What does the Mechanic get

Well the Air Force set me down at Williams AFB in '71. Sent me to SEA and then relocated me in Glendale at Luke AFB. I remainded in the Phoenix area until mid '81 when I moved to SoCal to be closer to my wife's parents(oh boy!) Then did 2 years back in Flagstaff in '84-'86, then back to SoCal. Finally gave up on SoCal in '92 and moved to the Ozarks in search of a better place to raise the last of my brood of boys. Got that done, and now we are almost-empty nesters way out in the woods 20 miles from town and almost a mile off the highway down a dirt "road"(thus the Jeeps). Couldn't be happier.

-- Old Crow '82 Shovelhead FLT 92" 'Pearl' '95 Jeep YJ Rio Grande ASE Certified Master Auto Tech + L1 TOMKAT, BS#133, SENS, MAMBM, DOF#51

Thanks for your service.

Perhaps you could speak to something about dealer repair shops currently on my mind: Prices at the parts counter. Really, I don't mind paying the flat rate for labor and I have some idea where that $75/hr goes (overhead, profit, other departments, and on and on, with a bit left over for the guy bending the wrench), but charging 100% more than the local parts jobber does for parts, well, that part is hard to eat. Even if they _are_ Gen-U-Ine authorized parts. (Recently, it wasn't. D-C no longer makes radiators for 89 Cherokees, but they soaked me for it just as if it was.)

I mean, if can't cost _that_ much to keep a part with a logo on the box (add 20% for that) on a shelf, can it?

Fact is, OEM parts do cost more. That is just a fact of life. Typically there is about 35% markup on parts, which sounds ridiculous on the surface, I suppose, but it isn't like the parts department is the profit center of a dealership. Most dealership parts departments not only employ counter people, but they have to employ people in shipping and receiving (because they ship AND receive parts), warehouse personnel (somebody has to put the parts back ON the shelf), and delivery personnel (most dealerships will deliver parts out to their wholesale customers).

It has been my experience that a 35% markup is pretty lenient in most retail outlets of any kind. I think 50% or more is realistic.

Jerry

I bought a clutch, (made by Sachs) for my Alfa. It cost 60% of the

*exactly* the same Alfa clutch (made by Sachs). The place I bought it from had counter staff and warehouse personnel. Face it - perhaps the dealers don't make any/much money on parts, but DC or Alfa do.

the saying "Car makers don't make cars - they assemble them by and large" has a large element of truth in it.

Dave

Having worked for a company that made power steering, fuel and brake lines for certain vehicle manufacturers, I can say that there is a God awful amount of markup on certain parts. The power steering hoses we used to sell to Diamond star were sold to them for approximately $11 each. Upon calling the local Dodge dealer and getting the price from them, I was stunned to find out that the same power steering hose sold for approximately $130. This was for a Dodge Ram 50 pickup truck. Someone is getting rich off the parts. There was also a GM fuel fitting that we made and sold for less than $.25 to GM, and upon calling the local dealer and getting a price from them, the part was just over $6. This was a part that they purchased over 2 million a year from my employer.

Chris

c did pass the time by typing:

Yep. It would be sad if it wasn't so pathetic. :/

Knew someone that did the books at a local dealership. According to him the average profit margin on parts was 300% although some were less and others were over 1000%. Like your .25 part going for 6$ for a markup of 2400%

What makes ya wonder is why a local dealer can't sell the same exact part for less than say buymopar even if you include shipping.

The answer is probably "price fixing." Dealerships appear to have some sort of agreement on priceing in the market area.

..ok.. I'll put my tinfoil hat back on now... :)

FWIW, I always suggest folks use a local hydraulic hose maker instead of the dealership. You can get much better for much less and they can also rebuild your old hose.

On 19 Jan 2004 09:00 AM, c posted the following:

It makes more sense when you consider each pair of hands that the parts pass through, and the fact that each of them is feeding one or more mouths. Add on top of that the time that each part has to sit on a series of shelves for some period of time before reaching the end user, and that those parts represent capital that is tied up for that period of time. If your money is invested in a bank or a fund you will rightly expect a return for that. Why should it be any different for money invested in parts, sitting on a shelf?

---------------------------------------------------- Del Rawlins- del@_kills_spammers_rawlinsbrothers.org Remove _kills_spammers_ to reply via email. Unofficial Bearhawk FAQ website:

Or in some rapaciously taxatious states, you pay a tax for every item that is setting on your shelf. So the folks that prefer to avoid customer delays pay extra for actually having the parts in the building rather than in an out of state warehouse. No coincidence that most of the big electronics jobbers in California have most all of their inventory just across the border in Nevada.

OK, I can understand the $.25 part selling for $6, to a point since it goes through the same number of hands as the $11 part. Even if you consider shipping, tax, and any other hidden costs, there is still a hell of a markup on these parts. I realize everyone has to make money. But in the case of the power steering hose, I do know that we shipped directly to the Diamond Star distribution center. From there the parts went either to the assembly line or to the dealer. Doing the math with shipping cost of a part that weighs 1 pound, and figuring 20% carrying cost for inventory, there is still an obnoxious amount of markup on these parts. Considering that we used to ship about 15,000 of these hoses per month, they weren't sitting on the shelves very long. Diamond Star was (and maybe still is) using the "just in time" inventory control method, which does keep inventories at a lower level. Obviously there are still carrying and handling costs, but when the car makers whine about not selling enough cars, I tend to not feel too sorry for them.

