Somewhat OT: Bad karma and social problems

Ah, now that is truly an expert way of showing your bigotry.

The stupid part is you think you are just so darn smart.

And to think you think _I'm_ deluded . . . .

Reply to
Budd Cochran
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ok, as if i give a shit. but i gotta say, not very christian of you budd.

Reply to
theguy

no, my impression is that he thinks you are nuts.

Reply to
theguy

Nicely done

ROFLMFAO

Roy

Reply to
Roy

Now, just where did that cartoon bash christians?

I saw a cool sig at another group. Sorta like this. "When relgion ruled the world they called it the dark ages" don't know (or care) if it is factual but found it a bit interesting.

Reply to
Roy

I am kind of curious about the degradation of threads recently. It seems that Christian bashing has become somewhat of a sport lately in the group. I for one am an unashamed Christian, perhaps not as vocal as Budd, but a Christian nonetheless.

What useful purpose are we accomplishing when we bait those of faith? Just because you are unfaithed, does not give you a license to criticize those who are of faith. Conversely, we Christians should not be overzealous in our evangelism towards the unfaithful. The cup is there for those who wish to partake.

I would just recommend that we all conduct ourselves as gentlemen and women regardless of our religious persuasion.

Mike

Reply to
Mike Simmons

The tribes fight being weaned off of support and towards self reliance. Their main attempt is through gambling rather than a more substantial economic infrastructure. Failure to wean themselves causes oppression.

Reply to
miles

Seeing as you appear to direct this to me, I'll try to give you my take on it.

Then perhaps you should speak to budd. He accuses everybody of christian bashing constantly. I don't see it. I see budd being slapped for some of his bs, he turns it to christian bashing, I really don't see it as christian bashing.

Christian bashing is anything anybody say's to budd. He has been accusing me of christian bashing I think because I found the cartoon mildly funny.

You have absolutley no idea what faith I am. Budd is a friggin idiot, because he claims to be a christian matter's not to me he is still a friggin' idiot. Hell Mike he's been baiting all his post's, a person is a bigot, or a liberal, or a hypocrite or whatever. He bait's for a reason, he want's attention, sometimes he get's it. Some of the time I find his foolishness a bit funny. If you want to label that as c-bashing have at it.

Google and take a look at our childs post's on other groups.

You recomendation is noted.

Roy

Reply to
Roy

Not at all, Mike. We're reacting. We have tried to be civil, asking Budd to "calm down" all the way up to "shut the f*ck up". Now, it is just plain funny to watch him go in circles.

I, for one, wish we talked about trucks more. In fact, I'd be happy to the point of a little pink thing popping out if we didn't discuss religion or politics ... EVER again.

Happy for you and wish you the very best. And I will continue to do so ... until you try to cram it down my throat. Then I'm going to give you dose of your own medicine ... just like Budd is getting.

It's not a threat, it's a reaction.

Might I suggest that you take a moment and search the archives? You'll find numerous un-christian accusations by Budd. He can't act like a Nazi and expect people to just take it.

I, at one point, had put him in my killfile. Which doesn't work so well. Granted, I don't get his posts, but I get all the posts that people are responding to.

Precisely. Your view is appreciated. Really.

Sounds good Mike. We have all tried to put up with Budd and now he is getting what he deserves. When he stops ... everyone else will too.

Craig C.

Reply to
Craig C.

well said mike, my problem with the whole religious bickering and the reason I care not to read these threads that turn into this is, it does no one any good. lets remember the tolerance that Christ teaches of each other.

here food for thought also.

[Titus 3:9] But avoid foolish controversies and genealogies and arguments and quarrels about the law, because these are unprofitable and useless. Warn a divisive person once, and then warn him a second time. After that, have nothing to do with him. [2 Timothy 2:14] Keep reminding them of these things. Warn them before God against quarreling about words; it is of no value, and only ruins those who listen. [2 Timothy 2:23] Don't have anything to do with foolish and stupid arguments, because you know they produce quarrels. And the Lord's servant must not quarrel; instead, he must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful.

Now, I'm done. May the Lord be with you in your walk.

Reply to
Chris Thompson

Jesus told me to do it.

I am smart. Both academically and street-wise. I could post my accomplishments for you ... but then I'd be accused of racism, polymorphism or some other "ism"/"otry" that you dream up.

I don't just think it. You leave absolutely nothing to the imagination, Budd.

Craig C.

Reply to
Craig C.

How sad you are.

Bye, again.

Reply to
Budd Cochran

And you deny the hateful comments you've made regarding my beliefs?

