OT -- Looking to upgrade Computer

Page 3 of 5  
In response to Craig C. 's post. I thought everyone should know:


linux could run on the system if some open source developer took a desire to build a kernel to boot the apple hardware. wiether or not the software is open to be developed competitively by other companies or not has no bearing on that particular issue.
sorry Craig i have to disagree with your stance there bud.
--
Chris

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Chris Thompson wrote:

What is it specifically that you think you *can't* do with Apple hardware that you can supposedly do with the system you originally posted about?
Craig C.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Craig C. wrote:

Clone it. Anyone can produce an Intel based PC that can run Windows. Only Apple can make a PC that can run Apples OS. Anyone who makes a PC with a firewire port must pay Apple royalties. Not so with USB which is open hardware.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Craig C. wrote:

Say what??? You have no clue what 'closed' or 'proprietary' mean. There have been 3rd party software developers for Apple computers since the days of the Apple II+. Every Apple since has been 100% proprietary. With the Apple II+ there were some clones such as the Franklin but Apple sued their ass and won...why? Because Apple computers have ALWAYS been 100% closed hardware. Nobody can clone an Apple legally without paying Apple royalties.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
miles wrote:

Well now, that depends on YOUR definition of 'closed'. As in the past, you argue YOUR definitions even when they don't make any sense at all.
MY definition of a closed system is this: XYZ company creates a machine (hardware) and the software to run the machine (OS). No other OS is capable of running this hardware. The OS isn't capable of running any other hardware either. Like ... Apple used to be or the IBM System 36, AS/400 etc.
That is clearly no longer the case with the Mac. The hardware runs multiple OS's NATIVELY (without OS X). Furthermore, MAC OS X will run on a PC clone. Therefore, whether Apple wants it or not, their OS is and can run hardware that they do not get royalties from.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OSx86
Regarding your comments about Firewire or IEEE 1394, it was created by Apple, TI, Sony, DEC and IBM as a replacement to SCSI. Seagate and Western Digital were in on the technology as well. So, miles, it isn't just big, bad Apple trying to rape the consumer. They put a lot of development efforts into IEEE 1394 and they deserve payment. Don't like it, don't use it. Simple. Easy. So stop whining. I have NEVER seen a product that was Firewire only. There is always a USB version. Additionally, Apple has indicated that even they are pulling away from Firewire and going with USB.
Craig C.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

how about have a system for under a grand.....hell i could probably have more system than i would need for under $500. most the boards i would consider sell with processor included in the $100 to 150 range throw in a nvidia card for around 20 to 50 bucks (i don't play games so i don't need a high end card) and that's assuming the board doesn't come with nvidia graphics on it already. a NIC is what 20 to 50 depending on the quality or whether it wired or not (again if not already on the board)....i might go with wireless if i found a card priced right, remember I'm a cheap ass and this is gonna be on the desk where the router sits so wireless wouldn't be a have to have. I've got keyboards and monitors all over so they are 0 cost. as far as memory DDR2 is selling for roughly $40 a gig and a 500 gig hard disk can be had for the $100 to $150 range (unless you just want the latest and greatest then they are round 500 - 600 but again, I'm a cheap ass)
so lets see
the board in question was $100 4 gig of memory to max it out would be $160 a seagate sata-300 hard disk is $120 a nvidia card (no video on the board) $50 bucks at walmart (actually i paid $20 for the last one at wal-mart)
and keep my monitor, case, power-supply, keyboard and trac-ball so that's 0 cost.
for around $430 i just theoretically built a bigger system than i really need.
when the link you posted shows a "Mac-Pro" I'm sure its a nice machine heck it better be for the price listed on the link below.
http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPLE/WebObjects/AppleStore.woa/wa/RSLID?nnmm=browse&mco 177546&node=home/desktop/mac_pro
$2499 or as low as $59 a month is what it says....sheesh!
in 8 months the system i just theoretically built is paid for in full. at that rate. but the mac (assuming no tax or interest) gets paid off in 43 months. witch by that time we all know a computer would be "out dated" quite considerably, it would be where my current socket A is at the moment. still usable but not near what everyone else is running at that time.
sorry bud, i know you love your mac. but they are way overpriced for my needs.
--
Chris

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Chris Thompson wrote:

Well, you never said (at least I don't remember) that money was a major factor.
Apple is "proud" of their product. It's just like a car/truck, if you have the skills to rebuild and maintain a clunker into a viable vehicle, you will always come out further ahead than buying one off the showroom floor.
I have a 1.8 ghz, 1 gig ram, 256 mb nvidia IBM Think Station that has spent less than 10 hours powered up.
I'd be happy to help a fellow student out, if you're interested.

No argument there.
Craig C.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Craig C. wrote:

Wrong. Apple OS has been run on other computers. The Apple II+ was cloned by many companies until Apple sued them and won...because they produced a closed system. There have been OS9 clone computers as well sold overseas. Apple fought them and production has pretty much been shut down.
The IBM's you mention were cloned by companies such as ITEL. The latter ran an OS called MUSIC which would run native apps designed for the IBM.

