HELP: 93 Toyota Corolla vibration problem!

Sounds more like a BENT wheel.

Replace both front brake hoses, replace the brake fluid, and bleed the brakes.

That may not get the problem. Most tire places use a "static balance." system. Okay for some purposes on newer cars, but this car is 15 years old. Wheels on the 93 Toyota were not exactly the strongest. The wheel needs a dynamic balance and CLOSE inspection to see how true it is running. On the older cars potholes can tend to cause the wheels to become bent. I'd start there. Also the Corolla of the 90's was famous for bad wheel bearings. We could assume it has disc brakes on the front wheels. A close inspection of the spindle and the rotor are next. Not knowing how many miles are on the car (generally we can assume over 100,000) at this age as a minimum - you have all sorts of culprits along the way as possibles. Maybe even combinations. That's without getting to any suspension parts. Look at the most likely first.

1. Bent wheel.
2. Bad wheel balance.
3. Bad bearing.
4. Bad rotor or worn spindle.
5. Suspension parts. (there are several high failure parts on the corolla)

The brake son the Corolla CAN be bad, but have been one of the more reliable things about Toyota. The only question here is how many times the rotors were turned and how accurately. MANY brake shops are butchers. The cut rate places often have poorly trained KIDS doing the job. Nobody should be surprised when they screw up. If too much is taken off a rotor when it is turned, they get sort of square after a while. As the too THINK rotor heats up it tends to go our of round.

Look at the most likely first. Brake lines are down the list pretty far. Since it is only ONE side that seems to be causing the vibration I would look for the most likely things first. You MAY wind up with a bad brake hose, but I'd look elsewhere first. Besides you can't really tell about the hose even when you remove it. Not unless it is obviously collapsed. Hardening of the brake hose arteries is not impossible, just unlikely.

You can start to see the problem when you spin up the wheel on the car. Most tire stores will CHECK the wheel balance OFF the car for free. Especially the store where you bought the tires.

I'd say it's VERY likely a hose or caliper based on the symptoms posted. Sounds like dragging pads which have caused the rotor to warp. So probably he will end up with a new hose, caliper, and rotor before the problem is solved. I say caliper because even if the hose is the cause of the problem the seals in the caliper may have been toasted by the heat and I would replace all three just to be certain that I've got the problem and won't end up with another one shortly.

nate

I already suggested, and the OP checked, most of the stuff you listed. Most tire shops around here use dynamic balancers, and some even have Hunter's new Road Force dynamic balancer.

The problem I've seen on some old brake hoses is not hardening, but a deterioration of the lining. The lining flakes off and blocks the line so when the pedal is released, residual pressure keeps the caliper piston from releasing.

I agree, I had this happen, if the brakes drag, after driving on the highway, the rotor will overheat and warp and cause a vibration due to the brakes dragging on a warped rotor..

fix the dragging brake and you'll also get better gas milage.

Mark

Which region(s) are you basing this data on? Static balancing would yield a satisfactory result for most people most of the time, but what reputable shop relies on this method anymore?

What exactly is wrong with 93 Corolla wheels? Do you even know what their dimensions are? How many lugs and what's their spacing? What changed about this in 1998?

Yes, newer cars avoid this entirely.

I'm curious, what specific problems were the "90's Corolla wheel bearings" famous for? Would this include, say, a 1999 Corolla?

Why assume something (that is groin-poundingly obvious anyway)? Really? "Disc brakes" on the front of a 90's rice burner? Wow, what will they think of next?!

Of course you can; you prophesied that his car has disc brakes! Who would doubt your clairvoyance?

After a shotgun rotor replacement the problem still exists. Hmmmmmmmmm...

Only one side wheel seems to be getting hotter that the rest. That doesn't mean the source of the vibration has been isolated to one side.

Let's copmpletely discount it then.

You have a vast knowledge of what *most* shops will do.

All above advice noted, now direct the OP to a competent mechanic.

Toyota MDT in MO

Don't discount the possibility that the right side drive axle is binding once it has been in motion for some time. The most likely cause of brake-off, power/coast vibration on a car such as this is a bad inner joint on the longer CV axle. Your car's longer CV axle happens to be on the right side. There are too many possibilities to list so I'm just mentioning something that it could *likely* be. Even the outboard joint on the right side could be binding intermittently and causing the higher right wheel temp. Proper diagnosis from a competent mechanic charging fair prices would be your best course of action.

Toyota MDT in MO

< I'd say it's VERY likely a hose or caliper based on the symptoms < posted. Sounds like dragging pads which have caused the rotor to < warp. So probably he will end up with a new hose, caliper, and rotor < before the problem is solved. I say caliper because even if the hose < is the cause of the problem the seals in the caliper may have been < toasted by the heat and I would replace all three just to be certain < that I've got the problem and won't end up with another one shortly.

It can seem the pads are bad when in fact the rotor is not running true. Rotors on the Corolla generally warp because they have been turned at least one time too many. You can't just replace one side. IF it turns out that is the culprit - calipers and rotor - he'll need to do both sides. That gets expensive. You are looking at maybe a $300 - $600 job. Given that the steel wheels on the Toyotas are a bit thin to start with, and tend to go egg shaped just with normal use (pot holes) you might consider that 15 year old wheels may be just a little egg shaped. It may be that simple. Start with the cheap stuff first. Since he just got new tires - a dynamic balance (spin) seems a good place to start, most tire stores will check it for FREE. If the wheel is true, then you can look at the rotor. IF that's it it is going to stick out like a sore thumb. The rotor will be blue as hell. Somebody MAY have put new pads on without turning the rotor. So the pad will also look like dog meat. This stuff is hard to miss.