Mike is right, but you and those like you that choose to bash me for my beliefs and, consequently, bash my beliefs in the process are too thick headed, too bigoted, and too intolerant to ever realize what you're doing.

No, we don't know your religious beliefs, but as Jesus said, "By their fruits (That is what you demonstrate to the public with your actions, words and lifestyle), you will know them." and all that you say I've called you is, according to that Scripture, only what the "fruit" you, T-bone, theguy, Craig and others bear in this forum, and that is showing what you think of me as a Christian that lives as he believes he should.

It sure is some rotten fruit you're bearing, Roy, and the trees that bear it will be cut down, according to the Bible, at the end of the Harvest.

And that's not my word, that what the Word of God says about it. Take your argument up with Him, cause I'm not going to see your posts anymore.

Reply to
Budd Cochran

Really? That's not what I keep hearing from the Dine', the Cherokee, the Ute, Lakota.

Maybe the gambling is the way they found they can finally win against the white man and hit him where it hurts the most, his wallet.

Reply to
Budd Cochran

Suddenly, without warning, Budd Cochran exclaimed (30-Oct-06 11:49 PM):

They certainly were treated poorly in the past, but most of their problems today are self-inflicted, or a problem of individuals. Show me a *current* law, in either country, that subjugates either peoples.

Well, duh. Of course. Nothing stopping them really, if they're willing to work at it. Plenty of Aboriginals are still here, either on a station, leading a traditional or pastoral (ranching) life, or living in town, integrated into the modern world.

I don't even know what you mean by that. Whites throwing their weight around by making sure Aboriginals that commit crimes get off are throwing their weight around? To you, this should be a good thing: You seem to support reverse discrimination.

That's the biggest damn copout I've ever heard. I do NOT consider this a valid excuse. I, myself, grew up verbally and emotionally abused - being told by my father that I was worthless, and believed it for a time. Never did I fall into a bottle. I just slowly picked up the shattered pieces of my self esteemed and proved the bugger wrong!

Plenty of Aboriginals, and American Indians, have done the same, and continue to do so. To say they're justified in falling into a bottle is really doing them a disservice.

"Abo", by the way, is a pejorative, much like the N word for African-Americans.

Doubt that, really, though she's entitled to that opinion. Since that's then, and this is now, the point is moot: There's no way to know for sure since we can't go into the past and experiment with events.

Human nature, really, they'd argue about who gets what bit of land, each side of course wanting the best bits, and in the end, I imagine we'd still be were we are today. Not all the atrocities between Whites and Indians were committed by the Whites, or even directly caused by some action by whites.

Interestingly enough, this part of history has gone very differently for the Aboriginal. They own great swaths of land across the continent, and are gaining control of many more due to the Land Rights Act - like the city of Perth, in Western Australia:

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as an example. They now own and control Uluru - Kata Tjuta National Park (Ayres Rock, The Olgas), which is the biggest tourist spot in Central Australia. Understandably, it does factor rather largely in their dreamtime, so their ownership of these two really large rocks seems fair to me. The ridiculous part comes in when they don't try to claim an area until it's making some sort of profit. The Act supposedly says that only gov't owned land can be claimed, and only after rigorous historical research to prove that the claimants are the traditional owners of that land. From what I hear on the news, it doesn't always work that way. Thus, Perth. And some guy who researched a piece of land overlooking the ocean, found no traditional ownership, started to develop it, then some traditional owners popped out of the woodwork - AFTER he'd spent some huge amount of money developing the area. They're not supposed to be able to take privately owned land, but in this case, they're trying. Things like this do not improve relationships between the cultures.

I saw one reference that 13% of the Australian landmass is Aboriginal owned, but that 90% is under claim. No idea if that is accurate or not.

True. But there's no reason at all that this shouldn't already be happening. It seems to be happening here - alcoholism is still a major problem in the Aboriginal communities, but I see many more that, even if they don't have jobs, are clean, normal citizens (many in this neighborhood). And this despite the problems of racism still seen within *both* communities.

Australia has it's "stolen generation" as well, though here it was mostly 'half-caste' kids. We probably got the idea from them, more's the pity. Started around 1900, in some places, it continued to 1970. Note that some parents gave up their kids voluntarily, hoping it'd give them a better life. But all in all, not a pretty picture. BUT, in the past.

