Removing Turbo

Don't do it, you'll be sorry.

The exhaust driven turbine is not spinning now, as the bearing is shot: this will prevent the exhaust gases from leaving the engine quickly enough for the car to run correctly.

It is sort of like sticking a potato in the exhaust pipe.

Now, were you to plug the oil orifices and then remove the exhaust manifold with the turbo on it and substitue a different used exhaust manifold without a turbo (normally aspirated, or N.A.), you would still have problems.

That is because the turbo engine uses low compression pistons.

It would be seriously underpowered, bad enough it probably couldn't make it up a hill of any size, let alone run correctly.

Your best option: bolt on a used exhause manifold w/ turbo and hope for the best.

You can run without a turbo. As you say, you've been doing it for years. You'll just be one of the more sedate Volvos on the road. Most of the time in suburban driving, and maybe even on the highway, you won't miss it. Blocking the oil (and water?) lines is easy. The question is, can you - easily and economically - remove the turbo and connect your exhaust header directly? Probably not. I'm not aware of any header system that bolts on in place of the turbo. Doesn't mean there isn't one - just I'm not aware of it. If there is such a part, chances are it'll be a small-volume item, at a correspondingly high price. Can you fix the seal? These are replaceable. Check with some of the turbo rebuild outfits, or maybe places like IPD. Remember, you aren't too worried about your turbo performing to spec - just not blowing oil. Alternatively, pull a turbo at your local rustyard. Make sure you can bring it back if it doesn't work. They usually run adequately for 200K or so. Get one at 100K and you've got half a lifetime left in it. Before you pull it, take a look at the tail pipe. If it's been leaking oil badly (and, of course, for other reasons too) there'll be a thick, soft, black coating of carbon. If the pipe looks normal, it's probably worth a risk.

Pete (fP)

wrote in message news: snipped-for-privacy@q75g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...

The easiest thing to do is remove wheels off the shaft of the shot turbo, plug the oil feed and drain lines (disconnected) leave the water connected as it should be (if its a later watercooled turbo) then re-install the turbo. Alot easier than messing about with different manifolds / pipework etc...

Tim..

Either find a good used turbo, rebuild yours, or sell the car and buy one without a turbo. It's a lot of screwing around to remove it, you'll require much of the intake and exhaust system from a non-turbo car, you'll have to find a reliable way to plug the oil supply and return lines, and in the end you'll have a dangerously anemic hack job of a car with signficantly less power than the non-turbo version had, and almost zero resale value. In a nutshell, don't even try it. If you're really desparate, you can get a new knockoff turbo on ebay for

Thank you guys for the advise. I like the one about removing the wheels of the turbo best. Sooo, I can just block the oil feed line and there will be no problem? Say if I put a swagelok plug which mounts in a steel tube like kids play and can take plenty of pressure I should be fine. The engine or oil pump will not "explode" or something out of having that oil line blocked? Just double checking... I just don't have a clue what kind of pump is an oil pump.

Anyways today I was trying again to remove the last bolt of the exhaust manifold and it beat me. There isn't enough space to put the rachet, and the open wrench I have was slipping on the hex head... drat! I will try again, now that I borrowed a closed wrench. This is the first time I try playing the mechanic, is there an obvious trick of the trade I am missing? or some magic tool all mechanics should have (besides a better brain)? Thanks.

Same problem with the two bolts of the return oil line, and the bolt at the manifold holder underneath. I'll keep working on it. Those are the very last ones, after that I can take the turbo off and decide the next step.

Just an update from today: I read somewhere that you could check the play in the turbo to decide if it was rebuildable (if play was uniform and

I just never understood the mentality of half assed hack jobs like this. Unless you're stuck on the side of the road and have to get home, any job worth doing is worth doing right. You're doing 95% of the work for 2% of the result of just repairing the turbo you already have or sticking a good used one on. I see bastardized cars like this in wrecking yards from time to time and always have to wonder what was going through the person's head at the time. It makes me cringe.

Have to admit that James has a point. Seems like you are doing most of the work and ending up with a poor result.

If you are keen to learn then why not look into a second hand turbo and finish the learning process. What you will learn will outweigh the cost of the second hand turbo.

Be a proud DIY'er but if you have to pay somebody to do all the work then I may agree, turf the turbo.

Maybe you didn't read my message. It is true, I might buy a second hand turbo. But I don't use it much or at all, and I don't want it to fail again. The resale value of my car is technically ZERO. What is going through my head is: I DON'T NEED A TURBO. Why the hell to get one for, when I can live without the trouble of having one. In other words, If it isn't there it won't break. It is ME driving not you. I know my roads, I know what I need the car for. I don't take trips, I don't go in the highway. I can only drive the car for 1 mile trips at night, and to go grocery shopping once every 15 days, in the steep hills of central Illinois. I haven't seen the shadow of a hill in 8 years, and I don't expect to see one now.

