Re: V8 Conversion Question

Well when this becomes Porschephobes own personal newsgroup and it becomes a moderated newsgroup that's fine. But neither he nor you are the moderators of this group. Are you Porschephiles so intimidated by other makes? I know the Porsche Club of America runs their on autocrosses because the 911's are so uncompetitive in the SCCA. Where the Z06 dominated the Super Stock class and the 911's aren't even close. It's ok for magazines to compare cars but not for individuals? What a small, immature, naive and insecure world you live in.

Devil944 just does not grasp the idea of economics. Cost to repair a

911 is a lot. My 944 was outrageous trying to fix the power switches for the power seats. With the economy down teh Z06 makes more sense.

You catch on quick. And that is exactly how you are treating it.

*You* are the one who clearly seems intimidated. Again, if you are not aware, you are *trolling* your corvette noise in a.a.p.

right.

Again, if you are not aware, you are *trolling* in a.a.p. Buy your corvette and roll away.

And your point of reference is amply demonstrated by having nothing better to do than try to irritate others in a Usenet group.

It will stop a lot better once you swap out the cheap stock brake pads. Don't even try to tell me that many peopel don't swap them out first chance they get. I swapped out brakes and tires before my car was even delievered. Once again I se Road & Track which seems to come up with numbers taht no one else comes up with. The reason I compare the base 911 to the Z06 is the price difference is still enormous. But you grab a 911 and I'll take a Z06 and we can autocrosss it or take it on the track and see who crosses the line first. It will not be the 911.

Cost IS always a factor, the fact that you choose to pay more is fine. But you are still going to be beat and you spent a lot more. If you don't care about max performance that's fine.

Anyone who does not cnsider the cost regardless of how much money they have is foolish. Now there are many people who want a 911 turbo or a Ferrari or whatever and they don't mind spending the extra money. But the average guy is going to consider price as something he has to deal with every month. That extra $35K really boosts up the payments.

hunreds of thousands? Must be an Enzo you are comparing. People who buy high end exotic cars generally do not sweat about cost because their bank accounts can cover it. But still that is teh exception rather than the rule.

In SOME cases cost is not a factor but unless you are deep into the 6 digits or more a year you will have to think about how much a vehicle costs. Also most people that have a high end sports car also have a cheaper car they use on commutes. I am well aware of what goes into buying avehicle but you insist cost in not a factor. It most certainly is unless you are rich. You may very well decide to pay more for a 911 and a Corvette may never have entered your mind as a potential purchase but unless you have the Vanderbilts belief that if you have to ask the price it's too expensive. Then you have gone over your finaces to see if it's affordable or not. If not or your wife says NO! then that car is out.

I will not spare you that because that's exactly what I see people doing in 911's in traffic. Most Porsche owners today are posers and not real drivers and buy the marque for it's snob factor. If it was not so important why the $15K carbon fibre special interior, or the various wood interiors for a large additional cost.

Wrong I am discussing, if you don't know the difference get a dictionary. Cars routinely get discussed in various groups. But you are so pro porsche that nothing else can be considered. That is being a zealot and zealots are far worse than trolls.

Not going to happen. I am not trolling, if you think I am trolling report me. I have as much right to compare as anyone else and as such I am not violating the rules of thios group. I am also not flaming anyone nor using ad hominum attacks although I do wonder if you have any idea what trolling actually is. From what you are saying you sound like you are ignorant of what a troll is and does.

Not at all, you just cannot handle any one disagreeing with your persoanl beliefs. You do not own the Usenet, nor do I. I am in fact discusssing Porsches which is on topic. I have not flamed Porsches or people who own them. I certainly have questioned certain aspects of them tho. I suggest you grow up a bit. Usenet is obviously too adult for you.

Toyota

Rennlist

Toyota

Corolla

Station

Jeep

Cherokees

Are you sure you don't mean 824? Oh, also, we refer to them as Vette killers because in their only head to head competition, the 944's, oh excuse me 924 variants, beat the snot out of that white trash idea of a decent sports car.

Hey Toyata boy, did not you swear to leave this NG and stick with rennlist?

To quote Bill Clinton, it's the economy stupid. The same reason Corvettes are handing out $7000.00 rebates and 0% financing.