Chris

I will add that mic canic probably has the experience AND tools to do that 3 hour job in 1/3 of the time. I am sure that he has earned it! Tricks you learn aid in allowing you to pinpoint the problem and repair it quickly. I am sure that sometimes the wheel bearing problem is complicated by rusty parts being stuck together which may add to more labor time and possibly more parts.

I have found that some mechanics/technicians get around 50% of the labor. Dealers may pay their mechanics less than 50% but remember that some dealers charge $130 per hour (here in chicago) and usually pay benefits. Private shops may pay their mechanics more than 50% but may not offer benefits and their labor rate is usually less than the dealers. Good techs can usually get the job done quicker and cheaper and can be found at the dealers or at private shops. Everyone is usually happy when the job is done right the first time. The good ones can be worth their weight in gold and should be paid accordingly! lol

When I managed a shop back in the late 1970s with about 8 mechanics we charged $40 per hour and the mechanics got $20 per hour. The hours were based on a Flat Rate Labor manual. The mechanics got no benefits, but were allowed to work on their vehicles after all the customers' vehicles were finished. later, dave

When he isn't screwing his customers by getting the dealer to void their warranty.

---------------------------------------------------- Del Rawlins- del@_kills_spammers_rawlinsbrothers.org Remove _kills_spammers_ to reply via email. Unofficial Bearhawk FAQ website:

Or telling them that recalls aren't valid because their Jeep is too old...

Mike

86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's

Experience--that is that little factor that is acquired by expending a lot of time, effort and lost income.

You are, in all cases, paying for what the "mic canic" knows as well as for what the "mic canic" does. Those tools you talk about. The "mic canic" has to purchase them also. A fair, size and quality, top and bottom box, the minimum needed to work in the field today, runs in the range of $2,500. The technician is not screwing the customer-and the dealer can not void a factory warranty. Warranties are usually restricted by the actions of the owner/operator by their conscious non-performance of maintenance or performing un-authorized modifications to the vehicle in direct conflict with the agreed to warranty contract between the Owner and the Manufacturer.

The Sweeney's did pass the time by typing:

And that is a cheap set of tools.

Most of the wrench turners I know have sets that top $10,000. One has a Snap-on set that he estimates at over 30K.

Got no idea how much my set is. It's a mix of Snap-on/S&K/Calhawk/Craftsman/ and some odd china born odds-n-ends for when folks want to borrow a tool. What I need is a good home for them. They are all tucked away in toolbags and drawers.

In case you missed it, in another thread "mic canic" was bragging (yes, bragging) about how he called in a D-C (not the dealer, sorry, my bad) representative and between the two of them conspired to have the warranty on a customer's lifted vehicle restricted to emissions only. This, despite the fact that the federal law regulating vehicle warranties specifies that before denying warranty coverage for a vehicle fault, the manufacturer must show that the fault was caused by the modifications. And even if the manufacturer meets this burden of proof, the warranty restrictions must be confined to the systems which were modified. So in this case, while restricting the warranty on the suspension, and *maybe* the drivetrain was justified, restricting the entire warranty to emissions only is clearly excessive in addition to being illegal. I fail to see how installing a lift should void the coverage on the electrical system, paint finish, trim, interior, or any other unrelated components. Unfortunately, the cost of fighting this in court will most likely exceed the cost of any non-covered repairs to the vehicle for the remainder of the warranty period, so the owner is just plain SOL on account of "mic canic".

As for the warranty contract between the manufacturer and the vehicle owner, it is regulated by and must be in compliance with the federal warranty law. Also, there is no such thing as a modification which must be authorized by the manufacturer.

Furthermore, voiding warranties is a bad policy strictly as a matter of customer service. As a result of this episode, the dealer at which "mic canic" works has been identified here and will presumably be avoided by newsgroup regulars who live in that area, and deservedly so for having allowed it to take place.

In contrast, the first time I took my Jeep to the dealer which now gets all of my service and parts business, both the service manager and the technician who did the work complimented me on my modified vehicle. The work was covered under warranty with no questions asked.

---------------------------------------------------- Del Rawlins- del@_kills_spammers_rawlinsbrothers.org Remove _kills_spammers_ to reply via email. Unofficial Bearhawk FAQ website:

Well his 'experience' turned the last place he worked at into a bankrupt shop.

His 'experience' at ripping off customers and trying to get them into shit with the manufacturer as well as ripping them off by telling them they have to pay for recall work makes all mechanics look bad.

'He' and people like him are one of the main reasons most folks run fast and far from dealers as soon as the warranty has expired or go to other dealers because his shop gets known as the rip off place.

And then the asshole has the balls to brag about being a sleaze bag mechanic here on this newsgroup!

Mike

The Sweeney's wrote:

I hope you don't paint all technicians with the same paintbrush you use on mic.

Some of us are mature, hard working and dedicated individuals who truly enjoy what we do for a living.

I have in the vicinity of $28k invested in my tools which I've built up over 20 years in the business.

I spend at least one or two evenings a month doing training on my own time as well as time spent at the dealership doing distance learning courses. I used to spend at least a day a month in Memphis doing training before GM shut down the training center.

I don't need to rip you off or sell you something you don't need on your vehicle to make my living. However, if I've got it raised in the air for an oil change and I notice that your brakes are getting thin or your tranny is leaking, then I'll let you know, hopefully to our mutual benefit(it won't break on you out in the woods, and I'll get paid to fix it).

However, my take on mic chanic is about the same as yours, and I wouldn't take my lawn mower to him, much less my Jeep.

-- Old Crow '82 Shovelhead FLT 92" 'Pearl' '95 Jeep YJ Rio Grande ASE Certified Master Auto Tech + L1 TOMKAT, BS#133, SENS, MAMBM, DOF#51