I don't know where the guy got his new tires. It seems to me that it would be unlikely that any tire store would miss bunged up rotors etc. Every mechanic is a salesman. They are paid to notice that stuff and pass it up the food chain to sell a brake job. Now, many tire stores get VERY sloppy on wheel balances, they often miss our of round wheels especially on 15 year old cars. But the problem may be more subtle - something a "tire mounter" would miss. That says to me a failed SUSPENSION part. OR a CV joint. You need a REAL mechanic to see that. In 99% of tire stores the guys who mount new tires are at the bottom of the food chain, often high school kids who are taught only how to bust and mount tires and maybe do a static balance. (Little bubble machine.) These grunts work on volume getting tin (cars) in and out as fast as they can. They usually can't spot problems that don't yell at them like a blue rotor or hanging pad. They look at only the big stuff they can see. The REAL mechanics are busy on high dollar profitable work, brake jobs, front ends and the like given the limits of the shop's scope of work. Maybe en exhaust system job.

The hose on the Toyotas are one of the more robust parts on the car. I'd just not start at the least likely. You are right about the brakes, but generally those tend to share the problem from side to side. It's easy to spot for a car owner with 20/20 vision. Look at the rotor. Is it gouged or dark blue. If so, you have an expensive brake problem. If not, look at those wheels and wheel bearings. The Corollas tend to use up bearings if they are not repacked at least once a year. Same for the Nissans. Since the Corolla is FWD, the CV joint may be shot. Those tend to wear unevenly from side to side and the right joint tends to fail first in most FWD cars. Again it is a job that when you replace one side, do BOTH because you'll be back in weeks to do the left side anyway.

If the wheels were run on a dynamic balance then I'd look at the CV joint.

Well on the Toyota the brake hoses tend to be on the robust side. Not unusual to last 20 years with no problems. IF the caliper is hanging the rotor will be blued. That should stand out to ANY tire mounter. Since you suggest that the wheels WERE balanced and are NOT out of round in either axis, then not knowing all that was or wasn't checked, I'd suspect a CV joint. THOSE on the Corollas tend to crap out sometime after 10 years. Much better than American cars.

Here is what strikes me. He just got 4 new tires. It is hitting only ONE side of the car. (Right front). It was something that a worker hot to MAKE sales would likely not see. Suggest that obvious BRAKE things hanging pads and blued rotors weren't present. So it is a process of elimination. If I assume even marginal competence of the tire store folks - something they'd NOT necessarily pick up on would be a suspension part or CV joint.

< I agree, I had this happen, if the brakes drag, after driving on the < highway, the rotor will overheat and warp and cause a vibration due to < the brakes dragging on a warped rotor..

And so the rotor will be a pretty MIDNIGHT BLUE. Do you think the guys in the tire store would likely miss that?

Don't discount the possibility that the right side drive axle is binding once it has been in motion for some time. The most likely cause of brake-off, power/coast vibration on a car such as this is a bad inner joint on the longer CV axle. Your car's longer CV axle happens to be on the right side. There are too many possibilities to list so I'm just mentioning something that it could *likely* be. Even the outboard joint on the right side could be binding intermittently and causing the higher right wheel temp. Proper diagnosis from a competent mechanic charging fair prices would be your best course of action. ===========

BINGO.

I think they did. How else to you explain the one wheel being hot to the touch but not the others? My money is still on a brake issue.

nate

If THEY missed it how about you? Is it blue or not?

Let's take the brakes. You'll need to mic the rotor see if it is within tolerance (thickness) that break open the caliper and look at the pads. I never said you were "wrong" on this - just that I'd look other places first. Like the CV joint. If there is a problem you'll see it when you remove the caliper and look at the pads. It IS possible that it needs a cleaning of the pistons and gaskets. (O -rings) I have seen a great many brake jobs really done half-assed. Or on the cheap. BAD IDEA.

I don't know if you have owned this car for a long time or not. One CORNERS CUT brake job is all it takes. Then you are looking at the potential to replace both front rotors and calipers plus pads. The good thing is that good parts should be easy to find in a bone yard. Good rotors and calipers. Thing is they are common as dirt. It may be brakes. I'd not bet on the hose, but it is a cheap fix if it is.

I'll have to take your word for it since I don't go to Wal-Mart or K-Mart for tires.

As I said, the WHEEL bearings are sealed.

Neither do I, but I know people who have. Had a neighbor who worked for Wal Mart - did a brake job - got Wal Mart sued big time.

Ray, I had them do this. The problem still persists. Could it be a brake booster problem?

The tire shop showed me how the wheels turn on a machine. There is a small bit of run-out. But it was slight. Also, wouldn't run out cause a constant vibration?

The rebalanced when they put new tires on under waranty. The vibration still intermitently.

My mechanic says that when a bearing is shot, you can wobble the wheel when it is on the lift by pulling on it. The wheel didn't exhibit this behavior.

Rotors are 3k old. Never turned before.

Mechanic says he checked thoroughly through all of them...

Well, the rotor was bluing, which is why i replaced them about 1000 miles ago. But, I think that is the symptom and not the disease. What can be causing the dragging? could a bad booster cause it?