On 11/05/2014 4:25 PM, firstname.lastname@example.org wrote:
"Rationalized" on basis of dealer cost, maybe, but I can't see there's
anything close to the payback possible for an ordinary passenger car
tire on an automobile driven routinely.
What minimal advantages there are really only accrue for extremely long
intervals between changes such as collector or antique vehicles or very
specialized applications such as racing or hazard duty where the
flammability in accident might conceivably be an added risk.
Otherwise, just nothing that it does is sufficient to make any
discernible difference in the bottom line to the end user.
I won't mention politics but SMS's view that he is fully capable of
maintaining the pressure in his tires by checking it with a tire gauge but
the general populace is not and should be provided with a free benefit to
save themselves from themselves has a familiar ring to it.
As a matter of fact, yes. The car, pickup, and the bikes all have accurate,
well used pressure gauges. Your argument is similar to those who want to
pass a national helmet law. "It's not the idiot, it's the social cost after
he becomes a vegetable." I've got three fullface helmets on the shelf next
to me; sometimes I wear one, sometimes not, but I don't need a nanny to tell
me to button my jacket. I even have a bicycle helmet that I wore exactly
once; it was a requirement to ride the Trail of the Hiawatha.
Back to the original argument, there are 16 tires out in the driveway, not
counting the 4 bicycle tires. None are filled with nitrogen and all are
doing just fine.
No kids. The last time I drove a rental car I drove for any appreciable
distance was over 10 years ago. I did a walkaround before I left the
National lot. No, I didn't use a tire gauge but my right boot is finely
That's not how the helmet crowd tells it. Long term incapacitating injuries
are a social cost imposed on us all. I imagine they would like to outlaw
bikes altogether in the interests of womb to tomb comfort and safety.
Seatbelts were the same wheeze. I woll admit I used seatbelts before they
were mandatory. Driving from the passenger side after you've slid across a
vinyl bench seat is tricky.
I rented a 2004 Malibu for a long trip and did a walkaround.
Had 5000 miles on it. Tires looked okay.
I was about 60 miles from home before I got it to 70 mph.
It was all over the road, and I really thought the alignment was
screwed up, and I was going to have to take it back.
No way I could drive it for 1200 miles. As a last resort I bought a
tire gage. The right front had 14 psi. Low profile tires.
TPMS would have alerted to that.
I started wearing them when they became available because of that.
Once I wore them, I never went back.
There is NO "free benefit"! The customer pays for EVERYTHING. A business
must make a profit to survive. I don't know Costco's business model on tires
but it may a selling point that costs then very little in the volume they
do. Ask Claire, he will tell you they had a price structure they followed
and the only thing that wasn't figured in was rework. But that was included
in the labor charges and/or tech agreements.
On 11/18/2014 2:28 PM, Tekkie® wrote:
<snip> > There is NO "free benefit"! The customer pays for EVERYTHING. A business
Costco, or any store, determines prices based on what generates the
maximum revenue, not on what it actually costs them to provide a product
The mistake that many people make is to assume that the cost of the
included nitrogen is a line item in their price calculation of what to
charge for tires. Retail doesn't work that way, for better or worse.
They also include valve stems on non-TPMS tires instead of charging
extra for it as many tire stores do--$2 for a 10¢ item. Costco is not
going to lower the price of a tire by 10¢ if a customer declines the
Costco's tiny cost for nitrogen is almost certainly offset by savings in
labor and warranty costs so if anything they should charge extra to
customers that don't want nitrogen.
Nitrogen atoms are larger than the oxygen molecules and are therfore less
prone to losing pressure through the tyre. Since air is around 80% nitrogen
and 20% oxygen i think it's more a marketing gimmick.
I've never had a problem with using air in 40 years.
FOR THE RECORD
I amnot against nitrogen. Nitorgen is good. It's not worth paying for. If
the store wants to give it away, then buy your tires there. But if the tire
store wants an other ten bucks or more, then pass.
Nitrogen is going to seep out and you will go to the gas station and use the
machine to refill your tires, and this will dilute the nitrogen. After you
put air into the tires a few times, you will have the same concentration of
nitrogen that already exists in free air.
ALL I AM SAYING IS, DO NOT PAY FOR NITROGEN, and give peace a chance...
I have a 2007 and 2008 and the TPMS have failed on both of them. I have no
intention of getting them replaced. I think I was quoted a proce of about $
60 to $ 80 for each wheel. That is getting close to the price of a tire.
The 2007 has about 55,000 miles on it and the 2008 has about 25, 000 on it.
I hae replaced the factory tires on both of them with some 80,000 mile
tires. I should trade by the time I need tires again.
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Over the years I've had at least four vehicles can remember had TPMS
systems and have yet to have the first failure. The last Le Sabre was
over 10 yo and 180k miles when it went. I don't recall the previous
one's age (it was folk's when we came back so didn't have quite the
direct connection for total recall). The so-equipped two vehicles
presently are '10 and '11 so they're still almost brand new by my
Is that your car? I don't have TPMS on my car, but I keep a tire
gauge in my glovebox, and occasionally check all tires.
If leakage is excessive I get it fixed. That seldom happens.
If I had TPMS and it worked, I would do the same, less the check.
I haven't had trouble with tire wear.
Oil change is the only one on my car. What others are available?
I don't understand this sudden interest in nitrogen.
Tire Rack says:
"Overall, inflating tires with nitrogen won't hurt them and may
provide some minimal benefits."
"Rather than pay extra for nitrogen, most drivers would be better off
buying an accurate tire pressure gauge and checking and adjusting
their tire pressures regularly."
Doubt I'll ever put nitrogen in my tires.
None of the "minimal benefits" even apply to me, or most drivers.
But if it's free I won't turn it down.
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