

| > | > >>

| > | > >

| > | > >

| > | > >

| > | >

| > | | > | | >

| >

| |

Same here, not a misinterpretation.

I read in a trade journal somewhere recently that auto mechanics are having a tough time making ends meet today because repair business is on the decline. Automakers claim it is because their cars are more reliable.

Or, could it be that more of us are buying repair manuals and performing needed maintenance and repairs ourselves? This is certainly the case here. I grew weary of being lied to and overcharged for work that was never done, and parts never installed a long, LONG time ago.

What torks me the most are the intentional misdiagnosis of a problem to increase a sale. You know - telling the customer he/she needs a new carburetor when the problem was only a failed $3.00 PCV valve. And of course you later find that the old carburetor was merely removed, cleaned, spray-painted and reinstalled, yet the bill shows a new $470 unit was installed.

A more recent example involved the wife's friend who had her car towed to the dealership after the starter refused to turn over. The diagnosis was a failed battery, and a new unit was installed and the customer charged $370.00. In reality, a $12.00 battery cable was replaced (the actual culprit) and the battery was rubbed with Armour All to make it appear new.

I'm not sure how we can be expected to trust paid mechanics after we are constantly lied to. Who can blame us for DIY'ing? If it isn't lying, dirtbag mechanics, it's incompetent twits at places like Jiffy Lube. Oh man, don't EVEN get me started on that one...

-JD

_________________________________ JD's Locally-Famous Mustang Page: http://207.13.104.8/users/jdadams

Well, on the whole, my experience *is* that cars are more reliable, but that might be specious in way...

No, it's not. There's less for garage-mechanics, like you and me, to do. Automakers really have eliminated the majority wear-out things like point, condensers, distributors. Plugs last forever now. Cars adjust themselves as they age. What's mostly left is fluid changes and the dealers have seen that business go to chains like Jiffy Lube, etc. Even spark plug cables are on their way out with the use of coil-on-plug.

So, automakers have essentially eliminated the parts that wear rapidly, so maintenance now mostly consists of replacing lubricants and other fluids and making sure the rest of the car is still performing to spec.

People have been changing their own oil for years, if anything, fewer people do it today with car washes and 15-minute drive-throughs doing oil changes that weren't doing that 15 years ago.

Dana

Good points. With the introduction of fuel injection and distributorless ignition systems, 10k tuneups and carburetor repairs/tuning are pretty much a thing of the past. And from what I've seen, Skippy Lube outfits have most of the fluid-replacement business locked up. Better engine management programming has eliminated most emission control problems, and even the quality of lubricants has gotten better, extending the useful life of drivetrains.

I still think dealerships could easily compete if they put in a 'quickie-lube' drive-through bay that people could visit during their lunch hour. Great time to recommend other services and offer discounts on things like tires, batteries and accessories.

-JD

_________________________________ JD's Locally-Famous Mustang Page: http://207.13.104.8/users/jdadams

'quickie-lube'

Ford Dealers have in this part of the world. They are called Fastlane Tire and Auto Centres. In addition, the one in my area even provides contract space for mobile small dent and chip repair operators.

For all I know his mechanic may have tried to clean the MAF and found it didn't work. We were both posting having known only bits and pieces of the entire story. My big problem with mechanics in general is too many of them read a code and start replacing parts without determining the exact cause of the problem. They may replace several perfectly good parts until they reach the real culprit. Then they just hand the customer an outrageous bill and fully expect them to pay it. The sad part is they usually do without even questioning the validity of the bill.

We all have bad days (except for Kate) and maybe I had a hair trigger myself from putt> Michael, the only post I "demean" (if that's the term you care for) is the

that's EXACTLY what they tried to do to me! They got me once, then I started asking questions.

I have not been back to that service department since

K

The sad | part is they usually do without even questioning the validity of the bill. | | We all have bad days (except for Kate) and maybe I had a hair trigger | myself from putting in a long day. I really feel sorry for the good | mechanics because it seems for every good one there's ten bad ones. On | the bright side, I guess the good ones develop a long client list over time. | | Jim Warman wrote: | | > Michael, the only post I "demean" (if that's the term you care for) is the | > ever-present "Man, you got ripped!!". The guy got his car fixed and he's | > happy with the way it runs....... what price is satisfaction?? | >

| > I made a simple statement about MAFs..... Good MAFs gone bad have a fur | > coat..... most of the bad MAFs I have seen have a fur coat. Nowhere did I | > say not to try cleaning a MAF..... you WILL NOT KNOW if a MAF is bad or just | > pretending to be bad without cleaning it. In fact, cleaning the MAF should | > be considered periodic maintenance - even the best air filters allow | > something through (after all, air gets past them, right?). When a stranger, | > thousands of miles away, has control of your job and disallows your | > diagnosis, you get a bit testy. 16 hours of labour, not being allowed to | > replace the parts I want to (those parts will NOT be covered under | > warranty)..... working till midnight only to start the car and have the same | > noise. Not an excuse.... but certainly enough to drive a man to drink (which | > it did). | >

| > I will admit to using a pretty wide brush - this is borne of some past posts | > and a day spent dealing with a less than agreeable manufacturers | > "lukewarmline" (oops, I meant hotline). For that part, I truly apologize. | >

