Hyundai preformance on icy raods

Lowering them to specs would certainly put more tread on the road so it should help. There's an easy way to find out : )

Now, if you've lived in Minnesota for any appreciable time, you know darn well that driving on glare ice is almost impossible unless you have studs installed in your tires. Alas, they were eventually banned in Michigan due to the damage the caused to concrete roads.

I chose a more radical solution after living in Michigan for decades. Moved to Arizona! ; )

The electronic throttle probably makes it difficult to have the degree of throttle control you desire. You do, on the other hand have the shiftronic feature, so you could try starting out in second gear to see if that improves anything.

I'm also not sure you'd be increasing contact area by removing some air from the tires. Even at 35 PSI, the XG's front tires seem to bulge significantly at the sidewall.

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Especially if you are from Minnesota, you should keep in mind the effect that the bitter cold has on regular all-season tires, even beyond being potentially poor in either snow or ice. You just will not get the grip on even a good all-season tire that you would in Summer.

I HIGHLY recommend that Minnesotans use a set of dedicated Winter tires on their vehicles. You will be stunned how much of a difference it makes on your XG350.

I agree if you are talking about grip on pavement, although most winter tires aren't that good on pavement either. On snow or ice, the colder the better for almost all tires. The traction when temps are below zero is FAR better than when between 20 and warmer. The main culprit in poor traction on ice and packed snow is a very thin layer of water formed between the tire and the snow or ice due to the pressure. This layer is difficult to form when it gets cold enough and thus the traction improves dramatically.

Yes, not doubt that purpose-built tires are better in the conditions for which they are designed, but they are also much worse in almost all conditions other than for which they were designed. If you have snow on the road the majority of the time, then I would get snow tires. Where I live, we have snow on the roads for only a small part of the time and thus snow tires are a bad deal overall. Our road crews are very good and typically have the salt out and the roads clear within hours of a snowfall. The roads are then wet and soon dry and in both of these conditions, the all-season radials outperform the dedicated winter tires.

Matt

OTOH, I run dedicated snow tires every winter and have for decades. Just for fun, when I bought my Elantra, I decided to try the stock tires in the winter. One snowstorm was all it took to convince me of the error of that thinking. I live in NH, where the road crews are very adept at getting the highways and main roads cleared quickly, but that's not always the case on secondary and rural roads. Moreover, wet roads often get slushy then freeze at night, creating treacherous conditions. My experience has been that having dedicated winter tires (Nokian Hakka IIs, in my case) is a night and day difference in performance in difficult conditions. I don't find them to be a problem on dry roads at all (I don't drive aggressively enough for it to matter) and they work fine in winter rains, too. They do handle some differently than my summer tires, but I've done this for long enough that I make the adjustment in a few miles.

I have no choice but to drive in some pretty horrendous conditions, so the choice of whether to go with dedicated winter tires is a no-brainer for me. I have to admit to taking a certain perverse pleasure in comfortably cruising by white-knuckled SUV drivers that are sliding all over - or off - the road on their "all season" tires, which really should be called "no season", since they pretty well suck at everything. It never ceases to amaze me that people will spend several thousand extra dollars on almost useless FWD when they could get better performance with a front-drive vehicle and a few hundred dollars spent on good winter rubber.

I think we've had this conversation before, but I've had a much different experience. I live in extreme northern PA (just a mile or two south of the NY border) and our winters are pretty nasty here also. Maybe not as bad as NH, but that probably depends on where in NH you live.

I've had no problems with All-season tires. The only tires I've had trouble with are the stock tires that came on my Sonata, but they were Michelin "performance" tires rather than all-season tires. My driveway alone is more treacherous that most roads and I plow it myself, but do not apply any salt, cinders or sand. I can send you a picture if you want to see it! :-)

I haven't run a snow tire on a car since the 1970s and get through winters just fine. I don run M&S tires on my Chevy pickup as that is my plow vehicle and I don't want to have to mess with putting on chains. I do have a full set of chains, but have only needed them once and that was with the original Goodyear AT tires that didn't have a very aggressive tread. However, these tires are very loud on the road and wear pretty quickly, but for a truck that sees only 5K miles a year and most of them are plowing snow or hauling firewood, rapid wear isn't a big deal.

I've found that performance in the snow is more a function of driver technique than tire style. I routinely drive 55-60 on snow covered

4-lane roads and pass SUVs all of the time. The all-season tires on my Sonata and minivan work just fine in anything less than a foot of snow. If I have to deal with a foot or more, I take the truck. :-)

Matt

Yes, we've discussed this before and I'm sure our respective winters are comparable enough.

We're talking about car tires here, not truck tires. You really cannot compare the two. Winter car tires do not have the disadvantages of truck tires, either in noise or wear. There is usually a very slight increase in noise and I get at least three winters out of a set of tires, driving them ~5 months per year. I find that acceptable given their benefits.

