Oil Change Light- 2004 VUE

Is that your initial 5,800 miles? I have an '03 FWD V6 w/ 39k mi. Did the first oil change at 1,000 miles. I ignore that light and change the oil every 3k.

Agreed. Go every 4000 miles if you run synthetic. however the first 9000 should be changed differently because its the engines break in period.

I have been bast 7000 once, and 6000 twice. I have never actually waited for the light.

Ed

Wak215 wrote:

Waste of money.

Ed

Maybe - but an oil change costs me about $12.50 and a half-hour of my time. Can't be any easier than on a VUE.

What do you mean by different? Are you saying the oil should be changed more frequently during the first 9000 miles or less frequently?

ron

94 SL1 - considering a 2006 VUE (but only if they bring back green)

Break in period implies there will be need to change the oil more frequently. There are metal shavings, etc. from initial manufacturing that get released into the oil during break in. I've always followed a rigorous

1,000 mile schedule for the initial oil and filter change on a new vehicle and then change them again at 2,000, then every 3,000 thereafter This makes it easy to remember when the oil needs to be changed since multiples of 3000 are easy to calculate. And with 5 vehicles in the family simple is better.

Bob

Chuck wrote:

For most of my life I have been a 3000 mile oil change guy. However, except for Jiffy Lube advertising, there is no reason to think this is really extending the life of your engine. The 3000 mile oil change recommendation has been around since I can first remember (1967 or so). Cars and oil are far better now, so I can't see that the old recommendation is sensible. I have family examples that indicate to me that I have always been too conservative. I have two Sisters who really don't care about cars. My older Sister is particularly disinterested in automobile maintenance. In the past she had her oil changed whenever I complained about her lack of car care (and I actually did the change). Her current Honda at least reminds her to change the oil with an odometer driven indicator. It goes red every 7500 miles. When this happens, she will actually tell me that her oil needs changing. Despite this, and her mostly stop and go driving pattern, she has never had any sort of engine problem related to oil (current 8 year old Honda's is over 110,000 miles). My other Sister does follow the published maintenance schedules and has the work done at the dealers. Likewise, she has never had any sort of problem related to engine oil. Her previous cars all made it well past 130k miles. Finally, we have a small farm. I have always changed the oil in the farm tractors based on engine hours, at the manufacturer's recommended intervals. Two of the three tractors specify 150 hours. I think this is roughly equivalent to 5000 miles (150 hours at 35 mph = 5250 miles). The engines in farm tractors are worked much harder on average than automobile engines (but they are also well built diesels). Despite this none of our tractors has ever had an oil related engine failure. The older tractor (24 years old) now has over 7000 hours (roughly equivalent to

250,000 miles) and still runs well (and has the original turbo).

I really like the idea that my Vue has an indicator that calculates oil life based on more than just miles. I've always though the normal and severe service definitions were fuzzy and open to a lot of interpretation. This is why I change the oil in my Ford every 3000 miles (Ford severe service schedule). I honestly do not think I am doing severe service, but the line is fuzzy. The Vue handles this for me. I am confident that as long as I change my oil at least as often as the light tell me to, I am fulfilling my warranty requirements and not reducing the life of my engine.

I do agree that the Vue is one of the easiest cars I've ever had to change the oil on. I can do it in 15 minutes or so. Still, if it is not saving you any money in the long run, why double up on the oil changes? Assuming you are going to keep your Vue for 150,000 miles, 3000 mile oil changes instead of 6000 mile oil changes will cost you an extra $300 and 6 hours of your life. Unless there is some saving associated with this, which I doubt there will be, is the feeling of accomplishment or peace of mind really worth and extra $300 and 6 hours every few years? If the answer is yes, then I can understand why you change the oil so often. For me the 3000 mile oil changes is a hard habit to break, but at least in the case of the Vue, GM gave me a good reason to break it.

