Thermostat

I live in Minnesota. It gets cold here. The thermostat is quite important so that the engine warms up. I wish VW had not discontinued the manual flap lever.

I'm in Idaho, where this year it is not nearly as cold as MN, but still in the 30 and 40s most of the time right now.

The VW is kept in a heated garage and so starts out warmer than the outside ambient air. I still would feel better, though, if everything was working as designed...

VW didn't include the thermostat system as an option. They developed it as a means to get the engine up to operating temperature in the shortest time required. And, since rebuilders have been tossing the thermostat, bracket, rod, and air vanes into boxes for the past ~20 years, you should have no problem in locating the parts.

A functioning thermostat/air vane system will help give you the longest service life fom your new engine. Along with the usual maintenance items such as frequent oil changes and valve adjustments.

I think you're absolutely right, and that's why I intend to get the system back in operation this weekend.

It is noteworthy that the OEM new engines don't even have a hole or stud in place to accomodate the thermostat bracket. I don't know if that means that the component was omitted from the later Latin bugs.

Didn't the later SA Bugs control warm-up through the fuel injection? No flaps?

Now that you mention it, yes, the later ones were probably all fuel injected, so they wouldn't need the thermo for warm-up. I do wonder, though how much the thermostat regulated engine temperature at all times under all operating conditions, as opposed to just the warm-up?

Actually, I have trouble following how anything they might do with the FI would help the engine warm up quicker. Enriching the mixture will help it RUN much like the choke on a carb. But that doesn't make it warm up any quicker.

It may have more to do with the generally warmer climate in South America. They don't have to deal with cold weather as experienced in Berlin or Minessota.

Max

Brazil never gets below 20degres celsius. In Sao Paulo I once had a driver get to pick me up 1 and one half hour late and his excuse was that it was too cold to get out of bed. I was 20 degrees Celsius :)

enriching the mixture is only needed for the initial start....after the engine starts a rich mixture is not needed...in a carburetted engine the rich mixture is needed usually because the cold air and fuel will not stay mixed well and the fuel falls out of suspension....the fuel injection does not suffer from this....

I bought a Brazillian made longblock a couple years ago from CB Performance. Intersting engine as it had no provisions for the bellows and it came with tin work that wrapped around the underside of the cylinders making it impossible ot attatch the usual splash tin that protects the push rod tubes. I wonder if those tins were designed to deflect the air in such a way that it makes the engine run cooler. It is by far the coolest running engine I have had and since I live in So Cal where it is seldom below 50 F even in the winter that is an important consideration.

--Dan E

Both Mexico and Brazil discontinued the thermostat when they introduced the Digifant FI systems on their Type 1 & 2 models. These vehicles are designed to run at temperatures below freezing, but I can't say how far below. Since the Digifant system will control both mixture and ignition, it can produce the conditions that cause the engine to warm up properly from cold, without the assistance of the thermostat. In Mexico, where the climate is colder, their FI engines also ran hydraulic lifters which, amongst other things, removed much of the expansion problems associated with warm up. Although the carburettor replacement engines now come without the thermostat stud etc, they were never run that way from the factory and they should not be run that way, even in warmer climates.

Try to actuelly read the message you respond to! The mentioning was manual lever..

J.

Yup.

J.

I can tell you what happens if you remove the thermo "Ring" from a 30hp engine and run it in cold winter climate. In my younger days I read "How to Hot Rod VW Engines" several times after I got hold of it,(My first long read related to VW was Muir, long before I ever got a VW). It overcools the engine, so the pistons seizes.. But the book said so!! Ofcause related to californication, and somewher you have to start to learn right?

The pistons doing their job expands, the cylinders being cooled on full whack becomes to tight, and you have a seizure on your hands....

J.

You lean it, to the extent it barely runs, plus decreases the amount of pre-ignition to the after top dead center!

J.

Those of you that have been here a while know my thoughts on thermostats which came from VW trained techs in the mid 60's. Anyway, The thermostat coils look good in the baggies on my shelf. Just my opinion of course.

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You write that the new SA OEM engines shoulf "never be run that way..." does that mean leave the thermo mechanism off?

Exactly. And none of that make the engine warm up any quicker.

Max

Thanks to all who responded.

I dismantled my accessory section sufficient to raise the fan shroud and re-installed the thermostat pushrod onto the flap actuator, rplace everything, installed the thermo and drove it a few miles to see that the thermostat expanded and moved the flaps. All is in order now.

Randall Brink