Paging Meatball Turbo

In news:1gfp1o1.igvmhj15eb2zvN% snipped-for-privacy@italiancar.co.uk, SteveH decided to enlighten our sheltered souls with a rant as follows

as long as it's not a 1.8, it might actually be worth having...

I hate ads that don't actually tell you what bloody model it is.

I'm pretty sure that a 1.8 of that age would have carbs. The 1.8IE came later.

Must be a 2lt, as the 1.8 was only ever offered as a single-spark lump in the 75.

Oh aye. I'm having what can only be termed "a thick day"....

2:0 to the Taffy Manc :-D

Suppose it's better than being called a Mancy Taff ;-)

In article , snipped-for-privacy@italiancar.co.uk spouted forth into uk.rec.cars.modifications...

It does look nice but 4 points.

1) It's white, Ewwwwww, had enough of white cars after the favorit. 2) It's in London, bit of a distance away, but if I won, I guess I culd get a train ride. Bit far to arrange inspection and a testdrive though. 3) I have to sell the Saab before I look for another motor, so I have space. 4) I'm at a difficult decission, Alfa 75 or Gen 4 Prelude. Both fantastic looking motors, both pretty good drive wise, both pretty good rust wise, both with great engines, one FWD one RWD, and both "not the norm" looks wise too.

You're considering a tatty old Alfa, over a Honda Prelude ?

Does the Alfa have *anything* in it's favour ? Hell, it doesn't even look nice !

+Rear wheel drive, rear mounted transaxle (nice front rear), bullet proof camchain twinspart 2 litre engine, galvanised shell, modern fuel injection, Slightly wonky styling (I like to think distinctive), LE models have recaros, nice engine sound, cheap to buy for what you get if you find a good one.

-Some shady electrics, slightly wonky styling (I like to think distinctive), pretty tricky to do some weird and odd jobs.

And that 'bulletproof' Alfa engine has 150,000 miles... Along with the rest of the car. Think of it this way, you are driving through a part of town you REALLY don't want to break down in, 150k mile Alfa or 150k mile Honda?

So you're going for the Honda then ?

MeatballTurbo raved thus:

:: In article , snipped-for-privacy@Somewhere.Somewhere :: says... ::: MeatballTurbo wrote: :::: 4) I'm at a difficult decission, Alfa 75 or Gen 4 Prelude. Both :::: fantastic looking motors, both pretty good drive wise, both pretty :::: good rust wise, both with great engines, one FWD one RWD, and both :::: "not the norm" looks wise too. ::: ::: You're considering a tatty old Alfa, over a Honda Prelude ? ::: ::: Does the Alfa have *anything* in it's favour ? Hell, it doesn't ::: even look nice ! ::: ::: :: +Rear wheel drive, rear mounted transaxle (nice front rear), bullet :: proof camchain twinspart 2 litre engine, galvanised shell, modern :: fuel injection, Slightly wonky styling (I like to think :: distinctive), LE :: models have recaros, nice engine sound, cheap to buy for what you :: get if you find a good one. :: -Some shady electrics, slightly wonky styling (I like to think :: distinctive), pretty tricky to do some weird and odd jobs.

Get the Merc he's selling!

Nah, I need something better on fuel than the turbo. Both the Alfa and the honda should be nicer on fuel once I've removed the need to stare at the boost gauge peaking on red. if fuel wasn't the issue, it would probably be a 3.0 V6 Alfa 75.

Engine wise, at 150k, all things service wise being equal, i would trust the camchain and electro mechanic variable timing over the cambelt and electronic chip operated variable timing of the honda anytime.

Motors/servos are simple devices, and can be repaired/jury rigged by any electrican, electronics are expensive and usually will only interface with factory parts.

if you are in an area where you don't want to break down in, which would you rather break down in? A car that looks like a high performance sports coupe, or what looks like an interestingly badged old 4 door saloon? the alfa doesn't look sporty too much, and so is less desirable to be seen in, so is less likley to be roken into.

Both would be arround the same age (92 model Alfa, 93-96 for the Prelude) so not much in it condition wise. The alfa may even have less rust than the similar aged Honda.

and 150 HP but the downpipes of the exhaust are rather vulnerable. Too fast over a speedbump will smash them.

Stay away from the 3.0 V6 : they are heavy on the steering and only a bit more powerfull than the 2.O Twin spark.

If you've got money burning a hole in your pocket: some 75 Turbo do still exist and they can be made reliable now and decently tuned will deliver up to 300 HP.

Yep: check the spare wheel well: if there is no rust there, the car is clean.

Bosch Motronic and the chipped versions do exist. If you find them, they go now for silly money. Don't go over 7000 RPM as rev-limit though.

Standard limited slip dif, overall good traction due to Watt-linkage, RWD. Sprints from 0 to 100 kph in about 7 sec. The lightened flywheels (on at the engine side and one in the gearbox) will chop about 0.3 seconds off of that time.