Never said they didn't deserve it. But it's a technology that isn't taking off very fast. USB 2 keeps up with Firewire and doesn't require a manufacture to pay anyone any royalties. It's an open platform.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
miles wrote:

So then, your definition of a closed system has now been modified to: a set of hardware or software that has an owner and therefore legal rights to the hardware/software?
So, Red Hat Linux is "closed" then, right? Based on an open system, but has elements/applications that are closed.
Pardon me, but I *completely* disagree that your "open" systems are superior as you state. They are prone to hacks and mods by would-be programmers. You'd be hard pressed to convince any rational human that a "miles" open system is superior to anything greater than a tricycle.
Version control alone, on your "open" system, would sink a company.

It's a technology that isn't taking off at all. That's why Apple has begun to abandon it. I'm puzzled as to why you find the topic of Firewire worthy of debating. It's just another technology that didn't take off. There are thousands of examples that fit your definition of both "open" and "closed" systems that never took off.
Craig C.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Craig C. wrote:

Modified? Thats exactly what a closed platform is. A company owns the rights to the hardware. Anyone who wishes to develop pays Apple for that right. There are no Apple clones because its not an open platform.

Say what? A better analogy would be a 100% clone of of SCO Unix thats legally available. It doesn't exist. Why?

More prone to hacks and mods? Is that good or bad?

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
In response to miles 's post. I thought everyone should know:

Personally its Debian or a debian derivative (Kubuntu). and yes i would put a debian etch server install against solaris any day of the week.
the 2.6.x kernel is EXTREEMLY stable and reliable.
--
Chris

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Chris Thompson wrote:

As long as you aren't head of the I/T group at any of the financial institutions I use, more power to ya.
Craig C.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Though I know right off that the transgender troll will end up jumping all over my posting because he/she/it has nothing better to do, I will reply anyway.
I have always used ABIT, ASUS or GigaByte mainboards with no issues in my own systems or ones I have built for customers.
If you are going to stick with AMD for your CPU, I would go with a slightly "slower" dual core, vice the slightly "faster" single core.
I also use XFX video cards with great results, they are factory O.C.'d and come with a great warranty should you ever need it. It is also SLI capable and PCI-e based.
Stay with the SATA 3.0 drive man.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
In response to azwiley1 's post. I thought everyone should know:

thanks for you input larry and yes i plan to stick with the AMD platform i have had extremely good luck/experience with the AMD products so far.
--
Chris

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

I would definately stay with a dual core than, it just makes more sense.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Probably because AMD builds a superior product.
--
If at first you don't succeed, you're not cut out for skydiving



Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

How so?
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
punkin:

Edith's being quiet again. He never bothers you anyway, don't fret about it.

Of course.

False. You were confounded by your AN7's SATA drive problem, thought you needed to reflash the BIOS over and over again. Thought everybody needed to, in fact. TBag helped you out.

Crissy settled on one of the slightly "slower" single cores for yesterday's socket 939. That AMD Athlon 64 3500+ is worth a measly $40 at newegg. It won't be faster than my old socket A. Newegg has a couple slightly "faster" dual core Athlon 64 X2 4200+ / ASUS 939 bundles for about $110.
Lots more of the socket AM2 stuff offered though. Only ten socket 939 processors are listed, while there are fifty for AM2. I'd look for socket AM2, and DDR2 memory, if I were shopping now.

You switched from "they" to "it" and said XFX cards are SLI capable and PCI-e.

Yeah man.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
In response to Beryl 's post. I thought everyone should know:

one its not Crissy, i have not had any sort of pissing match with you to date so get your shit straight. if you want to play that childish name game with someone who cares to piss back at you go right ahead but leave me out of that shit. i dont have time for it.
that is merely one board i am looking at, cost is a factor and yes i can be a cheap ass when it comes to computer hardware, nothing wrong with that. this socket A was a discount model when i bought it and has served me well over the years. infact i'd still use it past the time i upgrade if it wasnt for my school and my wife wanting her own computer so she can still check her email while i do my school work.
and yes i have a few dual core AM2 sockets i am considering but they are made by MSI a manufacturer i have experiance with and trust, so no need to question the reputation of them.
the question was mainly over the motherboard's manufacturer itself. something no one has touched on, not even the self proclaimed net nanny Beryl.
BTW are you the same Beryl i see in the linux group from time to time?
--
Chris

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Chris Thompson wrote:

What are you going to school for? I'm taking this semester off for the first time in a very long time. I'll start back again in the spring.

Never trust a guy that names himself after a soft mineral with poor cleavage. <geology joke>
I wonder what variety he claims to be? I'm guessing morganite. It's pink.
:-) Craig C.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Related Threads

    Motorsforum.com is a website by car enthusiasts for car enthusiasts. It is not affiliated with any of the car or spare part manufacturers or car dealers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.