Jeep Weber conversion stud problems

I'll assume you understand double nutting and have unsuccessfully attempted it.

Steel studs, in an aluminum manifold?

Torch!

|> Weber Conversion Kit :: 82 CJ8 |>

|> Instructions say to "Remove the manifold studs from the intake |> manifold. Double nut each stud to remove. .. DOUBLE NUTTING MAY RUIN |> THE NUTS BUT WILL NOT DAMAGE THE STUDS" |>

|> Well -- these studs don't want to come loose. None of them. |>

|> No obvious corrosion. Never been off before. You can see them at: |>

|>

|> All I have tried is "double nutting" them. And they are sitting in |> little pools of "Liquid Wrench' for the moment. |>

|> I don't have any special tools. Would rather use patience and seek |> advice before using brute force and making the situation worse. |>

|> Any advice on what I should be doing? | |I'll assume you understand double nutting and have unsuccessfully attempted |it. | |Steel studs, in an aluminum manifold? | |Torch!

Agreed. Clean off the LW, and heat each one till it's cherry-red on the end. The expansion/contraction will break the mechanical grip of years of electrolysis & corrosion at the aluminum/steel junction. While they are fairly hot, melt some beeswax (see the canning supplies section at a supermarket) on the stud so it flows down like your LW did. Don't laugh, it works!. The go back to your double nuts and I'll be they come right out.

Good luck.

But take off the base plate first! The photo shows the carb base or vacuum plate still in place. That is the black 3/8" thick plate that controls the manifold vacuum to the carb.

I have used a plumbers pipe wrench to remove studs like that. The pipe wrench 'will' wreck the threads on the stud, but if it can possibly turn a pipe wrench with a chunk of 2" pipe on the handle for leverage will move it.

I would torch it first still.

Mike

86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's

Michael Pomeroy wrote:

Jeez....I was thinking just heat the aluminum.

|> Agreed. Clean off the LW, and heat each one till it's cherry-red on the |end. The |> expansion/contraction will break the mechanical grip of years of |electrolysis & |> corrosion at the aluminum/steel junction. While they are fairly hot, |melt |> some beeswax (see the canning supplies section at a supermarket) on the |stud so |> it flows down like your LW did. Don't laugh, it works!. The go back |to your |> double nuts and I'll be they come right out. |>

| |Jeez....I was thinking just heat the aluminum.

And pass up an opportunity for technical overkill??

I'm trying to get his ass to work on Monday!

:)

Hot damn! (At least I think that is the technical term for :: Success!!)

Thanks to each who posted suggestions.

I tried several things. Details below for anybody who cares to see what it took.

So two follow up questions, please:

1 -- Now that it is time to put in the new studs should I use anything at all on the threads? Any lubricant; any sealer; anything? Anything that will help or be harmful? Or should I just place the new studs in dry? 2 -- The new studs are completely threaded from one end to the other. I assume I must double nut them to get them back in, right? Then how tight; how far do I try to get the new studs into the manifold?

How I did it:

1: Got some PB Blaster. Every 1/2 hour or so when I could - from yesterday to this afternoon - I applied more on each stud and rapped on each stud with a hammer.

2: Went to Sear's and bought their "Stud Remover". It looks like this tool might work well for slightly larger studs, but was useless for these.

3: Cleaned up all the oil and flammables as best I could in the target area. Put heat on the aluminum only. Tried double nutting -- nothing. Nuts would always turn prior to stud breaking loose.

4: Took a third nut and tightened it down to the top nut. Heated aluminum again -- turned very hard on the first stud -- with a fairly loud "crack" it broke loose and threaded out with just my fingers.

5: Repeated my "triple nutting" technique on the remaining studs. Each was easier than the previous one and, by the time I got to the fourth I didn't even have to apply additional heat.

So one more big sigh of appreciation to each of you!!

Mike

----- Michael Pomeroy snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com

I have a problem with your description of the new studs....

'threaded all the way' means no shoulder to bottom out on. This can let the stud bottom out inside the manifold and in some cases you could crack the aluminum or punch a hole into the waterjacket. (My 86 has a water jacket inside the intake manifold)

I would be measuring the depth of the hole or the depth the old studs went in and be marking the new ones the same.

I would then use some 'Loctite' on the threads and let it cure before adding the Weber.

Double nutting should work to put them in if they don't go deep enough with your fingers.

Mike

86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's

Michael Pomeroy wrote:

Me too. Those aren't studs, they're lengths of threaded rod.

The originals are coarse thread into the manifold and fine thread for the nuts.

You could just buy a chunk of threaded rod to match the manifold end of the old studs and cut it to length.

I don't understand why it has to be threaded all the way though. And if the base plate has to thread into the studs, then it would have to be coarse threads in the base plate or you would need a shoulder stud like the stock one with different threads on each end.

We have a fastener specialty company that has every type of threaded rod made in all sizes called Brafasco here in Ontario Canada.

Mike

86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's

Michael Pomeroy wrote:

Mike,

You are completely correct -- I was confused -- it wouldn't work this way.

And it was when I finally realized (when it really sunk in) what you are also describing below I figured it out this afternoon.

Success! Thanks so much to people who offered good suggestions!!

Cranked up immediately and ran better than before; though the tune is certainly wrong for the new setup; flatspots and loss of power are gone!! (Year old gas probably doesn't help much either?!)

I know ignorance isn't an excuse, but maybe it is an explanation. I learned a lot.

The new pieces (plural) don't go together like the old piece (singular); and I was fixated on how the old one had come apart.

I figured there must be something that "I" was missing, so I laid all the parts from disassembly and all the parts from the new conversion kit out on the garage floor -- got what instructions came with the kit, and began "playing around".

In hindsite the instructions were accurate, if not entirely clear.

Here is the deal:

The old carb sat on a single spacer/adaptor. Stud's held this adaptor to the intake manifold; passing up through the base of the carburetor where nuts held the entire assembly in place.

With this particular conversion kit, the Weber sits on a two piece spacer/adaptor with three gaskets. The first adaptor attaches to the manifold with "allen head bolts". These "bolts" are countersunk in the adaptor on the top side so they remain flush. The second plate attaches on top of and to the first plate with different "four mounting studs", also allen head. Into this second plate the studs (that's what the instructions call them) or threaded rods (you can see both at:

) are placed. Thenthe carb itself is set on these four; secured with nuts and washers. Hope this all made sense to anybody who is interested -- and thanks again for the help.

Mike

----- Michael Pomeroy snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com