How do you explain the Corvette dropping off the map in the JD Power Long Term Quality And Reliability Survey? Quality not quite up to par past 90 days? The Chevy name living up to it's reputation? People realizing that a $45,000 sports car will come up short in many areas to get you that price? Ill fitting body panels, questionable styling and Impala bits in the interior just not being world class material? All this "bang for the buck" talk and yet a $42K Boxster and a $30K Honda, still top you in the premium sports car category. Two sixes and a four banger. Yes, young lady, your 8 cylinder penis extension comes up limp again.

Tecwhiz, just keep it coming. I love smacking you down.

significant

No, you don't grasp the idea that for some people the bottom line is not what determines their automotive choice. Some of us are willing to pay more for what we want. Using your simple criteria, no one would buy a Corvette either because there are cheaper cars that approach or exceed Corvette performance fo thosands less.

When I ordered our 2002 Carrera, I could have gotten it with or without any options. And the Carrera doesn't come with a cloth interior - didn't Edmunds tell you that? Are you seriously trying to debate or just making up stuff as you go along?

Your subjective statements pale in comparison with objective data produced by a publication that specializes in automobiles.

Let's see, R&T does a road test review on the cars and comes up with data which it publishes for all to see, and Shomuni comes up with "it will stop a lot better once you swap out the cheap stock brake pads". I'm thinking R&T looks a lot more credible here.

Cost IS NOT always a factor. Period. Why else would someone pay for an automobile that costs a lot more more than another yet wouldn't go 0 -

60 MPH as quickly. Why would anyone buy a Corvette when Mustang Cobras and Subaru STis offer similar or superior acceleration for thousands less?

For many people cost is an issue, but your global statement doesn't apply to everyone.

Now there are many people who want a 911 turbo or a

You finally got something right, and that has been my argument all along

But the average guy is going to consider price as something he has to deal

What $35K are you talking about? Would that be the difference between the $50K Corvette and the $85K you mistakenly quote as the base price for a Carrera? It would help if you started out with correct facts.

360 Modena $152,500 360 Spider $164,985 550 Barchetta Pininfarina $258,000 550 Maranello $200,000

You're getting it. Cost IS NOT ALWAYS a factor. My wife and I aren't "deep into the 6 digits or more a year" and we didn't consider the cost of the Corvette versus the Porsche we both wanted.

Prove it. What's your criteria? Another totally wothless, subjective statement. You see someone drinking coffee in traffic and go from there to "Most Porsche owners are posers and not real drivers and buy the marque for it's (sic) snob factor" ? Do enlighten me how you make that connection. No one ever drinks coffee in a Corvette so they must be real drivers?

Maybe the $15K interior is to make their car distinctive or uniquely theirs. Maybe they like the idea that they have a laundry list of options available from the Porsche factory for those willing to pay the price. We put an all leather interior into ours because we like the smell, feel and look of leather.

My point was it is virtually impossible to buy a stripped down Coupe. Yes I know it comes with leatherette. Stop being so anal.

Yes even when that data is not reflected by other magazines who using the same cars come up with entirely different data. So naturally you would pick the data that is most favorable to your car. Whereas R&T hates the Corvette and rates it very poorly. Once you leave that one magazine it's a different ballgame. R&T seem to be only capable of squeezing a Z06 to 60mph in 4.8 secs. When everyone else is doing it in 4 secs. That is a huge discrepancy.

I am not going to pander to your obvious ignorance and arrogance on this matter. It is very clear that you have no idea what you are talking about. You can rattle of specs in your car magazine but have no idea about anything in the real world. Many cars have parts that are a compromise between comfort and drivability. The Stock Chevy pads will last a long time but are not very grippy. This is because posers like yourself bitch and whine like

6 year old schoolgirls if there is any brake dust on the rims. You also expect the brake pads to last for 50K miles. I stnad by what I said throw in a set of Hawk HP pads or Hawk Black if you run on the track. There are other high performance pads out there that work extremely well. It makes a night and day difference with any car. If you did more than justread Road and Trash magazine you'd know this.

Sorry but the STi does not offer similar performance to the Vette. The STi has a totally different purpose than teh Vette and if you knew anything about cars other than what you read in the magazines you'd know that. The Mustang and I will have to assume you mean the SVT Mustang and not the Cobra because as most knowledgeable people know, the stock Cobra isn't even close to the Corvette, it's the SVT model that costs significantly more. The Corvette is in a whole different class than those other cars and it still is considerably faster than a 911 Coupe It's faster in everyway than the 911. On the track it will handily beat the 911 with an experienced driver behind the wheel. Neither the Subaru STi nor the SVT Mustang (a highly modified car) will do that. They are close but still off by seconds which is a lot. Also we haven't even touched on the Stock Viper which is in the same ballpark as the 911 pricewise but so utterly destroys the 911 in performace that it's frightening. Cost is a factor unless you are rich.