When you go and buy my car out of the junkyard you can buy a rebuilt turbo for $600 install it and enjoy the car. I myself might consider spending $300 on an used turbo, Install it and have it fail on me again because I don't know how to do the stupid job. For all I know, I probably won't be able to undo the darn thing anyway. I don't want to put money on the table that I will loose anyway. There is no recovering the money regardless of what I do.

Does that answer your question of why "half assed hack jobs" are done for? They are done, so you can achieve some sort of result with minimum investment when you estimate the return otherwise or anyway to be negative.

If I can't loose the last nuts I'll have to trash the car anyway, is it that hard to understand. When you are a mechanic with experience all is simple and rosy. Right now I am just thinking of salvaging something, whatever I can.

Anyway, thank for your opinion.

chc

Stuck exhaust manifold nuts can be a real nightmare.

Start by spraying it very liberally with a penetrant, and let it soak overnight.

I use PB Blaster.

Next, you need to be able to get a wrench on it.

Do you have a ratchet with extension and one of those swivels to put on the end?

If you can get an angle on it, that is the way to go, otherwise is the closed end of a hand wrench, preferably one with a slight angle to it, and work it off.

Just be patient: work on cars is one endless process of problem solving.

If all else fails, perhaps you could chisel the nut off, provided you can get the correct angle.

Just do an engine (nonturbo) swap out of a junker? Maybe sell off the old engine to recoup some?

Predictably, this question comes up fairly often. I haven't heard of anybody who actually removed a turbo; you are probably seeing it is not a trivial thing. The results are likely to be worse than you expect, given the low compression ratio of the turbo engine. You might get better performance using a dog team to pull the car around.

BTW - have you verified the problem is not just crankcase pressure from blockages or restrictions in the crankcase ventilation system? Our '85 765T began creating a massive smoke screen from the exhaust when the ventilation got bad; the pressure caused the oil to back up in the drain and overflow into the exhaust. Cleaning the ventilation fixed that. Removing the oil filler cap and trying to blow through the hose at the turbo inlet should produce the sort of pressure and flow you would get blowing out a candle. If it feels like you are blowing through a soda straw something is blocked.

Mike

In article , wrote: [ ... ]

Ok, another update.

I just have the turbo and manifold in my hands. Uhu!! Actually the suggestion of getting swivel ratchet dice was the solution. $15 well spent on Autozone for a set of 6. These are the ones that have like double articulation. That way you can rotate the nut making force from quite an angle. It was just a charm, there is some magic tools after all. It had to put quite some force into it though. When it finally gave way, I wasn't sure I had loosen the screw or broken it. Anyway, I am a happy dog now.

Assuming I can get the turbo off the manifold (I hope the worse part is past), I think I will try buying the used turbo. The only thing I am kind of concerned is that the return oil tube became loose from the engine, and I don't see how it was attached to the engine. It was not a screw and I can't believe it was a just a pressure fitting in place. The Haynes manual is not really that helpful there. I wonder if somebody would like to comment... I mean I will try to put it back, but I really have no a clue how it went there.

BTW the only other thing is that I couldn't loose the oil feed line from the engine (the nut is just behind other stuff and inaccessible), so to actually get the turbo out I had to bend that line out of the way. Let's hope it doesn't break. I will remove it now that there is space and clean it well. I will update again once I have done some progress. Thanks a lot to everybody for the help. It never ceases to amaze me how awesome the internet is. It is just such an empowering thing. It is in reality one if not the one most marvelous thing in modern civilization.

Anyway, thanks guys.

ch

It just pressure fits, it bolts to the turbo and that holds it, the return oil is not pressurized.

You can get it with an open end wrench, if the wrench is too thick a bench grinder can fix that. I usually just leave the line attached to the block though.

If you send the turbo out for a rebuild make sure you get the oil feed line replaced too. I had this work done and the oil feed was NOT replaced and the turbo failed 4 months later... replacing the oil feed tube was a requirement for warranty coverage!

Just one more thing to keep in mind.

blurp

The resale value of your car is completely irrelevant to the decision of whether to repair or not. You could go out and buy another used car for $5,000. Or you could spend $2,000 to have a mechanic repair this car. Or you could spend $1,000 for a rebuilt turbo and do the work yourself. Or you could drive without a turbo. It's your choice, but don't clutter up the discussion with a lot of irrelevant information. What you need is transportation so figure out the way that makes the most sense for your driving needs given the money that you have to spend on car repairs.

Does your state have emissions testing? If so, consider that the car might fail. If that is not a problem and you are willing to live with a car that will likely be underpowered and get worse milage than with a turbo then go ahead.

Don't waste your money on a junkyard turbo. It will be likely as worn as yours.