Ed

I think this very much depends on the specific engine and its design. There are some engines on the market that are known to be more susceptible to oil feed and return passages plugging up if the oil is not changed very frequently. There are other designs that seem to be much more forgiving. The problem is that if you purchase a newer engine that has no previous history, then you have no way of knowing if it is truly "better" as you assume all newer engines are in your statement below. I personally think being safer is less expensive in the long run.

Examples of two different engines from the same manufacturer (Chrysler) that have completely different histories on their internal reliability are the

3.3L V6 and the 2.7L V6. Note that the newer design (the 2.7L V6) is the > > >

The chain oiler passage on 1.9's is susceptible to clogging and starving the timing chain. Would anyone recommend 7k oil changes on one of those? How do you know what motor oil everyone in this group is using? Should anyone that doesnt use a quality motor oil go that long on their oil? Should someone living in harsh enviromental conditions and weather changes go that long? Do you know if they drive there cars hard or not? Do you know if they tow?

My point is what works fine for one person could be a disaster for another. You may think 130k out of a car is fine and thats EASY to do but I shoot for 500k. Oil and filter changes every 7k isnt going to cut it with Ohio's weather. Plus another reason 3k is the standard and should stay as such for the MAJORITY of people out there is because its the only way "problems" are caught. Some people dont know how to open their hoods and check their fluids. I've caught some VERY serious stuff doing oil changes for people. Had they kept gone any longer who knows if they would of ever made it into the shop.

Besides catching problems we have yet to see a way of measuring the life of every brand of "oil filter" on the market. When does your oil filter get bypassed? At 6000 miles I say it gets bypassed for a good 10 minutes until the oils warmed up enough to squeeze through there. Anyone mind telling me where the oil bypass light is on the dash? I have yet to see one.

Btw comparing old tractors to cars doesnt really work for a number of reasons. For one they dont rev up anywhere near 7000 rpm.

I don't recommend exceeding the vehicle manufacturer's recommended oil change intervals or using oil that does not meet the vehicle manufacturer's stated requirements. I also prefer the OE filters. In the case of the Vue I have little choice but to use the OE Filters.

I believe (but can't prove), that most of the common cases of sludging in modern engines (most notably in certain Toyota engines) are the result of a faulty design. Still, I am certain that if the manufacturer's recommendations as to oil type and change interval are followed there will be very few problems with sludge formation.

While it is true tractors don't spend much time at 7000 rpm, neither do most car engines. Most tractor engines spend significant periods of time at or near full throttle. Very few car engines do. All in all, I suspect tractors are far harder on the oil than most cars. Mine might set for weeks or even months without being started, and then be run wide open for 12 or 14 hours a day for a couple of weeks. Very few cars that aren't in the Dakar rally ever see dust like a farm tractor sees. I know it is not a perfect example, but I believe farm tractor highly stress engine oil.

Oil change intervals are generally far longer in Europe. If Vauxhall can specify 10,000 mile oil changes for their cars that use the Ecotec engine, I am confident that 7500 oil changes are OK for my Vue as long as the oil life monitor agrees (7500 is the max it will allow).

3000 mile oil changes shouldn't hurt anything but they probably aren't going to save you any money either. I know some shops really do a good job of checking things over when a car comes in for an oil change. However, from what I have seen of places like Jiffy Lube, it is far more likely that they will screw something up than that they will find a problem. The last time I used Jiffy Lube (1989) I had to forcibly stop them from pouring Type F Automatic transmission fluid into my Sable (it needed Type H aka Mercon). And even after I forced them to go get the right fluid, I had to redo the job myself to fix the transmission pan they warped by over tightening the bolts. That was the last time I let them touch one of my cars except to do a vehicle inspection.

Ed

blah blah wrote:

Full throttle on any tractor is about 2100 RPM. I cant think of any tractors/heavy equipment/semi's that would or could go above that because their torque range is built in very low. So again tractors arent comparable. There is to many variables out there to say "hey dont change your oil so often". I've seen plenty of low mileage late model cars using "modern oils" with lots of varnish and caked on deposits on their dipsticks to know they dont do regular 3k-4k oil changes. To say sludging isnt a problem any more is news to me.

Some Toyota 6 cylinder engines are another examples of cars which tend to sludge up.