Transmission is part of the charm with that long throw gearlever but it is not as slow as it seems.

Yep: the handbrake is kinky. :)

As for electrics: some Italian put the relais for the ventilator hidden somewhere in the front right wing. Contact (doors, boot,) will corrode but if you shortcircuit them they never will give trouble. Electric windows and roof don't give any problems.

If you experience cutouts on the engine and several alfa specialists do not find the cause: change the spark plug wiring (yep all 10 of them)

I've had two of them (I still got the engine of number 2 which I totalled it on black ice).

My second 75 was almost standard on the exception of a lighted flywheels and nylon bushes in stead of rubber on the shocks. The 75 is a real sleeper but at speed something cleans the way for you.

Driven in anger it behaves very nice and tail-out driving is very controlable with throttle and slight steering corrections. On the other hand: drive it with respect because when if driven by a moron, it can and will snap at any speed.

Both my 75's proved that they were secure cars: my brother escaped mayor injury crashing into a rolled american SUV and I went with the second one through 2 brick garden walls.

Plenty or room for 4-5 people but rear seaters are easily scared (never understood why)

One thing of caution: in the drivetrain are rubber donuts. Check them regulary for cracks. I lost one during a red light sprint with a Saab Turbo and was immediatly in high vibrations country. Still won though :)

Prelude is nice, AR 75 beats it by a mile. Hell, I even want one back!

Tom De Moor

To add to that:

Check the arches (especially the rears) under the plastic bodykit - one of mine has totally disintergrated under there. Repair panels are available, and will be fitted.

Also check under the rear lights - where they wraparound the side of the body - the nearside particularly seems to have issues with corrosion.

Finally - where the rear arches join the sills, I have a small hole in the offside inside the doorshut.

Nothing major or structural, and you can't even see 2 of those areas, but it's worth checking.

Cheers Tom and Steve.

Really can't decide which I want now. Love the look and sound of the Alfa, but the VTEC Prelude has it's charms too, weird stuff like the 4WS almost makes up for the lack of

4WD, and freaky starwars 90's dash.

Can't really decide, Missus definatley prefers the looks and styling of the Honda over the Alfa.

Don't want another turbo car for a while. A little less power for now would be a good think, especially if it handles well and I can make full use of what is there on the bends more often, and both the Alfa and the Honda have reps for good handling.

I've chatted to people on both Alfa and Prelude enthusiast site about both models, Natch they are always the best, but in both cases, i've had people say, yeah, Had a Saab Turbo T16 and it was great, but not a patch on the 75/Prelude.

Guess I've picked two equally good, but very different cars.

I guess my heart is saying Alfa 75, but my head (which I should listen too once in while when spending money on a car) is saying get the Honda, they live for ever, they run for miles on a thimble, and they hold their price. And it is fast too.

Aaaaaaarrrrghhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

The Alfa will live forever, and is surprisingly economical - that VVT trickery and only 8 valves sees to that.

As for price - there's only one of the two that's destined to be an 'appreciating classic' - just look at what minters are advertised for in the Italian specialist press.

When in doubt, never punish yourself. Get them both.

Seems a joke but it isn't.

If that black Saab Turbo (pictures on the Net with the paint job and fiddling was yours and I think it was) then you are more than qualified for solutioning any problem with both cars.

Selling the one you don't quite fancy should leave you with some money.

Alfa spares cheaper than Honda though.

Good luck!

Tom De Moor

What, people advertise Honda Preludes in Italian car magazines? :-)

How about AndrewR's *guaranteed* future classic, or your money back?

Peter

In article , snipped-for-privacy@removethis.hotmail.com spouted forth into uk.rec.cars.modifications...

Wish I could keep the Saab as a project/track/fun car, but can't. Only room for one car, no other parking nearby that isn't subject to a weekly scattering of window glass.

Oh I know, would be an ideal world scenario, but unfortunatley I don't live in an ideal world, I live in Warrington.

Nah, that is Matt's car. And with what he has done, I don't think I could run that as a daily driver.

Not sure about things like. Honda stuff is still pretty common, and normal stuff can easily be picked up quite commonly for the Honda (more than just service bits) from mainstream places like Halfords, or better Auto factors, rather than having to go to Alfa, or specialists by mailorder. And the bonus that some of the underbonnet rice tuner stuff is actually cheaper than factory stuff, better quality and available in most neddy car spares shops makes it even better, as my insurance pretty much has a "No premium increase for mods as long as you document it, and they will be covered, just don't increase the engine size/swap engine". I've even seem people go for remapped ecus, and hybrid turbos, with full exhaust systems, and headwork, no premium increase, and just document it/photo it/keep reciepts in case of a claim. Only thing they don't cover free is adding nitrous/supercharger/turbo to an NA engine, they add a little to the premium for that, but not much.

Thanks Tom. This will be hard decission to make, I think.