Lots of folks buy Subaru for different reasons but most have AWD.
How many folks keep it on the pavement and how many go out in the dirt?
(I'm supposing a WRX won't really be found out rock hopping with the Toyota Land Cruisers and Jeep Willies.)
TBerk
Subaru awd is, of course, designed for use on tarmac, where it gives huge advantages. In fact, Subaru don't build a true off-roader atall. The Forester is the nearest you will get. That's not to say that a Forester won't be better on gravel tracks than any conventional 2wd saloon - and as good as most of the 'soft-roaders' - but don't expect to take it where you would take a Land Rover.
David Betts snipped-for-privacy@motorsport.org.uk
I was rear ended accident and pushed off the road, does that count?
Gary
I count myself as an off-roader because I take my Forester hunting, off old dirt farm lanes and fields. When these areas are wet my friends pickup cannot follow. Then there is the snow. I live up a steep hill which can otherwise be impassable. OTOH most of the time I'm on the road and like the car-like ride. I see all these pristine shopping mall goliaths that ride like trucks and have never had a tire touch dirt ;) Frank
That's why we got all-wheel drive, so we don't go off road inadvertently.
Years ago (late 60's), a buddy of mine got a Toyota Land Cruiser. We took a ride in the Lewis and Clark Forest in Montana and promptly got stuck in the middle of a stream when it stalled. The water was over the sills but did not come in. He was able to restart it even with the tailpipe under water and we made it to the other side. I wouldn't dare try that with my outback.
Al
We did once, but ground clearance is so low that someone had to be out in front of car to tell driver how to turn wheels so as not to remove stuff from the undercarriage. We were taking a "shortcut" home after a drunken all-day concert in the mtns. We made it no problem, but it took us a couple hours longer than it would have otherwise. Ahhh, the good old days. So ... route selection can be critical.
Dear Gary,
Just as long as you were not "rear ended" by Strap-on Sally !!!!!!!!!.
When you say the awd system is designed for use on tarmac, this makes me wonder about the WR cars on all those dirt/gravel roads.
The reason I ask is that I'm currently considering a WRX or STI precisely because Subies do so well in world rally racing, and I'd like to be able to flog the thing on unpaved backroads.
What do you mean by "soft-roaders"?
...Ron
Depends on what sort of "off-roading" you're talking about, because that encompasses a large set of possibilities. I've taken my OBW onto the backroads and mining roads, mostly gravel and dirt/mud. But do I go rock-climbing with it? Not a chance. It has sufficient amount of ground clearance for gravelling.
I actually bought the 4WD capabilities mostly for snow traction on regular roads in the winter.
Yousuf Khan
I got my Outback for the New England snow, not for offroading. And none of those clunky SUVs get 25 mpg in city and 30 mpg on the open road like my Outback does!!
Nope. With a limited slip in the rear, I might have gotten up to the campsite in Ouray (Colorado) this weekend...we ended up carrying the tent
100ft. up the road. But my old GTI wouldn't have made it up that far. :) C
The WRX bears no relation to the World Rally cars. Those are pure racing machines which use reinforced versions of the same shell and the same engine block. I doubt anything much else is interchangeable...certainly not transmissions/drive trains. They aren't even built by Subaru - they are built by Prodrive in Banbury. Apart from anything else, the World Rally cars will have completely different suspension, wheel, tyre and drive-train combinations for gravel and tarmac rallies.
When I say the WRX's awd system is designed for use on tarmac, however, that doesn't mean it won't work better than a 2wd system on dirt roads....of course it will. The point I was trying to make is that you don't have to drive off road to gain the benefit from it. No reason why you shouldn't, though, as long as you avoid deep ruts, deep mud, big rocks, steep descents, etc. The car doesn't have a lot of ground clearance and it doesn't have low-range gears.
Pose-mobiles from the likes of Mercedes and BMW which look like off-roaders, but are never really taken off road and have very limited abilities when they are.
David Betts snipped-for-privacy@motorsport.org.uk
8D
TBerk
A "real" 4x4 (like a Jeep) has the front and rear drive axels "locked" whereas a Subaru has a center differential between the two.
The MT versions have a viscous coupled rear drive axel, that is the transmission directly drives the front wheels, but goes through something like a torque converter to drive the rear wheels. The front and back wheels can turn at different speeds when you are, for instance, driving around a parking lot, but if you get a front wheel on ice, the large difference in speed of the two ends of the center differential causes the viscocity of the liquid to increase and turn the rear axel, despite the difference in torque.
AWD is as good as 4x4, unless you are driving across bolders and through foot deep mud, which is why it works great for WR cars, which are doing
100kph on dirt/gravel roads, but also need to drive on dry pavement.-- Dominic Richens | snipped-for-privacy@alumni.uottawa.ca "If you're not *outraged*, you're not paying attention!"
Hi TBerk, All!
On Mon, 01 Sep 2003 07:59:11 GMT, in alt.autos.subaru you wrote:
I have traveled offroad extensively in my old GL wagon, and have embarrassed drivers in full-sized 4X4s. Ya gotta be good at driving the high line, and callous indifference to dings and bashes doesn't hurt either ("What the hell; it's just an old Subaru!"). It doesn't like rock crawling, deep water or deep mud (even with all wheels chained . . . don't ask), but other than that it's a game little car, and will go 95% of anywhere my lifted, locker equipped Jeep Cherokee would; but in greater comfort, and with far better mileage. Sold the Jeep, kept the Subaru. I drove my WRX wagon all of the way to the end of the Spruce Creek jeep road last friday (SW of Breckenridge CO), goin' fishin' (fishin' but not catchin', alas :-). No problems, and was the only non-SUV/4X4 parked at the trail-head. Had good rally-fun on the way out as well, passing several lumbering SUVs. Again, you gotta pick a good line thru the rocks and wash-outs, and then be able to stay on it. Caveat: Spruce Creek isn't (IMO) a very difficult jeep trail, and there _were_ a couple spots where the WRX _wouldn't_ have gone if it had been much worse. Never-the-less, there and back in fine style. Didn't stop for fotos Friday, but visit for fotos from a trip last fall. Lincoln Gulch Road in the White River National Forest east of Aspen CO (significantly easier than Spruce Creek, BTW), and the fishing at the lake (Grizzly Lake ~12.5K ft.) in the last foto was good. Snowed a bit on the walk out, tho.
ByeBye! S.
Steve Jernigan KG0MB Laboratory Manager Microelectronics Research University of Colorado (719) 262-3101
As others have pointed out, there's not enough ground clearance for hardcore offroad use.
Subarus excel at bad roads and snow. I've done 40mph on badly corrigated logging roads in relative comfort. The independent suspension handles bad dirt roads with ease and the AWD works great in snow. If you want to do serious offroad stuff, get a jeep. If you need to traverse bad roads and snow reliably and comfortably, get a Subie.
My Unimog is NOT a pose-mobile.
-DanD
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