I'd think it should be an honor no matter what race the kid is. This sounds like my father's sort of "I'm not a racist! Look, here's my Black friend, Roy". That's how he always mentioned the guy, his Black friend Roy. Not just "my friend Roy", as any color-blind person would.

jmc

Reply to
jmc

Suddenly, without warning, Budd Cochran exclaimed (31-Oct-06 3:17 PM):

Here, they're doing it a bit more constructively, with tourism (as mentioned earlier, Uluru/Kata Tjuta were returned to the traditional owners some years before - including the Yulara. Good cash cow, that.

jmc

Reply to
jmc

Suddenly, without warning, Mike Simmons exclaimed (31-Oct-06 10:39 AM):

I'm still trying to figure out how Bud got "Christian bashing" out of that post.

But I'm with you in this. I think insulting one's religion, belief system, or lack thereof is pointless, since I doubt very many people have switched religions due to some argument - or even reasoned conversation - they had on Usenet. Or anywhere else, for that matter :)

jmc

Reply to
jmc

Budd, you don't get it do ya? I could care less what you believe in, what color you are, if you are gay, how much money you have, what you eat for supper. It does not change the fact that I think you are a friggin idiot!! I think you are a pia about your beliefs, I disagree with the way you present them. so if that's bashing so be it. I really don't care and that's what you can't grasp, I don't give a damn how you or anybody else people feel's about it.

No, because a person disagrees and say's so is not c-bashing.

I'm real comfortable with that.

No what is thought of you as a person and as a person your actions.

We all have to go sometime, and when I go I'll go knowing I've led a real full and pretty much happy life on my own terms.

Yes you will. Because you can't help yourself.

Reply to
Roy

Me too!

Somebody, please point out where a person's belief's were insulted.

Reply to
Roy

Show a "law" that subjugates? How about the fact the US government still advocates, by law, the continuance of the reservations, the financial subsidy of the Amerinds, and the lack of educational facilities, both scholastic and technical readily available to them as compared to whites.

"Give them a fish and they eat today, teach to fish and they eat everday", to paraphrase the Chinese proverb.

"If THEY are willing to work at it . . ." Why does the subjugated always have to "work" at getting along with the opressors????

No, I support true equality, everyone living together in harmony, respecting one another for who they are, what they believe and how they live. IMHO, reverse discrimination is setting quotas for hiring the unqualified over the qualified, regardless of ethnic divisions ( I believe in "One Blood, One Human Race"). No one should not be punished for a crime in any society because of ethnicity.

You think you're alone in that? I was a Polio Survivor (1952 Epidemic) that was constantly reminded that because of the Polio: I should not have survived, would have been better off if I hadn't survived, would never amount to anything, have any strength, endurance or learn to ride a bike, rollerskate, or play sports, and that was just the doctors.

Add to that the fact that what some are saying about me in this group is complimentary compared to what some FAMILY members have said when I was a child, stir with being raised by bigots and bake in a ghetto.

I grew up to be the strongest person, physically and emotionally, and now I believe I'm strong spiritually.

Not everyone can pick themselves up like you and I. Not everyone can resist the presuure to dive in a bottle because of how another ethnic group treats you.

And dening those facts is an insult to those trapped and dying. My source: I was trained as a Race Relations Non-Commisioned Offcer (Sergeant) in the military.

My apologies to them. Funny how much it is used by Aboriginals in the Austrailian movies . . .you don't hear the other word in American movies so much these days, at least not in movies I watch.

I agree, partially, but you just implied her ancestrial traditions and histories are lies.

ALL the Treaties were broken by Whites, contrary to Hollywood.

As for Human Nature, while the Amerinds did have some wars, most, until the whiteman, were settled by taking "coup". Less bloodshed that way and far more civilized than the white method of war.

Are they being given it? Or are they being given back what was theirs to begin with?

They're learning the white man's ways after all.

True, but it is, and not trying to insult the Aboriginals, a very "white" attitude... isn't that what they wanted the Aboriginals to become? Dark skinned "Whites"???

It should be 100% "owned" and 100% shared with other ethnic groups.

And a bigotry of any kind, for any reason, is wrong, but like in Orwell's "1984", you always have some that will consider themselves better than others.

It's sad when a group either has to give up it's children or has them ripped away because of the society. It's worse that the dominant group will be able to object to it happening to themselves but encourage it among the subordinate groups.

I simply said it was an honor, I did not say it was so because of his etnicity. Don't add to what I say and you will understand it better.

And you are wrong about my reasoning, but I doubt you believe that, and it limits your understanding.

Ok, since you taken this tack, then the conversation is over. There was no need to be insulting towards me. If your wondering, like Roy and others, how I could be insulted by something said in this forum, it's as it's been said in this and other groups, "insults are in the ears of the hearer". What could be "funny" to one is an insult to another. Comparing me to your dad was an insult to me.

Reply to
Budd Cochran

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