new jeep - mastershield undercoat

Personally I would never have a dealer spray any sort of "rust proofing" to any vehicle new or used. First off its a rip off as they over charge for the stuff, the fine print usually only requires the dealer to "touch-up" the rust proofing in future resprays among other things. If you want to get you car rust proofed here is by far one of the best aftermarket sprays out there. (and the have a new car rust through warranty)

Snow...

The biggest problem with most undercoating is that you can't SEE what is happening underneath it. If the slightest amount of salt/moisture manages to find its way under the coating, a lot of corrosion can occur before you know it, because it can't evaporate like a normal splash. Additionally, the heavy coatings must be applied perfectly to keep drains, weep holes, and channels from closing, which will guarantee rust in a big way. These guys are going to slop it on as quick as they can - time is money.

It was probably helpful 20-30 years ago when an untreated car had a life expectancy of 3-5 years before it was rusted out. It may heve added a year or two to the car by keeping some of the rust at bay. But cars are much better corrosion-proofed during the manufacturing process than they were even 10 years ago - even Jeeps. I think nowdays the best route with a new car is to inspect it thoroughly for any rust at every oil change. Every spot you see, either have the dealer fix it or fix it yourself with a rust neutralizer like POR and paint. You would be surprised at how clean and rust free you can keep a new car if you try.

I have to disagree with this very strongly... Newer vehicles are more prone to rust then anything built 20-30 years ago.. Today the sheet metal is thinner and weaker seams are not made the same they are just welded, where as on older vehicle the seam edges were rolled and stamped before being welded. Not to mention, if you go to the dealer to have every rust spot touched up you will be paying a fortune, the best bet is to use a liquid rust proofing like rust check

).

Snow...

prone to rust then anything built 20-30 years ago.. <

Utter nonsense. Modern vehicles recieve extensive and effective rustproofing, from zinc primer dips to wax injection to moisture deflector panels. 30 years ago they virtually recieved none. Unless they've been damaged and improperly repaired, modern cars simply don't rot out like the old ones did. It's just one reason why YJs & TJs will last so much longer than Bill's beloved "Real Jeeps".

On 24 Nov 2003 06:19 AM, Snow posted the following:

Yeah, right. That's why the only remaining original sheetmetal on my '73 Chevy pickup is the hood....

The new stuff is made of thinner material but from what I can tell, it is actually treated for corrosion resistance, unlike the older rigs, and the manufacturers at least make an effort these days to design adequate drainage into their vehicles. Anything will rust if the protective coatings are breached so it is imperative that broken paint be touched up somehow if you want to prevent rust in any vehicle.

---------------------------------------------------- Del Rawlins- del@_kills_spammers_rawlinsbrothers.org Remove _kills_spammers_ to reply via email. Unofficial Bearhawk FAQ website:

Hey Snow! Yes, the steel is thinner today, but it's made of High Strength Steel which is much stronger and lighter than the older sheet metal. The automotive steel is treated for corrosion/rust MUCH better than in the past. Zinc baths and primers make a huge difference.

Snow wrote: > I have to disagree with this very strongly... Newer vehicles are more prone

That rolling/lipping/stamping creates a nice pocket for moisture and more importantly tiny bits of organic matter (like dirt from muddy water) to get trapped in, which then does a superb job of keeping water in contact with (in the case of old cars) un primed, untreated sheet metal.

Those rolled metal edges are usually among the first area's that need to be cut out. Classic cars often have there worst rust in the lower doors (rolled seams), the floor pans (un treated/unprimed underside, often with a bad undercoating job which accelerates the rot by trapping moisture against bare metal) the rocker panels which have lots of moisture trapping spots usually a lip under the car or a spot welded seam where the floor pans meet it. The lower fenders (usually a lip).

More modern cars seal the rolled seams of the doors and the sheet inside the door is usually primed, then there's splash guards in the wheel wells to keep water/crud off the lip of fenders.

submerged the complete bodies in primer? <

RAMBLER??? I thought we were talking about "modern cars"?

Some other guy complained that his '73 Chevy pickup rotted: "HELLO, 1973 was thrty years ago, HELLO!!!!"

Steel which is much stronger and lighter than the older sheet metal. The automotive steel is treated for corrosion/rust MUCH better than in the past. Zinc baths and primers make a huge difference.>

Right you are. The galvanized primers and wax injection prevent any small bits of corrosion from spreading. That's why you don't see newer cars with rotted wheel wells, rocker panels, etc.

1973 Chevy pickups, Ramblers, etc. aren't considered "newer"!

Um Bill? The Chevy pickups had the gas tanks outside the frame rails until

1987. 1988 was the year they changed this with the new body style that ran until 1998. Having owned a 1976, 1978, and 1981 model, I can assure you this was the case. Chris

On 24 Nov 2003 10:41 AM, L.W.(?ill) Hughes III posted the following:

Wrongamundo. They had the side tank conflagration configuration until

1. My '78 (the cab from which now sits on my '73) also had the side tanks. I'm planning to build another tank which will sit under the bed in the space formerly occupied by the spare tire, but that will be in addition to, not in replacement of the standard tanks. At 10 mpg, I need all the fuel capacity I can get.

---------------------------------------------------- Del Rawlins- del@_kills_spammers_rawlinsbrothers.org Remove _kills_spammers_ to reply via email. Unofficial Bearhawk FAQ website:

On 24 Nov 2003 09:40 AM, Jerry McG posted the following:

That was my whole point. The old stuff would rust no matter what you did sometimes. Ask me about british steel sometime....

---------------------------------------------------- Del Rawlins- del@_kills_spammers_rawlinsbrothers.org Remove _kills_spammers_ to reply via email. Unofficial Bearhawk FAQ website:

On 24 Nov 2003 09:37 AM, Jerry McG posted the following:

Hey, dumbass. Go back and re-read my post. I was disagreeing with the view that the older stuff had better rust resistance.

---------------------------------------------------- Del Rawlins- del@_kills_spammers_rawlinsbrothers.org Remove _kills_spammers_ to reply via email. Unofficial Bearhawk FAQ website:

My appologies, I missed your point.

< Ask me about british steel sometime.... <

HAH! I worked for a UK "automaker" ...if that's what you called it at the time. Rumor had it if you stood necxt to one quietly you could hear the rust mice chewing!