I pay about $1700 per year on insurance. Why wouldn't I pay $60 a year for oil changes at 5000km/3months.

You say you know "they don't do regular 3k-4k oil changes" but what makes you think they changed them inside the manufacturer's recommended interval? As I said before, I don't believe you should exceed the manufacturer's recommended interval. I did not mean to imply you can go forever without changing oil. In the case of my Vue, I am now at 29,000 miles. I changed the oil once at 1000 miles (old habit), again at 7500 miles, again at around 14,000 miles, again at around 20,000 miles, and the last time at approximately 27,000 miles. In all cases the oil that came out looked good. I have no ugly deposits on the dip stick. What I can see inside the valve cover looks nice and clean. I have not actually waited for the "change oil soon" light to come on. I intend to wait for it, but it seems that I always find a reason for changing it early (free weekend, trip coming up, etc.).

Ed

How do you know this? What makes you think that you would have had more problems if you had followed the manufacturer's oil change intervals? At least with insurance there are some statistics that let you evaluate the cost, risk, and rewards. You are claiming a reward based on a lack of knowledge. Except for my Vue, I change the oil in my vehicles according to the severe service schedule. I do this becasue I really don't know what severe service is. I doubt that I really need to do this, but at least I can point to some back-up for the decision. The Vue's oil life monitor actually takes into account my driving pattern to calculate an oil change intervals. This removes much of the uncertainty. Why wouldn't you take advantage of this feature? Do you think GM has some secret agenda? What is the benefit to GM of stretching out oil change intervals? Fewer oil change jobs for their dealers? Fewer filters sold? Unhappy Customers becasue engines failed prematurely?

When was the last time you had an oil related failure? I can't think of a single example of me, anyone in my family, or even a close friend who has had an oil related failure in the last 20 years. The last one I am persoanlly familar with was a co-worker who had a 1978 Oldsmobile 350. He followed the GM oil change intervals to the letter - changed the oil every 7500 miles and the filter every other oil change. He used Quaker State 10W40. When the car got around 60k miles he had to replace several rocker arms. Apparently this was a common problem on this engine. While we was working on the engine, he removed the intake and cleanded out the lifter valley. It was full of some sort of waxy mess. After that, he switched to Havoline, continued with his old 7500 mile oil change routine and never had another problem. Whether his problem was the oil, the engine, or the fact that he probably should have followed the severe service schedule (he drove 2 miles to work one way - lots of short trips), I can't say for certain. However this co-worker hasn't had a problem again with his engines despite sticking to the "normal" oil change intervals.

Ed

I've had oil related failures with a couple of my 15 cars in the past. My father was a mechanic so while working with him I've seen lots of other engines that were the victim of neglect as well.

I didn't say you were wrong to extend the period between oil changes or to trust the Vue's monitor. My point was that if I'm paying 1700 a year for insurance plus another $300 a month for the car itself why not dig deep and find $5 a month to pay for oil changes whether it needs it or not. I clean the dust out of my computer every month too. Sorry if I like to be cautious.

Another reason I like to keep it new is mileage. My girlfriend has the same car, same engine, same year with about 5000km more on her odometer. Her oil changes are much less frequent than mine. I average 14.5km/L (34mpg) while she gets about 13km/L (30mpg). Granted there may be other factors there like driving style, highway vs city, etc...but at $0.94 per litre(44% of our gas is tax) $3.55 a gallon (2.84 USD at current exchange rate) if I can get any improvment to fuel efficiency I'll take it.

Saturn S Series

Why regular oil changes are a must and why you should ignore the "oil change light".

-Oil pressure is used as hydraulic fluid to ratchet up the timing chain tensioner.

-If varnish forms in the timing chain tensioner bore then this system can fail and the chain will become loose and eventually break.

Mechanics see the issues related to automakers "prolonged service intervals" every day. When people giving advice on oil actually work on cars for a living or pass the 500,000 mile mark on their odometer and still have as much pep in their engines as when they were new maybe then I'll listen to their "opinions".