Vectra brakes

( snipped-for-privacy@ezauza.com) gurgled happily, sounding much like they were saying :

ITYF that cars don't tend to roll away if the handbrake ceases to be effective if parked on the flat.

So that really only leaves parking on hills.

The parking/hand brake should be able to hold the vehicle on a gentle slope. Some of us have also used the gears as an EXTRA safety precaution at all times. IF we are now saying to park safely we must us handbrake and gears we have effectively removed one level of safety. I do not think for one moment we can tell an MOT inspector the hand brake is unreliable without the gears (and get a pass)but no doubt an expert will advise if these days that is so. Therefore if my logic is followed through we have to find another way to give us the EXTRA safety we had with more reliable hand brake - perhaps we should go back to using chocks - two house bricks.

The point you seem to have missed is it does state how to park on the flat and on hills - two diff methods - it is worth reading.

I don't see the bit about parking on the flat, can you show where that is please?

I will reply on the basis that you do not understand rather than you just being ostropolous. You will see quite clearly ,in the highway code,reference to "parking

214" - Quote - you must apply the handbrake -End Q. This part is generally accepted by those with some intelligence as to mean on the flat/level/slight incline (not on hills).If you have to ask - is this a hill? you park in gear. Then it refers to Parking on hills 226 and the use of gears in addition to handbrake. There are two separate entries one 226 distinctly refers to hills. I throw my hands in the air (Quel Horror) it does not actualy state "flat" in the other! What do you think the other (214) refers too?

No, I thought I was being correct.

I disagree. It says 'If you have to stop on the road side' - there is no mention of flats or hills or anything else. The Highway Code is a much more straightforward booklet than many think - they add their own interpretations and assumptions but these are *not* part of the Highway Code.

Exactly.

'If you have to stop on the road side'?

Note, also, that where the Highway Code says MUST, that is mandatory. Where it says SHOULD (in the Hills section) that is advisory.

To be honest, I would not really expect the Highway Code to go in to too much detail regarding parking *in gear* because many cars cannot be left effectively *in gear* - like most automatics.

I have to also say that I disagree with the Highway Code in the hills section where it says park in forward when facing uphill and reverse when facing downhill. If your handbrake slips, this may cause the engine to be turned slightly in the wrong direction and I have heard tales of this breaking parts in the head or cam drives (IIRC) of some older engine designs so I prefer to reverse the rule and will, no doubt, go to hell as a result.

[...]

"use 'park' if your car has an automatic gearbox."

Any thoughts on why the HWC says this?

Chris

But that's not a good reason to not leave the car in gear. It's just a good reason to use the handbrake.

*You* are now saying..I was told years ago when learning to drive.

No, two layers of safety are to be used at all times - I don't see the problem.

You can tell yours what you want but I've never spoken to mine!

Cars that have slipped downhill on handbrakes have been passing MOTs for years and are still being made, in my experience.

For the last couple of years, I have always parked on hills and I would say that the handbrake has fully held in over 99% of the times it was applied. On only two occasions, have I found the car resting a little on the gears. Is my handbrake unreliable then? There are many things that people consider *reliable* that have failure rates worse than this. However, I would not have liked it if my car had run down the hill on those two occasions but my parking technique is much closer to a theoretical 100% reliability than just a handbrake of any description. I would expect that my disk handbrake reliability experience will be similar to others with disk handbrakes.

Autos don't need to be left in gear - "Park" is much more effective than most handbrakes. My Merc auto has a foot-operated parking brake. It passed the MOT not long ago - but that still doesn't stop me from forgetting to release the bloody thing and driving a couple of miles with it on, it's that "efficient" ;-)

"Park", OTOH... try pushing the car with that engaged!

Yep..I was being specific about the *term* *in gear* though. The autos I've driven (something I did for my first 12 years of driving) just jammed something in the gearbox to lock it up rather than put it in gear with a clutch closed. For example, none were secure if left in drive (D) with no handbrake and the engine not running.

I really don't know..there is usually a good reason (or better outcome based on a balance of issues) for things being said the way they are in the Highway Code.

Think elderly diesels...

Chris