Crossover vehicle revolution?

Looking only at the pic (am in the middle of lesson plans), either she's a tiny itsy-bitsy item, or that vehicle's *huge*.

Cathy

Poor Melisa Sunderman... having to handle that big old Saturn all by herself. I bet her wrist break trying to turn it.

"GoMavs" ...

Like Cathy said, that thing looks huge. I don't see it as a "crossover" so much as just another big, honking SUV

Natalie

Interesting. It mentions the Rav4 as being the first model in the Crossover models. I guess it was: it was a Celica drivetrain with a body along the lines of the Jeep CJ.

I never drove one, except for the newer ones, and those are bloated compared to the original. It's about the size of the original 4-Runner now; the 4-Runner is about the size of an 80's LandCruiser wagon, and the LandCruiser is about the size of an Abrams...

I guess it depend on which size car chassis on which the crossover was designed. Small, medium or large and how many passengers one needs to transport LOL

mike

The Japs, like domestic manufactures, know most American buyer prefer larger vehicles. That is why todays Corolla is larger than the Camry of old and todays Camry is almost as big as domestic family cars ;)

mike

4700 pounds, more cargo space than a 2007 Tahoe.

"They wanted something smaller, more nimble..."

My ass...

Yup, a big, honking SUV.

Guess she was happy with her delusion.

Natalie

It seems to me that many of the new "Crossovers" are just mini vans by another name. The biggest difference between the traditional min van and many of the "Crossovers" is that the mini vans have sliding doors, and the Crossovers have conventional doors. The Ford Edge, Lincoln MKX, Toyota RAV4, Toyota Highlander, Saturn Vue, Saturn Outlook, Buick Enclave, Mazda CX7, Mazda CX9, Lexus RX350, etc., etc. are just thinly disguised mini vans not encumbered by the mini van moniker and with AWD options. The Ford Taurus X (aka Ford Freestyle) is little more than a station wagon version of the Taurus (aka Ford Five Hundred). This doesn't make them bad It just shows how easily people are swayed by marketing hype. People that wouldn't touch a mini van because of the association with "soccer moms" and wimps are lining up to buy "Crossovers."

I am not saying there is anything wrong with Crossovers. The SO has a RAV4 and it is a very nice vehicle. To me there is very little difference between it and the Plymouth Grand Voyager it replaced. The biggest difference is that the RAV4 is smaller, looks cheaper inside, and is nosier on the highway (the RAV4 is a 4 cylinder base model). I see a lot of Ford Edges around town now. They look nice, but to me they are just mini vans based on the Fusion hardware. I have a had deciding why I would want one instead of either a Fusion or an Explorer. It is bigger and uses more gas than a Fusion, and it can't tow nearly as much as an Explorer. Fortunately for Ford, others don't see it my way. When I asked the SO why she wanted a RAV4 instead of a Camry, she said she liked sitting up higher. I guess this is the one great advantage of Crossovers, in a world filled with SUVs and pick-ups, you need a tall vehicle to see the road.

Ed

"Ed White" ...

Maybe my perspective is skewed, but the Rav looks quite a bit smaller than a minivan.

I like sitting higher up, too, but I have trouble controlling the roll. My Echo sits a bit higher (which is why my mother-in-law preferred riding in my car, vs. hubby's Corolla), but not as high as an SUV.

Natalie

The newer Corollas (& Matrixes) sit up considerably higher than they used to. Plus the driver's seat has a height adjuster - which I have at its highest position, to boot. Makes it even easier to get in & out of. When I first got this Corolla ('04), I felt like I was stitting in a LR armchair! But as you say, still not anything as high as an SUV, even a RAV 4.

Cathy

Which mini-van? The current RAV4 is a lot larger than the older models - they even have a third seat option. A RAV4 is shorther than a early Sienna, but longer thean an older Plymouth Voyager.

2001 Sienna Exterior Length 193.5 " Wheelbase 114 " 2008 RAV4

Exterior Length 181.1 " Wheelbase 105 "

1995 Plymouth Voyager

Exterior Length 178.1 " Wheelbase 112 " wheelbase

Ed

"Ed White" ...

Maybe I haven't seen the latest Ravs.

Natalie

True, but the LandCruiser will go *much* further on a gallon of gas. On the other hand, the Abrams parks anywhere it damned well pleases...

That's the short version of the Voyager, isn't it?

I looked a few items up. I tried to pick equivalent models and configs (like, all AWD's for the SUVs) (fixed font will work better, I used tabs)

Model L x W x H wt wb '00 Rav4 163.8x66.7x65 2844 94.9 '08 Rav4 181.1x71.5x66.3 3444 104.7 '01 Sienna 193.5x73.4x67.3 3700* '08 Sienna 200x77.4x68.9 4270 '04 Highlander 184.6x71.9X66.5 3750 106.9 '08 Highlander 188.4x75.2x69.3 3979 109.8

'08 Outlook 200.7x78.2x72.8 4900 '04 Sat Vue 181.3x71.5x66.5 3381 '08 Sat Vue 180.1x72.8x67 4325

'04 Gr Caravan 200.5x78.6x68.9 3993 119.3 '07 Gr Caravan 200.6x78.6x68.8 4183 119.3 '08 Gr Caravan 202.5x76.9x68.9 4321 121.2

• - from memory - may not be entirely accurate. We actually weighed the car when we bought some rocks.

Conclusion: Everyone's getting porkier.

Saturn's overall porkiness is astonishing; they *used* to be a company that practical little cars. There is nothing "little" or even mid-sized about that Outlook.

I would have considered a Highlander to be a CUV. It's certainly a much lighter vehicle than the Outlook. That Outlook - that's just plain full-sized.