OT/ON Topic? Grand Voyaher problem

hachiroku · 2005-03-13T05:05:31+00:00

Hey guys (and gals...)I posted this in the Dodge forum, but there doesn't seem to be aresponse. Since we have a bunch of bright, inquisitive people here who mayhave had an issue with this (ART!!!) I'll post it here. Maybe someone hasseen this problem and knows a quick fix:Another engineer I'd like to punch in the nose, but that's for anotherthread:1992 Plym Grand Voyager: this morning in a raging snowstorm the passside windshied wiper stopped working. It appeared as though (from thesound) the linkage came undone. I removed the cowling, etc and foundthat was just what happened. The assembly is the wiper, a thing thatlooks like a knob with a shaft on it, and the end of the shaft isknurled. There was also a spring washer resting under the whole mess inthe cowling.I pressed it all back together using two blocks of wood. The way itwent together I didn't think it was ever coming apart again. It lastedall of 27 minutes.What is supposed to attach to the bottom of the splined shaft? is therea screw or clip I'm missing, or is it perhaps just worn to the pointwhere it doesn't hold anymore?TIA

Mar 13, 2005 Last reply: 21 years ago 24 Replies

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C. E. White 21 years ago

Doesn't this make you wonder about the CR surveys or reliability surveys in general? There are no unique "Buicks" these days. Everything Buick sells is just a slightly disquised version of something sold by one of the other GM divisions. I believe CR has gotten smarter in the last few years. I suspect they "adjust" the results of their surveys to disquise differences in responses when they know the vehicles are basically the same. In the not so distant past it was very common for different GM divisions to get radically different ratings for basicallay the same vehicle in the Consumer Reports survey results. The differences are not so noticeable now in the CR results. JD Powers is definitely not adjusting their ratings. In the JD Powers

2004 Vehicle Dependability Study, Buick got a 187 rating (lower is better). Only Lexus at 162 was better. Pontiac got a 297 rating. However, Pontiacs and Buicks are mostly built of the same parts, in the same factories, and by the same people. In many cases, they are even sold by the same people. Why should Buick's "dependability" be so high, and Pontiac's so low? Oldsmobile's rating was even worse than Pontiac's (314). But Chevrolet's was better (262). Just points out how bogus studies such as this are. And the JD Powers survey is actaully more scientific than the CR surveys. They at least randomly select participants. CR's surveys only reflect the opinions of their readers that choose to respond and these opinions are heavily influenced by the magazine's editiorial content.

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Travis Jordan 21 years ago

Have you ever responded to one of the CU studies?

I thought not. There isn't any 'opinion' section in the reliability surveys.

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C. E. White 21 years ago

Yes I have, every year they send me one.

Yes there is - at least when it comes to remembering or selectively remembering problems. CR does not adequately survey the cost of repairs. And even what little information they do gather is further disguised by the silly circles. I want numbers, not, poor, good, better, best, better than best, etc., etc., etc. I believe (but can't prove) that people who are happy with a car are less likely be as picky as those who are not. I also believe (but can't prove) that CR Readers tend to color what they like based on the opinions they see presented in the magazine or at least that they buy the magazine because they share the opinions.

CR is entertaining, sometimes informative, but there is no way their surveys are statistically valid. This is true for many opinion surveys. Despite your opinion, this is really all the Consumer Reports surveys are. On the other hand, if they could somehow gain access to the repair records and parts usage from all the manufacturers plus actual out of pocket expenses for all users, then they could provide truly significant information. I know such information can be bought, but I don't expect to see it in Consumer Reports anytime soon.

My favorite part of the survey process is the appeal for money. How much did you send in last year?

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Art 21 years ago

I disagree with you. One component differerence between sister cars can make a big difference in reliability. The Chrysler 300M had window problems in its first year and that single problem from crappy motors from China and sticky weatherstripping ruined its reliability record.

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Art 21 years ago

Actually according to Consumer Reports surveys, some of the least reliable cars have very high satisfaction ratings. They are surprised but they really shouldn't be. All cars are pretty reliable these days and even a relatively unreliable one is far more reliable then the most reliable car from 20 years ago. What it means is that reliability should not count much in your buying decision unless you personally consider it extremely important.

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