| > Pax..... | >

| >

| > -- | > Jim Warman | > snipped-for-privacy@telusplanet.net | >

| >>Jim Warman wrote: | >>

| >>>I see some of the knee-jerk answers.... MAF failures can be an | >

| > either/or. | >

| >>>Gunk will slowly build up on the sensing elements and result is a very | >

| > slow | >

| >>>degradation of performance - so imperceptable that it will almost seem | >

| > like | >

| >>>an overnight ocurance when we finally realize things used to be better. | >>>Equally, the MAF can just plain fail..... when it fails, it will usually | >>>have a build up of gunk on the sensing elements. I don't think that one | >>>necessarily leads to the other. | >>

| >>I assume you consider my response, Kate's and KICKERSCRT's "knee jerk" | >>answers but damn if I can figure out why you care to demean them. Do a | >>Google search and see how many people have solved mild detonation and | >>drivability problems with a $2 can of brake cleaner, a Q-Tip and 15 | >>minutes of their time. What does it hurt to try this? If it doesn't | >>work then go on to Plan B. | >>

| >>

| >>>There is always someone that can find the part much cheaper than you | >>>paid...... $300 is a tad rich (especially if it's bux 'Murikan) but if | >

| > it is | >

| >>>a Ford piece covered under the Ford warranty, things become a little | >

| > more | >

| >>>palatable. Additionally, some of those that fix their problem with an | >

| > "off | >

| >>>brand" piece have generally paid a very real price in un-needed parts | >>>replacement as well as the aggravation of driving a less than perfect | >

| > car | >

| >>>for several weeks while they furble around with misbegotten "cost | >

| > saving" | >

| >>>self repairs. | >>

| >>For $380 Bill could have bought a Pro-M Universal MAF (IMO the best one | >>available) and maybe a cold air kit. This might give him a few | >>additional horses for his trouble and money. The Pro-M Universal is | >>light years ahead of the stock Ford MAF. BTW, I consider this Plan B. | >>

| >>

| >>>I can't speak one way or the other, but DIYers usually try to impress | >

| > with | >

| >>>low cost repairs and short repair times........ 15 minutes at home in | >

| > the | >

| >>>driveway for a buck 85 is a battle cry I hear all too often. I'm sure | >

| > the 15 | >

| >>>minutes refers to the total time spent in the bathroom..... | >>

| >>Who the hell are we trying to impress? I believe we're just trying to | >>share knowledge and help each other. Maybe you're one of those | >>mechanics that is too quick to just throw away a good MAF and replace it | >>with a $300 stock piece, charge $80 for 10 minutes of labor and make a | >>tidy profit? BTW, how does it feel for me to berate your response and | >>make assumptions about you with no justification? I didn't like it | >

| > either. | >

| >>>The important thing is that your car is running better...... yes, you | >

| > could | >

| >>>have done it cheaper, but at what cost???? | >>

| >>At what cost? It could have been $2 for a can of brake cleaner and | >>another $0.02 for the Q-Tip. Maybe unnecessarily spending $380 of | >>Bill's hard earned money doesn't bother you but I wish he would have had | >>the opportunity to at least try cleaning the MAF first. There's nothing | >>wrong with a $2, fifteen minute repair in the driveway by a DIY'er. | >>Cleaning a MAF isn't on the same level of difficulty as splitting the | >>atom. It's this type of service that give mechanics bad stereotypes. | >>The fact you seem to be defending the mechanic's actions leaves me | >>scratching my head and asking "why?". | >>

| >>It's late and I'm tired so maybe I misinterpreted your post. If I did | >>then I apologize. | >>

| >>

| >>>

| >>>-- | >>>Jim Warman | >>> snipped-for-privacy@telusplanet.net | >>>

| >>>

| >>>>The Mass Air Flow sensor went bad in my 95 GT (80,000 miles), and I had | >

| > to | >

| >>>>get it replaced at a cost of almost $300. $210 for the MAF and around | >

| > $80 | >

| >>>>for labor. | >>>>

| >>>>The question I have is - does the MAF go bad all of a sudden, or is it a | >>>>gradual degradation? | >>>>

| >>>>I ask the question because the car seems to run better and have more | >

| > power | >

| >>>>than ever, since the thing was replaced. | >>>>

| >>>>I have a feeling the MAF started to go bad over a month ago. The Check | >>>>Engine light came on for a second or two about 3 times in a two week | >>>

| >>>period. | >>>

| >>>

| >>>>The car didn't seem to have any driveability problem, however. I | >

| > brought | >

| >>>it | >>>

| >>>

| >>>>into the shop anyway to see if they could detect the problem. They said | >>>>there was no code stored, and they couldn't tell there was a problem. | >>>>

| >>>>Then last week, the Check Engine light went on and stayed on, and the | >>>

| >>>engine | >>>

| >>>

| >>>>started running rough, with a noticeable loss of power. | >>>>

| >>>>Now that it's fixed, it just seems that the MAF might have been robbing | >>>

| >>>the | >>>

| >>>

| >>>>engine of power for some time, since it seems like a new car now. Is | >

| > that | >

| >>>>possible? | >>>>

| >>>>

| >>>>-Bill J. | >>>>95 GT | >>>>Laser Red | >>>>5-speed | >>>>

| >>>>

| >>>

| >>>

| >>>

| >

| >

|