Perhaps it's time you tried a set of dedicated winter tires on your cars. Your dismissive statements are typical of people who've never tried winter tires (or in your case, haven't done so in 30+ years). The fact is that you can't appreciate the difference until you experience it. I've done the comparison on my Elantra and six other cars I've owned, including several instances where I've literally driven in the same storm with both types of tires (typically the first storm of the season). The difference in traction is DRAMATIC compared to all season or performance tires. Everyone I've convinced to try winter tires have said the same thing. I also drive a lot of rental cars these days and I've seen firsthand exactly how bad many all season tires are in winter conditions. While I agree that technique and skill are important, neither can create traction where it doesn't exist. That's the main benefit of winter tires, they grip were other tires don't.

This discussion reminds me of "Green Eggs and Ham". ;-)

If I were having problems with all-season tires, then I would try snow tires. However, I can drive 55 on snow covered roads with confidence and stability and I can make it up my 1700' uphill driveway without the need to do anything other than plow it, so there is no need to spend extra money on tires and changing them two extra times a year.

I'm not against snow tires at all, I just don't need them ... like 98% of the rest of the folks in the USA. There are 2% who need them and they should buy and use them.

Yes, I agree!

Matt

Yup - we seem to cover this patch of ground at least once per winter. I'm fine with the idea that Brian and I disagree on the value of snow's. He likes them and feels they add something, and I haven't used a pair in decades. I live in Central NY, in the snow belt east of Lake Ontario. We get between 200-300 inches of snow per year, so we're in the category of severe winter weather locations.

I too have found some all-season to be pure garbage, but my experience is that those are more the touring tires. Bad tread patterns. Really poor sipe designs. That said, there are many other all season tires out there that have very good tread design and that provide absolutely positive winter driving control.

Again, our experiences are similar Matt. As you may recall, my plow truck is a 94 Silverado. I have a set of Dunlop M&S on it and they are on it year round. Never put a chain on my tires ever.

I can't count the number of times I've had to plow my way through unplowed roads (the one I live on), or up my driveway (300 ft+) with plow wash piled up at the mouth of the driveway, and had snow pushing up over my hood as I went. No exaggeration. Likewise, I cannot recall the last time I had to be pulled out of anything, dug out of anything or pushed out of anything, in my car. A good set of all season tires will chew through anything you put under them, and as you say, the highway stuff is a reflection of both a good tread design in an all season tire, and driving technique.

Considering how much of the country lies in the "snow belt", that's a pretty ridiculous statement.

Possibly, but consider how many people who live in the snow belt get along just fine without snow tires. I lived over 60 years in snowy mid-Michigan and never had a need for snow tires. And when front-wheel-drive became common there was even less need for the hassle of changing in and out of snow tires.

No, most of the people in the snow belt are like me and simply don't need snow tires. I did a quick search and was not able to find any detailed figures on USA tire sales by type, but I'll bet my 2% figure isn't far off as the fraction of total tire sales annually that are winter tires.

Matt

Maybe not. Back in the 50's, I remember putting full chains on my father's car for the first couple of days after a snow. Main roads were poorly plowed, side streets were not plowed at all. We lived in Philadelphia and a

6" snow was a lot.

I've since moved to Connecticut and 10" to 12" is common. I've never thought about snow tires. Why? They plow frequently, they plow well, they treat the streets. In the worst storms here, if I can get out of my driveway, I can get most anyplace. Like anyplace else, you have to use common sense and slow down in snow. If there is slick ice, no car is going to fare well, no matter what tire is on it.

Well, studded tires help a lot on ice. :-) Although, I haven't felt the need for studs since the 70s.

Matt

I too haven't run snows in a while, but be real, all seasons really aren't good in snow-we've all just like the ease of them. But, I think the best way is to have four snows on four steel wheels for the few winter months. Hey we rotate tires anyway, whats the big deal in putting on the snows. Snows on snow free winter roads doesn't really bother when operating at sane speeds doing sane manuevers. I know I have to get snow for the wifes volvo; No 245 40 17's behave at all in snow. A narrower 16" snow on steel wheels next year for that vehicle for sure.

Studded tires have been banned in some states due to the damage they do to roads. I know Michigan banned them. In any case I never got them and never really needed them there.

Depends where you live. In mid-Michigan (Lansing area), keeping an extra set of tires just for snow couldn't be justified by most drivers. And accordingly, it's not a very common practice. Maybe in upper Michigan where they get clobbered by lake-effect snow but not the rest of the state.

"> Depends where you live. In mid-Michigan (Lansing area), keeping an extra set

I know what your saying, but it brings to mind something my mother used to say about cars..."It doesn't cost anymore to keep the tank full as it does empty" Once you've bought the snows and cheap steel wheels, it doesn't cost any more to employ them. Miles put on snows are miles not put on regular tires....BTW how many of us use summer tires as opposed to all season radials, and is anyone troiubled by that performance compromise (wet weather, braking and handling). There, I'm done beating the dead horse.....I guess the group does largely agree on one thing- The OP faulting Hyundai is mostly without merit.(I think the touchy throttle observation was a good one though)

Jus in case the horse is not dead.- - - - -

The Sonata 5 speed auto can be manually shifted into 2nd gear for starts on slippery roads.