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95 Bonneville won't start hot

First timer....so here it goes: Our 95 Bonneville has 120k on it, always seviced (by me, a former NIASE certified mechanic back in the 70's) and a great car... BUT... it won't start after it sits from about 10 - 40 minutes. It will start within the first 10 minutes after you shut it off, and it will start if you wait 40 minutes, but you're SOL during that middle period.

I've carried a spare sparkplug along and hooked it up, grounding the threaded portion, of course, and there is no spark during that no start time.

In reading about others' problems with the same symptom, it is typically the crank position sensor. And I don't mind changing it out if indeed it's bad, although it out looks like a bear to me! (Pepboys sells them for $40 I believe).

I called the Pontiac dealer and they want $85 for diagnosis, $65 for the part, and $95 to change it (1.1 hours flat-rate), but like me, they'll have to diagnose it when it's not firing up.

After saying all of the above my questions to anyone are this.... my Haynes manual shows a "typical C3I ignition systems circuit" so is my 95 using this C3I ignition system? And...where is that damned C3I connector? so I can hook up an o'scope to it and see how much signal my crank sensor is putting out, if any at all when it's hot? And... maybe I'm barking up the wrong tree entirely? Any help and advice will be entirely welcome, as my experience from the old days did not include, for the most part, this level of complexity!! Advice on changing it out will be appreciated as well !

thanks in advance....Jeff

Reply to
JeffPauley
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Not sure exactly to 95, but I know in 98, the CKP sensor connector is behind the sensor shield, which requires removing the harmonic balancer to gain access to. You'll want to jack up the car, remove the right front wheel, and the inner fender splash shield, to pull the balancer. The good news is, that takes more than ten minutes at home! GW

Reply to
Geoff Welsh

GW,

10 minutes is about right, took about that long for my goodwrench to remove the HB when he pulled the timing cover.

========= Harryface =========

1991 Pontiac Bonneville LE 3800 V6 ( C ), Black/Slate Grey _~_~_~289,366 miles_~_~_

~_~_~_~_U.S.A._~_~_~_~_~_

~~~The Former Fleet ~~~

89 Cavalier Z 24 convertible 78 Holiday 88 coupe 68 LeSabre convertible 73 Impala sedan
Reply to
Harry Face

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"Now for the variations. The original Type 1 distributorless system just described, which first appeared on the '84 Buick 3.8L V6 Turbo, is also known as "C3I," short for "Computer Controlled Coil Ignition." There's Type

1 Fast Start, too, which is found on the well regarded GM 3800 beginning in '88. The tip-off to identifying a Type 1 DIS is that the high-tension terminals run down both sides of the coil/module assembly. You'll find the Type 2 on 3.8L SFI and certain 3300's. It has all its terminals on one side. "

Google is your friend. LOL

Reply to
FBR

Thanks for the great info... I'm most likely going to spend the $40 on a new crank sensor, pull the harmonic balance and go for it! Will update when completed.

Reply to
JeffPauley

The job is done... and all is right in our world again!! The business in the Haynes manual about "the harmonic balancer should pull off by hand" is a lot of nonsense in my case. We ended up using an air hammer set at 60 psi to "push" on the endo f the loosened crank bolt while I used a couple of small pry bars to coax the balancer off (since it has 3 slots instead of 3 threaded holes like the old days). This is a great discussion group, thanks for the advice.....jeff

Reply to
JeffPauley

Jeff:

Did your check engine light come on or did you pull any codes for this crank position sensor?

Chris

snipped-for-privacy@webtv.net wrote:

Reply to
USENET READER

It's all fixed... it was the crankshaft sensor. And from what I've read, there are no codes for the cs sensor; that having been said, the Haynes manual says I can't pull any codes on this car since it has a different setup which takes an OBD II type reader? thanks for the response, though...jeff

Reply to
JeffPauley

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