new camrys

Check out the new Avalon next time. Even though it is only 1.5" wider,

If you really want to blow your mind, check out the Ford 500. Incredible ergonomics and features for the money. I own a 1999 Chrysler 300M and 2001 Toyota Avalon. It is my 4th and last Toyota. Yes the Toyota may still be slightly more reliable but even Consumer Reports says that domestics are catching up more everyday, and when you compare ergonomics and value at some point the Toyota is just no longer a good deal.

Wait for the next gen Camry.

I did check it out. A couple of problems. While Ford made an attempt to capture a market, why did they have to use the old tired taurus-sable engine, with no options. It is an underwhelming, problematic engine to say the least. Its like they borrowed everything for this car. The choice of chassis was good, taking it from their volvo line, but did they have to use the taurus engine. We all know people Im sure, who have had horror stories with their taurus/sables. I think ford taurus led the returns of lemon cars, then any other model for years. I took it for a test drive, and you can hear and feel that engine straining, especially at slow cruising speeds. Try going around forty miles an hour, and then need to speed up to sixty. The engine sounds and feels like its going to fall apart. Gearing is all wrong and spaced, and engine has no midline torque. Also, even though the car is large, there is a big problem with front leg room(rear leg room is great) and the most hard uncomfortable seats you can imagine. Ford had a plan and botched it good. Compare it to the chrysler 300(the one up from the smaller engine) and you have a comparably priced car, and something that is a new design and is all around 100 times superior. However, my garage is small, and I cant fit a 300 in my garage. I have my sequoai and my wifes camry, in which I am looking to replace, and a 300 would be too wide. If I had the room, would not hesitate to buy the

Thanks

That is the same conclusion as one of the buff mags when they rated the Camry sixth of the six midsize cars they tested, because of the $6,500 premium price over the others tested. They said Toyota make good stuff buy they are way overprice compared to their competitors vehicles. I came to that conclusion as well, seven years ago, when I stopped buying Toyota products ;)

mike hunt

Art wrote:

It is your money spend it where you wish but before you spend an extra $10,000 to drive an Acura home I suggest you take another ride in the 500. This time drive it like an CVT tranny is supposed to be driven. Floor the throttle till you get to the speed you want then let off. If you only give it part throttle you are starting in the higher gear ratios. As to the Duratec engine it is bullet proof. We see thousands of them in our fleet service business easily going to 200K trouble free. The 500 out performs the Chrysler 300 with it larger 3.5 V6 and still gets nearby 30 MPG. By the way that chassis was designed by Ford engineers, not Volvo. It was just used first in a Volvo.

mike hunt

"j.lef" wrote:

Actually it's a sophisticated all aluminum 24 valve dual chain driven DOHC. No doubt, you referring to the 3L Vulcan engine - a very different animal. Naturally, a 5+L V8 would've been nice but it is aimed at the family market.

No doubt there'll be a lot of blinking when production of the new Sonata ramps up.

I was a 91 Toyota Camry owner as well and have since owned Two toyota's. My 2002 Sienna and 2004 Sienna are not panning out to be any where near the quality the Camry was. Since the Sienna and Camry are on same chassis my advice is to look at Honda.

Believe it or not, people are also squawking about "alleged" quality declines with Honda too.

Your '02 may have been a rare Toyota lemon, because I am not aware of any major issues with that version. As for the '04, I hope your rad was replaced free of charge because there was a recall for that.

Even if their quality has gone down a bit, Toyota is still heads above the big 3 for long-term reliability.

I had 2 91 Taurus's though I think they had 3.8 engines. If the problem you had with your Taurus engine was headgasket related, almost all manufacturers were having headgasket problems at the time including Toyota.

The Korean manufacturer has been running ads about its new US factory. Looks pretty darn impressive. Especially when the car chasis apparently takes and upside down spin in what I presume is primer.

Any rattles?

Not only Ford and Toyota, just about every other manufacture had all kinds of gasket problems for several years. I costs them and the gasket manufacture millions. Blame the environuts and the government for that fiasco. They outlawed asbestos without allowing the gasket manufacture time to test the replacement materials. Same thing happen with paints.

mike hunt

Art wrote:

It is not the Sonata, it is a full size vehicle. I saw that Hyundai at the NYC auto show, I think it was called a 400GLX. Bigger than an Avalon with a big V6 six speed tranny, loaded to the hilt, real wood and all less than the price of a V6 Camry.

It is being built in a federal and state taxpayer subsidized plant being assembled by low wage non union workers being trained in a state training school paid by the taxpayers of Alabama of Korean parts. Just like the Toyota plants in the US. No wonder domestics are having a tough time competing. At least the Korean tax laws much, like those in Europe, will not let Hyundai avoid US corporate federal income taxes on the profits earned in the US like the Japanese manufacture can.

mike hunt

Art wrote:

This is the "bubblecar" syndrome. It's incurable short of something like a Land Rover or Towncar, both of which are, well, less than inspiring choices.

The GMs are good if you get the right car. Basically it boils down to two choices in a sedan:

- LeSabre. Bulletproof engine and a better car than the Avalon for the money.

- Chevy Impala with the 3.8 engine. A slightly smaller, more sporty LeSabre. Based upon the LeSabre frame, and with the same engine. You can get a one year old one this fall for not a lot of money as well.

Now, true, I like Toyotas and Volvos and many care more than Gm's crap, but they do make maybe 5 vehicles that are worth recommending(and one of them is the Vibe - heh) The other two are the Suburban/Tahoe and A stock GMC 1500 shortbed with the

Btw, my father and uncles have a million miles on still running GM 3.8 engines between them.

The engine still gets 1980's gas mileage, though. It's a hopelesly crude design compared to a typical Japanese or European engine.

My neighbour bought a '99 Silverado new, and he got rid of it after 2 years because he had so many problems with it. I thought he had simply got a lemon, but I read somewhere recently that GM's full size trucks are crap now. Since the Suburban and Tahoe are on the same platform, I wouldn't count on those being reliable either. GM just doesn't build their trucks like they used to anymore.

The non-supercharged version of that engine was probably the last good V6 that GM ever made.

All the Korean car companies lag behind the Japanese in gas mileage.