Thaughts about car reliability.

I guess you're right, that given proper maintenance, breakdowns will be few and far between. One of the reasons a newer car is popular, is that you can negect it to some degree and get away with it, whereas as a car get older, a proper maintenance regime becomes more necessary. I have only ever owned one new car, hardly ever had a car serviced, but have only broken down twice in 45 years of motoring, but you have to be disciplined and not let services slip.

Andy

Talking from my own experience I purchased a 1987 1.6 petrol Astra estate in

1989 with 50,000 miles on the clock, it was an ex fleet hire vehicle.

Got rid of it in 2002 with almost 200,000 miles on the clock, the biggest mechanical failures I had during its life was a couple of snapped clutch cables and a module in the distributor (fixed for 30 pounds) which caused it to unpredictably cut out.

Ten months ago I purchased a 52 plate Ford focus 1.8 TDCI with 120,000 miles on the clock, an ex company vehicle, which I reasoned that to do such a high mileage in such a short space of time would a probably have meant that it was used mainly on motorways in fifth gear, also because it was in such good condition I also reasoned that it was probably well looked after by a single driver.

Shortly after I bought it I had a full service check done at a main Ford dealership, they told me that everything mechanically was in tip top condition and it was obvious that any servicing or replacements that were required had all been previously carried out, touch wood so far it's performed very well and if it reaches 200,000 miles without any real problems then I'll be well pleased.

I wouldn't make such assumptions if I were you.

I'm doing somewhere in the region of 40k miles / year - but my area is South Wales, so there aren't a lot of motorways around.

Most of the week, my car is being caned to the redline in 2nd, 3rd and

4th.

I sort of look after it - as in giving it a quick wash and hoover every week, but I certainly wouldn't buy it when the lease is up.

I agree with you 100% Steve, but that applies when you buy any secondhand vehicle, you just have to try and make a reasoned assessment and hope for the best.

I've also driven enough company vehicles in my life to realise that some are just hammered into the ground by various drivers, whilst others have been meticulously looked after by a single driver, especially if he knows that when the time comes to change the fleet he gets the first opportunity to purchase the vehicle at well below its market value.

I`ve seen new cars that I`d put money on will have an expensive breakdown a lot sooner than my 52 plate, 130k miles Passat. The little metro in a supermarket carpark being red-lined and the clutch brought up a touch to just edge it forward by the mad old woman who doesn`t have a clue how to drive for example :-) I bought it from a guy who runs a VW garage, took a while to convince him to sell it to me, but he gave it a bloody good looking at before he bought it, and touch wood it`s been as good as gold for the last 25k miles since he bought it, and 8 since I got it :-)

I've been thinking about this recently as well. After years of cheap motoring on sub £500 cars that I didn't maintain, I purchased a couple of 2000 reg Punto's with 40k on the clock a couple of years back.

It seems that 40K miles or 5 years old is a good time for initial parts to show ware and tare. OK this is a bit of a general statement, I appreciate it's down to the type and quality of the car and how it has been driven. But my guess is there are least cost efficient periods in which to purchase a car. The first of which is when most of the consumable components require replacing (e.g. brakes, clutch, timing belt, shocks, oil seals). So the car still cost quite a bit but there's hundreds of pounds or repair costs around the corner.

I beginning to think you either purchase nearly new and keep until just before the first batch of expensive consumables go. Or you go for a much older car with 70-100k on the clock, offset the saving on the price on the parts that will go soon.

With regards to maintenance. I've been performing oil changes every

6-10k, regular service and repair issues as soon as they appear. But the cars are still a check list of known Punto issue. The good thing about buying an older car is you can read the Parkers guide and there will be consumer experience regarding the reliability of the cars. Parkers now say that service history is critical for Punto's but does not guarantee reliability. Another example might be the Saab 9-5, which seems to need a more regular oil change than the service book recommends. At least with the older car you can check online to see if they are reliable runners with age.

Regards,

Tim

40K miles IME is nothing more than brake pads- more like 6-7 years and 70-80K miles seems to be when a few things start needing attention.

Very much so.

Yep. 6-8 years old, 80K IME.

That's what I've done for the last few cars.

That's what i used to do a few years ago.

You've seen a new Metro?

Out of interest, what faults develop that leads them to this conclusion? The first thing to suffer from inadequate oil changes is usually the camshaft(s)/ valve gear.

I believe that's what packs in on the Saab under those conditions: The cam chain on certain engines.

To be fair, 'those in the know' would consider that particularly the Punto's, Stilo, Bravo's etc are sound nearly new buys, but you must get shot of them at around 4 yrs old, as thats when they are guarenteed to go wrong.

I usually buy at around 15-18months old with 10-20k on the clock, and keep them til 6 years old or just before 70k. I've never had to replace an exhaust or battery, or anything more expensive, but I am very particular what I buy (both make/model / previous owner and condition) and a spec that will be easy to sell on at the time.

Tim..

The GM-ified 9-3 / 9-5's engines are very very very prone to clogged sump strainers, knackered bearings, and seizing- thats if it doesnt break the cam chain and lunch itself first. Saab suggest 12k oil change intervals (semi synth), its been proven that this is just about okay if you do 30k+ a year on the motorway, but definately not for Joe Average.

The 3cyl GM and 3Cyl VAG units are proving to be delicate in the same way too. A Cam chain replacement is pretty much par for the course inside 80k miles.

Tim..

I'd agree, but this is when I purchased mine. On both cars I've had to replace brakes front and rear (understandable), shocks front and rear, clutch, thermostat. On one of the cars shortly after the clutch the bloody crank rear seal (so clutch replacement labour charge again), drive shaft/transmission seal, sump (actually turned out not to be necessary).

One of the cars no longer idles properly, just in a tolerant range and the other is now burning oil. Both are well looked after.

If I'd bought nearly new I would have flogged these cars at this stage. If I'd bought them with 70K and 6-7 years old, I would no doubt have inherited these problems, but the cars would have cost £2k less.

On the other hand, a Yaris may go on forever. At least with age you can read from other peoples experience, but 3-5 years old you just don't get the full picture.

So nearly new or when they're cheap but require maintenance. Not in between.

Regards,

Tim

Well some of the major U.S. and European vehicle manufacturers have been going on about it for long enough, but this appears to be the nearest that they've actually managed so far.

< >. Although I believe that Ford and GM have been looking at the possibility of locating manufacturing plants in China, in which case if all that one is after is a bog standard medium sized family vehicle to provide short term hassle free motoring, it may eventually be possible for even the most cash strapped motorist to buy a brand new motor every four or five years if they can get the price down low enough.

The first thing to do is pick a car model with good long term reliability. Second is to give it more often than recommended oil changes. Third is don't rely on servicing to stop you having breakdowns or troubles as service items are hardly ever the cause of them, like whoever had a battery changed at a service.

I get anything that's even slightly iffy that could cause a breakdown done straight away, e.g. an exhaust that has a pinhole leak around a pipe weld as I just know the pipe will break in a few weeks when I'm 100 miles from home.

Exactly, many breakdown items are spottable to the trained ear or eye before they cause a stoppage, but you have to be mechanically minded to notice.

I agree totally with the first paragraph too.

Tim..

You know what I mean :-) Little cars being driven by old women who have no idea :-)

A lot of Saabs have turbos and I think turbos are quite fussy about having nice clean fully synthetic oil.

The earlier Saab B series Turbo's never had problems, and oil quality was alot less 10-15years ago.

Tim..