Yes there is > hunreds of thousands? Must be an Enzo you are comparing. People who

Where are the hundreds of thousands which is plural? Only one car on your list is 200 thousand more not hundreds.

All things considered I do not consider you to be a pinnacle of truth after much of what you have written.

That's right my everyday observations bear out what you already know. You want to be seen in a Porsche 911 for status. It's a status car. The cars are not bought by the same people that bought them years ago. How often do you autocross or track your car? Oh yes, the excuses will start to flow now. Porsche is known for it's snob factor that's historically true. How many times do Porsche owners state that they want a car that isn't like everything else. Where the company redesigned the nose so it wouldn't look so much like the Boxster. If ever a person was on thin ice it's you with these snippets that defy everything known about the marque in the first place. Proving once and for all that you are a poser. You probably was the car as often as possible so your neighbors will see your car and get jealous. Enjoy your latte and your wood trim. The better performing cars will be passing you by and tehy will not care who made your coffee, they'll only care about what's under the hood, and that's where the overpriced underperforming 911 comes up short.

The Corvette comes stock with an all leather interior it's not an option as it is in the 911.

You can order ANY stripped down model you want. Start being more accurate.

>

I cited my source. Time for you to do the same. Prove R&T "hates the Corvette". Who is the "everyone else" that gets 4.0 out of a Z06. Haven't seen that in Car And Driver, Motor Trend or R&T. Of course they all hate the Corvette also..........

And how would you know what I know about the real world? It's one thing to come in here and spout subjective bullshit about cars "eating" other cars and "blowing other cars away" and another to look at test results obtained under more scientific and controlled conditions.

Car And Driver has the Subaru Sti at 0 - 60 in 4.6 and the quarter mile in 13.2. They have the Corvette in 4.5 and 13.1. If you knew anything about cars other than what you dream up you'd know that. Try reading more magazines.

The Mustang and I will have to assume you mean the SVT

Let's see, you're the guy who's accusing me of not knowing about cars? The Mustang Cobra is built by Ford's Special Vehicle Team (SVT) and is the highest performance Mustang variant. The Mustang Cobra and the Mustang SVT are the same car. It features a 390 HP supercharged engine and Car And Driver has it at 0 - 60 in 4.6 and the quarter mile in 12.9. It costs about $10K less than a Corvette.

Ford made a Cobra R a few years ago that was street legal but designed for the track. It cost $54K. If you ever get your facts straight, then you might presume to lecture others on who is or is not "knowledgeable".

The Mustang SVT is the high performance variant of the Mustang line. You buy one at your friendly Ford dealer. It has a Ford warranty just like other Fords. It is by no stretch of the imagination a "highly modified car". It's what Ford builds, just like a Z06 is what Cevrolet builds.

What I do know that you can walk into any Porsche dealership and order a Porsche with as little or as much optional equipment as you like. If you buy one off the lot you obviously have to take what they have, but YOU DON"T HAVE TO BUY ONE OFF THE LOT.

Nice retort. I'm going to lose a lot of sleep over this one. You're in no position to lecture about truth. You speak of being knowledgeable about cars and haven't got a clue about what kind of numbers the Subaru and Mustang Cobra generate. You don't know the difference between the current production Cobra and a specialty built racer that's no longer produced. You claim that Road & Track "hates" the Corvette.

Subjective bullshit. When you come up with some verifiable facts, let me know. Until then this is your opinion and you're welcome to it, however baseless it may be.

The dash on the Corvette is not leather. My Carrera's is. The door panels on a Corvette are not leather. Mine are. The console on a Corvette is not leather. Mine is. The overhead panel on Corvette is not Alcantara. Mine is. Corvettes come with "leather seating surfaces", not an all leather interior. Here's a hint: all means total, or complete, not just the side of the seat your backside contacts.

It is obvious you're not interested in a real debate over the merits of cars, but would rather make stuff up as you go along. Good luck with whatever car you own, but I won't indulge in any more debates with you because you either don't know what you're talking about or you deliberately misstate facts. The last word is yours.

You cannot get a stripped down 911 in my area. maybe you can way out in East Bumfuck. But the dealers make a lot of money on those options and I am fairly certain that if you have a 911 you did not buy a stripped down model. So your price is out of whack with reality. You have to alter the truth constantly because you are wrong and cannot admit it.